1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Fuel gauge way off

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by JackDodge, Oct 20, 2005.

  1. JackDodge

    JackDodge Gold Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2005
    2,366
    4
    0
    Location:
    Bloomfield Hills, MI
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Two weekends ago, I went in to the dealership for an oil change. A few days later, the gauge tells me I'm almost out of gas even though the trip indicated that I had at least a couple of hundred miles before that was actually the case. I fill it up and it takes only 7 gallons. After about one hundred miles, the fuel gauge shows around half full. I take it to the dealership. They look it over and say that they can't find anything wrong but when I have more time to bring it back and they'd reinitialize the fuel system. A few days later, The low fuel alarm goes off even sooner than the last time. I keep going and at 416 miles, the car just plain shuts down and I'm stranded on the road. After getting towed in to the dealership, they say that if the car says it's low on fuel, then it's low on fuel. I say that's not possible because I've only driven 416 miles and I get at least 52 mpg average so how can I be out of gas? They checked for a couple more hours before deciding that they should drive me home and call me when they're done. Around 6:00 PM, they call and say that they just don't know what the problem is, that Toyota has never heard of this problem before and that they are opening a new case file on it. It sounds as if they had already figured out that the car wasn't, in fact, out of gas and that it wasn't the bladder. They surmised that it may be the attitude control or the display itself. So, I'm driving around in a rental Camry, courtesy of the dealership who says that it's 99% sure that they'll have my car back to me today but it's disconcerting that they simply don't know what the problem is and my car has turned in to a classroom project to learn from. Anyone out there have any ideas on this? Maybe the dealership could use the help eh? Anyway, I'd sure like to know what the heck is going on. :huh:
     
  2. galaxee

    galaxee mostly benevolent

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2005
    9,810
    465
    0
    Location:
    MD
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    have they tried resetting the inclinometer? if not, maybe suggest it. it can cause some strange fuel gauge action.
     
  3. JackDodge

    JackDodge Gold Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2005
    2,366
    4
    0
    Location:
    Bloomfield Hills, MI
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Yes, they did that yesterday. They've been testing my car for two days and haven't been able to find anything wrong with it. There's another Prius right next to it in the bay and they've duplicated the tests on that one and the results are the same for both cars. It just doesn't make any sense. They verified that it was, in fact, dead empty when it came in on the flatbed tow truck too so at this point, no one here can figure it out. They also say that the bladder contracts in the winter so my problem could get worse.
     
  4. Maytrix

    Maytrix Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2005
    742
    7
    0
    Location:
    Marlborough, Mass
    Vehicle:
    2009 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    I think it just goes to show that it pays to fill up when low. Why try to calculate when you have a nice display that should tell you when it's time. At any rate, it certainly seems like it was accurate in this case, since they did determine the tank was empty.

    In addition, I'm not sure I understand your numbers..

    1. Car says you need to fill up - you feel you have 200 miles to go still (big assumption since bladder and fillups from pumps can cause 3 gallon variances at times)
    2. You add 7 gallons
    3. At 416 miles, you run out of gas.

    I'm not sure I see that there's a problem at all. Here's Why

    1. Maybe with your last fill up, you didn't put in quite as much fuel, so the tank wasn't really full, so you didn't really have 200 more miles to go.
    2. 7 gallons - would seem to indicate 3 gallons in tank, but that's not always the case
    3. Assume 50mpg. That would be 350 miles on the 7 gallons you put in. We at least know the tank had that much in it. You went past this by 66 miles. At least another gallon.

    So - Things seem to add up in my opinion. If you are so determined to fill up based on the odometer vs the gas gauge, keep a log of fill ups so you know how much went in each time and how many mpg you were really getting.

    The one missing number from the above equation is how many gallons did you put in at the previous fill up? Either way, this doesn't seem that far off.
     
  5. JackDodge

    JackDodge Gold Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2005
    2,366
    4
    0
    Location:
    Bloomfield Hills, MI
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    I'm starting to think along that line, too, Maytrix. The first thing that made me think that something was wrong was that normally when the low fuel indicator beep goes off, and I fill up, it takes around ten gallons. Now it takes seven? That seems pretty far off.

    The second thing, after I fill up and only about a hundred miles in to the tankfull, The fuel gauge reads half full. That's a problem. Both of these things made me worry and caused the dealership to do all of their tests. Something is definitely wrong but I haven't figured it out yet. Maybe they gas stations around here are using their winter mix already. Maybe I got ethanol but I doubt it since I always use Mobil. In any case, why would the car show half full so soon?
     
  6. galaxee

    galaxee mostly benevolent

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2005
    9,810
    465
    0
    Location:
    MD
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    OHHHH...

    i didn't notice you were in MICHIGAN. it's starting to get cold again in the midwest isn't it? (i'm a WI native, should have thought of that)

    yes, this will really affect your car's fuel bladder and you may have a hard time putting much gas in at once. here in nc is's still in the 80s (sigh) and i have a hard time getting more than 9 gallons in. i can see 7 being a pretty reasonable number considering the temp difference.
     
  7. seasidetraveler

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2005
    662
    14
    0
    Location:
    CA
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    My fuel gauge is terrible- I can go almost 150 miles before 1 bar goes down, but after that, they start falling like bricks- I really don't like that- but I deal- I have just learned to get gas at half tank.
     
