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EV Prius

Discussion in 'Generation 1 Prius Discussion' started by evrandy, Nov 14, 2009.

  1. evrandy

    evrandy Electric Prius

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    I just bought my first two Prius cars.
    First one is a 2001 and the second is a 2003 for $750 each.
    They both run but I have not had them on the road yet.
    I was told they did not run and had thought that one of them would make a good conversion to pure electric since that's what we do.
    Since they run I might do one as a PHEV. Are these older cars capable of the EV only modification like the 04?

    Thanks
    Randy
     
    #1 evrandy, Nov 14, 2009
  2. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Not easily. You kinda have to drive it with error lights on. The easiest way is to put a relay in the fuel pump circuit. Once the fuel pump stops running, you'll get error lights but can move about on traction battery power until it gets too low. Then you really need someway to clear the error codes.

    This is not a trivial project.

    Interesting price, $750/each. Source?

    Bob Wilson
     
    #2 bwilson4web, Nov 14, 2009
  3. orange4boy

    orange4boy Member

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    I thought I got a good deal at $1500 not running. What kind of mileage? Were they ex fleet auction vehicles?

    I like the idea of running them pure EV but it sounds like a challenge.

    If you ever part them out or know of others being parted out, let me know. I'm near Vancouver.

    Wait... I just figured out which EV Randy. Welcome to Priuschat. I'm with VEVA as well. Just had Dave Cohen help me move my "new" 2003 Prius with the VEVA trailer home to Bowen to replace the Transaxle. Putting it in next week. http://priuschat.com/forums/generation-1-prius-discussion/72080-transaxle-replacement-thread-orange4boys-2003-prius.html#post1001476

    Randy, If you can't pull this off, no one can. You found the right place for advice.

    Marcus Sabathil
     
    #3 orange4boy, Nov 14, 2009
  4. orange4boy

    orange4boy Member

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    Bob,

    Is the fuel pump the main culprit for error codes? A possible work around that comes to mind is a resistor to ground in place of the pump. I have seen this as a solution for transmission modifications so the ECU "sees" the resistance and is fooled into thinking that the solenoid / pump is still there. This would only work if the ECU is kind of dumb and there are no other sensors at work. Not likely.
     
    #4 orange4boy, Nov 14, 2009
  5. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    I was trying to suggest one of several ways to force the engine off. Other options:

    • open the spark plug circuits
    • open the fuel injector circuits
    • open the fuel pump (no pressure, no ICE run)
    • gasoline valve on fuel line (no gas, no ICE run)
    The goal is to stop the ICE so the traction battery power remains.

    Along that line, I've run 101 miles on 'flash' and have a 1 gallon spare can in the trunk. When it finally stops, I'll use the traction battery to drive to a safe place to park and add the extra gallon.

    I'm doing this to photo document what happens. Also, I noticed that over time, the gas gauge acts as if there is an air-bubble under the bladder. Running the tank dry seems to reset everything.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #5 bwilson4web, Nov 15, 2009
  6. orange4boy

    orange4boy Member

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    Forcing the ICE off obviously sets off codes. So the error codes don't come from the fuel pump being off but many other systems reporting something's wrong.
     
    #6 orange4boy, Nov 15, 2009
  7. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Exactly!

    The car monitors many things but not all. Some are derived from combinations of other errors. We still get to debug stuff. <grins>

    Bob Wilson
     
    #7 bwilson4web, Nov 15, 2009
  8. evrandy

    evrandy Electric Prius

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    I was going to stick an AC 50 and 160 ahr lithium's into an Echo but these came along at a good price so I thought one of them might be a better starting point since steering and brakes are already taken care of. We did a Geo with an AC 35 and 90 ahr lithium's back in May and it made a great family car but 4 doors and a bit more range would be nice.
    I test drove the 03 on Sat. It went about a mile and shut down. Battery still showed 50%.
    Pulled over, restarted and went about 1/4 mile before the same thing happend again. It did it another time before getting home.
    Bought an OBD11 scanner today but have not had time to hook it up.
    Both cars are X taxi's with over 350,000km on them but in quite good shape on the outside. They are even a stock color and not yellow.
    Once I get some codes out of it I will probably be asking for some ideas.

