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If there was No Prius, There'd Be No GM VOLT !

Discussion in 'Chevrolet Volt' started by New_Yorker, Jul 28, 2010.

  1. New_Yorker

    New_Yorker New Member

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    The Long History of General Motors has been one of making low quality gas guzzlers. Even when the US Government gave them a grant to develop an electric car, or hybrid GM used the money, made the car and then abandoned the idea. The Japanese seeing this gave a similar grant to Honda & Toyota who then began developing the Honda Insight, and the Toyota Prius. So we may thank GM for the Prius, and it is the success of that Japanese design that made the Chevy Volt a necessary GM project.

    If there were no Prius, there would still be No Volt.

    With enthusiasm like that is it any surprise that GM's Volt is far too expensive, too little, and far too late ?:(
     
  2. Colonel Ronson

    Colonel Ronson New Member

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    Like i've said, $42,000 for a car that gets 300 miles to a tank is a ripoff. that $20,000 extra you're paying over a prius could be used to just a buy a prius and gasoline for 20 years.
     
  3. Chuck.

    Chuck. Former Honda Enzyte Driver

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    It could be argued that if there was no EV1 there would be no Prius.

    Hate to say that.
     
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  4. New_Yorker

    New_Yorker New Member

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    GM used the governments subsidy to build a very credible electric car they called the EV-1 Then GM refused to sell them, gathered them all up from the people they had leased the cars to, and crushed them all rather than offer any of them for sale. If GM had used that research and experience to begin the development of a hybrid, or even and electric car, we might all have bought cars made in the USA rather than Japan. Alas, that was not in the GM Management playbook. Now they offer us a vastly expensive, short ranged, and probably unsuccessful design that most will simply reject. GM has offered us years and years of promises about the New Coming Soon to Your Dealer, Chevy VOLT. I can't wait till Consumer Reports tests one.
     
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  5. eglmainz

    eglmainz New Member

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    And if there were no Ford Model T there would be no Prius...

    Still, even if only to pique the public's interest into the Hybrid / Electric debate, I am glad that there is a Volt to show the public what can be, and with such a huge price gap, it's an easy sell for a Prius.
     
  6. New_Yorker

    New_Yorker New Member

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    Undoubtedly that is true. Toyota took their governments subsidy, and very unlike GM, used it to do something new, different, and exciting. If GM had not gotten the US government subsidy, Japan would never have responded by offering its car makers the same thing. The Prius is proof of the value of long term thinking and planning versus the culture of How Big Is Next Quarters Profit ? Toyota served its nation and their people well, by using the money for good purpose, as these Forums illustrate so convincingly. GM took our nations money and simply wasted it.:cool:
     
  7. bedrock8x

    bedrock8x Senior Member

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    I hate to hear all this complaining about GM not selling the EV1. But if you can think if GM has to sell the EV1 for $100K or more, will there be any market for it. And now the complain is the Volt at $41K and not worth buying. Give GM a break!
     
  8. New_Yorker

    New_Yorker New Member

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    Unlikely !

    If Henry Ford had not created the assembly line, someone else making cars would have done the same thing soon enough. Mass production is too common sense not to have been recognized by others. Henry was the first, but certainly no greater genius than many others who would have done something silmilar.

    In a nation as capable and driven as this one, it seems pathetic that the Volt is overpriced, short ranged, and no credible contender to the Prius. That GM was the responsible designer, sadly surprises me not at all. The Volt tells me we might have been wiser to let GM disappear after all.:(
     
  9. stream

    stream Senior Member

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    And this has...what...to do with the 2010 Prius Gen III main forum?

    Feels OT to me. ;)
     
  10. jburns

    jburns Senior Senior Member

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    This is silly. You can make that claim about anything. No one thinks we would still be in the dark if Edison hadn't invented the light bulb. A big part of genius is being first.
     
  11. New_Yorker

    New_Yorker New Member

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    The EV-1 was never a production model, it was test platform, and for a test platform of a radically new direction and technology for automobile design 100 grand a copy is not bad. It is certainly better than 40 + Grand for an actual production car that has been touted for years to be a contender, when it obviously will not be a contender at all. GM had a break with the Abandoned EV-1. Toyota took the same kind of 'Break' at turned it into the Prius, Hinda the Insight. GM then had an even Bigger 'Break' when our taxes bailed them out of certain bankruptcy. We Do Not owe GM any more Breaks.

    Who in their Right Mind could justify spending 40 Grand on a car that is limited to 40 miles on electricity, and a maximum of 300 miles. A Maximum of only 5 hours of driving per day ! Please show me the market that such a car will be drawing its customers from ? And when the PHEV Prius is available in a 2 or 3 years what lunatic would be glad they own a Chevy Volt instead :rolleyes:?
     
  12. ksstathead

    ksstathead Active Member

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    What made the EV1 need a 100K price tag? Several lead-acid batteries? An electric motor? An inverter? A straight EV is and was very simple compared to hybrids or even normal gas cars. Thing is, GM never gave a price to buy the EV1, then complained no one would buy them. Then took them back at end of lease and crushed them.

    Individuals convert gas cars to electric. Granted, features like AC and heat add some complexity, but even those are doable in your garage.