  8. JackDodge

    JackDodge Gold Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2005
    2,366
    4
    0
    Location:
    Bloomfield Hills, MI
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    They reset the fuel gauge, too, so we'll see what happens. They put a couple of gallons or so in the tank so I don't quite know how much was left when I filled it up this morning but it took a little over 7 gallons. Just another aspect of the Prius that is very different from other cars. Thanks for the input.
     
  9. Marlin

    Marlin New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2005
    1,407
    10
    0
    Location:
    Bucks County, PA
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    You have probably never owned a car that didn't behave this way. However you probably never noticed or cared. The only reason you notice it now is that you are constantly watching your MPG, miles driven, and you fuel gauge. This is something you probably never did on you previous car.

    When I filled my old explorer, the fuel guage needle would peg on the stop pin well pas the "F", and would stay there for many miles before it started to drop. When I looked at the fuel gauge, I only cared about whether it was above 1/4 or below. If it was below 1/4, then I got gas, if it was above, then I didn't. I didn't track milage and I didn't have realtime MPG updates, so I wasn't sitting there saying "I know I've gotten XX mpg this tank and I've gone yyy miles, therefore I should be at 1/2 a tank, not 1/3".

    You also have to consider that gas tanks are not perfectly square. Look at this one from an 87 Corolla:

    [​IMG]

    The only way to get a perfectly linear gas guage out of that is to use considerably more complex electronics than is warrented for something as mundane as a gas guage.
     
  10. Cyndrax

    Cyndrax New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2004
    56
    0
    0
    Location:
    Newark, DE
    It would seem to me that with computer power as cheap as it is these days, it would be possible for a car to do this reliably at minimal expense.
     
  11. seasidetraveler

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2005
    662
    14
    0
    Location:
    CA
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    It just bugs me, because it does give me the impression that I can go far on a tank, and that I am getting great mileage, but then once it loses the first bar and just goes and goes, it's sad! That has been a complaint the whole time for me- that the tank doesn't go as far as I think a hybrid should- I can go about 450 miles, which for me is a weeks driving...
     
  12. jamolson

    jamolson New Member

    Joined:
    May 16, 2005
    3
    0
    0
    your guage showed empty and the tank was empty, in my opinion there is nothing more the dealership can do. Cold weather has a HUGE effect on these systems. I think you should trust your guage and ignore the math.
     
  13. Maytrix

    Maytrix Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2005
    742
    7
    0
    Location:
    Marlborough, Mass
    Vehicle:
    2009 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    And filling up once a week is an issue? I used to fill every other day or so in my previous vehicle.

    I think WAY too many people focus on the mileage than the fuel gauge. Fill up when the car indicates it's time! I just filled up today and I have over 4 bars! WOW, I muts be crazy :blink:
     
  14. seasidetraveler

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2005
    662
    14
    0
    Location:
    CA
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    well, when the nearest gas station is 30 miles away- it's just a pain. I can only do so much driving before I head to the gas station.
     
  15. jeromep

    jeromep Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2004
    827
    2
    0
    Location:
    Eastern Washington State
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Ah, isn't that the case with all of us. We can only do so much driving before we have to visit the gas station? I can do about 450 miles. That leaves me with 2 or 3 pips on the gage, and I'm happy with that.

    Seems like a totally reasonable amount of driving to do between fillups.
     
  16. Maytrix

    Maytrix Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2005
    742
    7
    0
    Location:
    Marlborough, Mass
    Vehicle:
    2009 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    30 miles away? WOW - I probably have over 15 stations I could choose from within 10 miles. Nearest is just 1 mile away.

    I guess you need to move out of the boonies?
     
  17. NuShrike

    NuShrike Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2005
    1,378
    7
    0
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    Model:
    Five
    I had my tank ping 450mi into my tank (I'm in SoCal) when it's usually @ 500mi+ especially after I dropped in 11gals+ in previously.

    So I decided to experiment a bit, and drove to 524mi without running out. And I know my run-out limit is usually 560mi. Then at fueling the first click-off was at 10.5, and the final fill was 11.8gals; my usual.

    So there's some funny "memory" going on with the tank. It could be the cooling weather shrinking the tank.

    I used to be able to get it to click off at 11gals+ in my Civic HX with its 11.9gal tank for the 199K miles I drove it, so I'm trying to accomplish the same here.

    Things you might want to look at is maybe the fuel pump. Some are much too sensitive and click off too early. Experienced a few that clicked-off around 3-4 gallons.

    Btw, my usual at half-tank is around 250 to 300mi in.
     
  18. Frank Hudon

    Frank Hudon Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2004
    4,147
    18
    0
    only 15, I'd hazard a guess that I could chose from at least 75 possibly more like 100+ in 30 miles.
     
  19. Frank Hudon

    Frank Hudon Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2004
    4,147
    18
    0
    part of the problem with the Prius gas tank and complaints is the tank only hold 1/2 -2/3rds the gallonage that your previous vehicle held and as such things happen faster. The top part of the tank in your other car was probably the total in the Prius and as such your thinking is wow I've used half a tank, in the Prius it's wow I've use a tank. In modern cars that fuel gauges are not very linear, as the tank is seldom a square or rectangular tank, like Marlin has pointed out.
     
  20. Maytrix

    Maytrix Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2005
    742
    7
    0
    Location:
    Marlborough, Mass
    Vehicle:
    2009 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Probably more, but I was giving a conservative guess.