    BFN
    Randy
     
    #8 evrandy, Nov 17, 2009
  9. evrandy

    evrandy Electric Prius

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    Does anyone know the gear ratio in the tranny?
    I understand its a fixed ratio.
    If I strip out MG1 and MG2 then weld the sun gear I should have a straight trough gear reduction?
    My 50kw AC motor turns 6600 RPM and I would like a 120 km/hr top speed.

    BFN
    Randy
    Canadian Electric Vehicles Ltd.
     
    #9 evrandy, Nov 22, 2009
  10. ken1784

    ken1784 SuperMID designer

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    The final gear ratio is 3.905(Gen1) or 4.113(Gen2).
    The number of teeth (both Gen1 and Gen2) in the planetary gear set is...
    sun: 30 teeth
    planet carrier: 23 teeth
    ring: 78 teeth

    Ken@Japan
     
    #10 ken1784, Nov 22, 2009
  11. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    The NHW11 engine is speed limited to 4,500 rpm. This nemograph may help:
    Toyota Prius - Power Split Device

    It looks like ICE=MG1=MG2=4500 rpm gives a speed of 75 mph, 120 km/h. Of course it might be simpler to drive both MG1 and MG2 and save the weight and space.

    An excellent source of Prius info:
    Prius links

    Bob Wilson
     
    #11 bwilson4web, Nov 23, 2009
  12. tomfreed

    tomfreed New Member

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    You bought for how much each?:eek: That is a bargain for whatever problems they have. I know from experience you can get used parts quite cheap and get it going. I am thinking of doing this when i settle in Florida but the idea of 100% plug in sounds good to me. Now you get my brain going:D
     
    #12 tomfreed, Nov 24, 2009
  13. evrandy

    evrandy Electric Prius

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    It might be easier to install a transmission out of an Echo and have some gear ratio options.
    In the Geo we are locked in second gear which works nice.
    Have to figure out if the axles will fit the Echo trans.
    Looks like locking the PSD is not going to give me the gear reduction I want/need.
    I would also be much more confortable using a drive system we regularly use rather than trying to find a controller to run the Prius motors.

    BFN
    Randy
     
    #13 evrandy, Nov 24, 2009
  14. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Then it might make sense to get an Echo shell. The problem is you may have body-to-transmission mounting issues trying to use the Prius. Also, the NHW11 Prius body is larger than the Echo ... more mass and weight. Still, whatever 'cranks your tractor.'

    BTW, you may want to wander over the YahooGroup "Prius Technical Stuff." They have extensive archives dating back to 2000, the first Prius in North America. Many of the 'gray beards' who post here also go there when looking at some of the tricky stuff.

    GOOD LUCK!
    Bob Wilson
     
    #14 bwilson4web, Nov 24, 2009
  15. evrandy

    evrandy Electric Prius

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    A couple of things going for the Prius.
    I could not get an Echo in nice shape for $750.
    The Prius already has the power steering and power brakes looked after.
    The Echo was the car we were looking for before the Prius came along but now that we have a couple it is a logical choice for us and it has a bit more room.
    I think it would also be a cool EV.

    Once we get a little farther along I will try the tech group.
    Our shop is very busy at the moment so we wont be stripping the car for a while.

    BFN
    Randy
     
    #15 evrandy, Nov 25, 2009
  16. orange4boy

    orange4boy Member

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    I was wondering if the axles fit other Toyota product too.

    I priced out a new CV at the local dealer just for "fun"... $546.00. Cough! I can't see them developing a different CV just for the Prius. At worst it's probably just where the shaft hits the transaxle that it's different which means you might get Echo transaxle CVs that slide onto the Prius end. Just may need custom axles or not if you are lucky.
     
    #16 orange4boy, Nov 25, 2009
  17. rickw

    rickw I get miles per KW

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    Hello
    I am running a Gen I with a 4kw enginer kit trying to figure a way to get EV mode. Would like to know if anyone has tried sending a high traction battery voltage signal to put it in EV mode.
     
    #17 rickw, Dec 9, 2009
  18. orange4boy

    orange4boy Member

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    Start you own thread. I can't help you, but you will get noticed right away. Plus, I'm interested in doing the same at some point.
     
    #18 orange4boy, Dec 15, 2009
  19. orange4boy

    orange4boy Member

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    Prius with engine completely stripped, running in EV mode. (Autobeyours video)

     
    #19 orange4boy, Feb 8, 2010
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