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NHTSA fines Toyota $16.4 M.

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by bwilson4web, Apr 5, 2010.

  1. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    NHTSA is prepared to levy a $16.4 million dollar fine against Toyota because it "knowingly hid a dangerous defect" that caused sudden acceleration, according to Transporation Secretary Ray LaHood. According to LaHood, Toyota waited at least four months before it told the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration about vehicle accelerator pedals that may stick. “We now have proof that Toyota failed to live up to its legal obligations,” LaHood said in the statement. “Worse yet, they knowingly hid a dangerous defect for months from U.S. officials and did not take action to protect millions of drivers and their families.” Toyota's response?
    While we have not yet received their letter, we understand that NHTSA has taken a position on this recall. We have already taken a number of important steps to improve our communications with regulators and customers on safety-related matters as part of our strengthened overall commitment to quality assurance. These include the appointment of a new Chief Quality Officer for North America and a greater role for the region in making safety-related decisions.​
    Wondering about the photo above? It's the Toyota FINE :)
     
  2. Rokeby

    Rokeby Member

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    Re: NHTSA fine $16.4 M.

    Hold on just a minute. Let's not be overly hasty.

    "... may face the maximum civil penalty of $16.4 million..."
    is not the same as does face the maximum civil penalty...

    I would hardly call Mr. LaHood a disinterested observer; he has a
    major chunk of his professional reputaion, such as it is, riding on the
    outcome of this process. Until the actual hearing he can reap the wind
    by posing as a conquering knight in shining armor -- waist up photos only
    as he may be riding a donkey a la Don Quixoti.

    The civil penalty process involves a hearing before a supposedly
    impartial administrative law judge. The administrative hearing typically
    precedes any civil actions -- think class action suits. The plaintiff, Toyota,
    has to be very circumspect in their defense in the administrative hearing
    as they don't want to "discover" the thrust and structure of their defense
    in the following civil suits, if any.

    I suspect that the $16.4M is but a drop in a bucket compared to the
    potential class action suit liability. It wouldn't even surprise me that
    Toyota pleads "nolo contendere," no contest, -- which lies in a fuzzy gray
    area between innocence and guilt -- and pay the fine just to get this suspect
    administrative irritation out of the way.

    Let's wait and see what happens in the administrative hearing before
    we succumb to wailing and the gnashing of teeth. :rolleyes:
     
  3. robbyr2

    robbyr2 New Member

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  4. tpfun

    tpfun New Member

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    Re: NHTSA fine $16.4 M.

    That's some strong language from a member of the cabinet.
     
  5. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Re: NHTSA fine $16.4 M.

    The fines and lawsuits will work themselves out over time. It is the 'wailing and gnashing of teeth' from every 'we told you so' hybrid skeptic who are right now trying to find this forum to post their redundant BS that pisses me off. We'd finally gotten back to ordinary business and hybrid subject matter postings and someone has picked the scab. <Gerrrrrrr>

    Maybe we should have a forum titled "We told you so!" to 'honey pot' the network Drosophila melanogaster that no doubt will soon be pestering us.

    Bob Wilson
     
  6. 32kcolors

    32kcolors Senior Member

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    Re: NHTSA fine $16.4 M.

    Yeah, do you think LaHood would fine themselves (as the government has a stake in GM) if they were in Toyota's shoes? Of course, the $1 million fine against GM before the bailout doesn't count.
     
  7. tpfun

    tpfun New Member

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    Re: NHTSA fine $16.4 M.

    Why show so much angst over an automobile ?
    The lawsuits and braking issues have some factual basis behind them, Toyota just has to take it as a learning experience.
    Besides, how else is hybrid tech gonna reach mainstream status without this attention ?
     
  8. Rokeby

    Rokeby Member

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    Re: NHTSA fine $16.4 M.

    Already the ineffectual but constantly irritating buzzing of a recently
    returned persistent pest can be heard in the forums.