    I do hope the Volt becomes part of the solution to our transportation problems, but GM earned the skepticism of many would-be customers, and their actions to date on Volt hint more at a repeat disappointment than a high-volume car. Only high-volume cars can move the world where it needs to go.
     
  13. New_Yorker

    New_Yorker New Member

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    How Can Discussing the New American Made, Long Touted, "Prius Buster" to be made by the genius's at General Motors be OFF-TOPIC ? ? ? ?

    The Prius is in production for a decade and more, and the US Made alternative car finally announces it is going 'ON SALE', after YEARS Of Articles Prdicting How Much Better the VOLT was Gonna Be than a mere Toyota Prius ! This weeks Big News is that the Price is for a Massively More Expensive Vehicle with Great Limitations, and this Topic is NOT RELEVANT to the Prius ? ? ? In what Universe ? :rolleyes:
     
  14. New_Yorker

    New_Yorker New Member

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    Up against the Prius, the VOLT as announced would probably prove a failure if they were sold TWO FER $ 41,000.00. 40 mile EV range ? For a production car of that price ? Not a Chance.
     
  15. stream

    stream Senior Member

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    Here's why it's off topic--for this sub-forum.

    This is the "Gen III 2010 Prius Main Forum." The description provided by the forum is:
    General discussion regarding the 3rd Generation 2010 Toyota Prius that can't be categorized in the Forums below.

    Your post is not regarding the 3rd Generation 2010 Toyota Prius, so is off topic for this sub-forum. Folks like to post in the main sub-forum to get more eyeballs, but posting off topic stuff just clutters the sub-forums--that's the reason for sub-forums. ;)

    Why not put it in the Gen II main forum? :p

    Or the Chevy Volt sub-forum?
    Chevrolet Volt - PriusChat Forums
     
  16. creativeguy

    creativeguy Member

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    If horses didn't smell and leave steaming piles on the road, there would be no cars and therefore no Prius.

    Of course we would have horses with giant chrome hoofs and flames shaved into their hair. ;)
     
  17. New_Yorker

    New_Yorker New Member

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    Evidently My First Posting at Refuting Your Ridiculous Criticism Failed To Convince You, so here we go again.

    The Chevorlet Volt Is NEWS . . . TODAY . . . They Just announced the Pricing for the Great GM, Long Touted PRIUS BUSTER. Thus this NEWS should Be Read By ALL PRIUS OWNERS, But Most Especially By those of us who own OR who would COMPARE The New Volt from GM to the New, AS IN GENERATION 3, Toyota Prius. It may have escaped you that Totota Dealers now No Longer Sell Generation II Models that might Compete with Brand New Competitors like the VOLT. Ergo Generation 2 Discussion would be asinine for this TOPIC ! Sorry I have to be the one to make YOU Cognizant of that REALITY.

    Also Precisely BECAUSE The Main GENERATION 3 Forum gets, as you say, The MOST EYEBALLS, a News Worthy CURRENT TOPIC like this one should not be Squirreled Away in some alternative minor discussion about the Volt. The Discussion is a CURRENT ONE, as in TODAY's NEWS, that Remains Highly Relevant To All of those about to own, or who recently Purchased a Generation 3 PRIUS, the car to which the VOLT is Always Compared even Long Before the Volt could be ordered, purchased or test driven. So AGAIN your criticism is Both Lame & Irrelevant. This Thread is Exactly Where it Belongs.:D
     
  18. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    According to the Book of Toyota:

    • 1997 NHW10 Prius begat NHW11 Prius
    • 2001 NHW11 Prius begat NHW20 Prius
    • 2004 NHW20 Prius begat ZVW30 Prius
    • 2010 ZVW30 Prius be gat da big stick to whack a Volt
    Look at the history of what the CARB board introduced:

    • RAV-4 EV 1997-2003
    • EV1 1996-1999
    • Honda EV-Plus 1997-1999
    • Ford Ranger EV 1998-2002
    I don't think the EV1 introduced any technology that wasn't already available in the competing EVs. As for the Prius, it was quite apart from the EV world. But what would I know since we have a 2010 Prius.

    Bob Wilson
     
  19. stream

    stream Senior Member

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    Ridiculous? Lame & Irrelevant? Lighten up, big boy.

    First, your vitriolic comments expose your feelings of inadequacy.

    The lady doth protest too much, methinks. ;)

    OK--let's put everything that is Prius related (or not) in one sub-forum. Why do you think forums have sub-forums? :eek:

     
  20. New_Yorker

    New_Yorker New Member

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    Undoubtedly you are correct, but GM crushed and scrapped all the Ev-1's ostensibly because they would then subvert all who might wish to capitalize on their technological investment (which was actually the American Taxpayers investment and not theirs anyway)

    I suggest that GM was probably worried more that someone take the cars and make it obvious they were viable, and could be mass produced and sold in a day when GM was all about raising CAFE standards, not proving with Electirc Cars that CAFE standards should be far Lower than they already were. The Detroit Political Lobby would Not have been pleased by a Viable Electric Car, and GM wasn't about to let that cat out of the bag. In this day and age they seem to advanced little on the idea, evidence the disappointing performance figures and exhorbitant price of the EV-1's Successor, the Chevrolet VOLT !