    [​IMG]

    Where'd that Flit gun get to anyway?

    [​IMG]
     
  9. a_gray_prius

    a_gray_prius Rare Non-Old-Blowhard Priuschat Member

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    Re: NHTSA fine $16.4 M.

    $16 million is a slap on the wrist for a company the size of Toyota.
     
  10. tpfun

    tpfun New Member

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    Re: NHTSA fine $16.4 M.

    I don't believe LaHood 's joking.
    This statement sounds like the GO signal to all the pending civil suits.

    quote: “We now have proof that Toyota failed to live up to its legal obligations,” LaHood said

    Besides, why did Bob start a thread if comments are not welcomed ?
     
  11. robbyr2

    robbyr2 New Member

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    Re: NHTSA fine $16.4 M.

    Of course, the lawsuits are based on the theory that the SUA is caused by electronics, not the American-made accelerator pedals.
     
  12. qbee42

    qbee42 My other car is a boat

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    Re: NHTSA fine $16.4 M.

    Another also: no Prius is included in this, since Prius don't use the American made CTS pedals.

    Tom
     
  13. Pohaku

    Pohaku Member

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    Re: NHTSA fine Toyota $16.4 M.

    I wonder what the indemnification provision reads like in the contract with CTS? May not cover the fine if it was in fact a delay by Toyota that generated the fine, but they may be obligated to pick up the recall cost.
     
  14. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    Re: NHTSA fine Toyota $16.4 M.

    First, as others have said, this is about toyota hiding safety information not anything to do with the prius.

    Second, this is all information that has been out in the news before about CTS pedals and toyota not informing the NHTSA. The only news is the date on the documents and the amount of the fine.

    Third the pedals were made in canada by a company based in the united states. Somehow people think that united states employees can't make cars. Toyota approved the design, but cts has liability insurance. Toyota can not ask cts for the fine money, it is about toyota's behavior, not about the part. I doubt toyota will ask cts for recall money.

    I doubt Toyota will fight the fine. As others have said it is a small amount. It will be much worse for Toyota to go to court. If they do they will have to explain, again why they didn't hide the information they just didn't make it available. It will keep the allegation of Toyota's secrecy about safety in the news.



     
  15. Rybold

    Rybold globally warmed member

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    Re: NHTSA fine Toyota $16.4 M.

    .
    A new surcharge will be added to all 2011 Toyota window stickers:

    "Your Government's Irrational Political Games Markup: $125.00* "

    .

    " *you still wouldn't buy a GM** hybrid anyway. admit it."

    " ** GM = Government Motors"
     
  16. DeadPhish

    DeadPhish Senior Member

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    Re: NHTSA fine $16.4 M.

    Actually this fine is just on the CTS pedal issue. It has nothing to do with any of the hybrids. The Feds think that they should have been notified earlier by Toyota on the gas pedal issue.

    They might be right if Toyota had an inkling back in Sept about what was going on and didn't notify NHTSA. But it has nothing to do with the Prius or any of the other hybrids.
     
  17. Politburo

    Politburo Active Member

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    After reviewing the reg, it doesn't look like Toyota has much grounds for appeal.
     
  18. DaveinOlyWA

    DaveinOlyWA 3rd Time was Solariffic!!

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    so what it boils down to... as soon as the unintended acceleration can be proven along with proving Toyota had prior knowledge of the defect, then they will be fined.

    since there is no real proof of the defect, can there be a defect at all?
     
  19. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    Dave,

    Toyota admitted the defect and has been repairing it. NHTSA has documents with dates.

    bob not nashing teeth. Just correcting some of the misconceptions.

    http://www.cnbc.com/id/36192268



     
  20. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

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    Re: NHTSA fine $16.4 M.

    that is for sure, the real fine will be the fact Toyota is on the front of most major newspapers again being fined for violating the law. That is worth hundreds of millions, maybe billions.