Question about Plugging IN and charging station options

You can pick up a level 2 charger at a Home Depot, Loews, or Menards. It's best to use your own electrician. In the end you’ll save money, and shop around for a good electrician if you don't have one. Paying the highest price doesn't always equate to the best job, get recommendations. Be aware that not all units are indoors and out door usable.

 

ours charges in 135 minutes on 110v

 

I actually had a pretty good experience with Leviton. Granted I probably had the easiest installation in the world, with the charger about three feet away from the subpanel. But it was a quick and entirely not unpleasant thing.

 

The SCE analysis also suggested a second meter for me. But when I had an electrician come out, he said prepping for the extra meter and the larger electrical panel installation would run well over $2000.00, even though SCE installs the extra meter "free." I have been charging mine using the in-car timer by setting the "finish" time to shortly before I leave every morning. It takes less than two and a half hours to charge from totally out to fully charged, less if I haven't used up the available EV miles. So I have no interest in spending hundreds of dollars in order to charge in half the time, but that's because it wouldn't pencil out for my circumstances.

 

My experience with Leviton was not the greatest. They wanted $1800 to install the charger. Ultimately I decided not to go with them since it appeared that the electrical contractor they wanted to use was padding the permit fee with all sorts of extra stuff that was unecessary. The city only wanted $140 for the new outlet/connection, but the contractor wanted $575. Leviton refunded the $100 site visit charge after I complained. At this point I am going to be getting a different L2 charger for cheaper and have a local electrician do the necessary work, which I'm sure will be a lot cheaper.

 

The cost for an extra meter is legitimate. The electrician has to put in an electric meter box and wire up. The free SCE meter installation is just coming by and plugging a meter into the electric meter box.

 

The Prius Plug-in uses so little electricity that it makes no sense to install a second meter. A full charge takes under three kilowatt hours (kWh) of electricity. If you charge once a day, you'll only use an additional 90 kWh of electricity in a month. At $0.10/kWh, that's an extra $9.00 on your monthly bill. With very expensive rates, it might be double that -- $18 -- which is still no big deal, and not worth an expensive electric meter installation.

The second meter option is intended for heavy duty electricity users like Leaf and Tesla. The Leaf, for example, takes about eight times more electricity than PiP, and it HAS to be charged or it won't work! Very different deal.

Your PiP has a timer setting that will delay the charging time until "Super Off- Peak" hours -- after midnight. The only thing you'll want to do is call SCE to review your bill. When you explain that your car will consume about 90 kWh off-peak per month, they'll be able to suggest the right rate plan. Electricity is sold in "Tiers." you pay a low rate per kWh for the first few hundred kWh per month, then you pay a higher fee for electricity use above that amount -- the second tier. An electric car will almost always put you in the second tier, but SCE's "super-off peak" rates should keep that electricity use separate, because you're using it off-hours.

One last thing: If you're going to charge your car only during " super- off peak" (Midnight to 6AM, I believe), it is not necessary to pay for a 240V charger. The expensive 240V, Level II charger reduces charging time from 3 hours to 1.5 hours, but... so what? If you program your car to always start charging at midnight, it doesn't matter if you finish charging at 1:30 AM or 3:00 AM. The 120V charger cable that comes with the car can be mounted inside your garage, and it will work just fine with a standard electrical outlet.

 

My install will be simple and inexpensive. I'm converting a 120v curcuit/outlet I installed a couple years ago in the garage to 240v by simply replacing the circuit breaker with a 2-pole breaker at the box, and a 240v outlet at the wall. Maybe $20.
The L2 EVSE will be the 30A Schneider EV- Link from Lowes, 15% off $799.
About $700 total cost. My use of the PiP will be even better with a convenient and shorter turnaround time (charge time).

 

what size wire is that 9-g?

 

12ga. I sorta had this in mind when I ran the circuit.

 

9G-man, I have the Schnieder as well, the EVSE is capable of the full 32A (6.6kw) charging, and even though the PiP can only use about 8 Amps on each of the 120V legs (240V total shows as "1.9KW" on the display during charging), technically your 12AWG/20AMP circuit will work for the PiP with the Schnider, however, the Schnieder is rated as a full 6.6KW EVSE, meaning it can supply up to 32Amps to an EV, so it requires 8AWG wiring on a 40AMP breaker to meet electrical code.

This is only an issue if you let someone with a Ford Focus EV (which has an onboard 6.6KW charger), or a 2013 Nissan Leaf with the upgraded 6.6KW charger, the circuit breaker is going to trip from the overload... for most of the EVs out there now, you won't have a problem, just understand that on a new install, if you are buying parts anyway, to do it correctly requires the 8AWG wiring/40A breaker.

 

Thanks, You are correct. I originally had the 16amp Leviton in mind, and opted for this Schnieder instead. As long as i'm charging the PiP, I'll be fine...but,
That being said, it won't take much to just run a new circuit with 8AWG and leave my std. outlet intact. Yeah, I think that's what I'll do.
The back side of the garage wall I'm working with is unfinished and below an attic. So access is really easy.

How do you like your EV-Link?

 

My comment wasn't intended to convey that I thought the charge was not legitimate. The electrician was simply warning me that it was going to be expensive to put in a larger panel and all the work that goes with it. I would save one cent per kWH. It would take one heck of a long time for payback!

 

9-g, is that 3 wire or 4 wire? i think in mass, code requires 2 blacks a white and a ground and a 4 prong plug. thanks, i'm considering this as well and am not totally sure. i see some 240v set ups with 3 wires and a 3 prong plug.

 

The Schnieder EV link is great, its a full 32A capable EVSE at a great price, when I bought mine from Home Depot online last year, the price was then at $729, and I used a $50 off coupon as well, so the final price was great (and free shiping as well). I also got to use the %30 EVSE federal tax credit for the EVSE and the install, so that was why I did it before the end of 2011 (was installed in September of 2011)

I actually borrowed a Leaf, from the Nissan dealer I was going to buy a Leaf from, they let me have it for 1/2 day, so I brought it home and tested the EVSE with it, worked great. It also is working fine with the PiP, I just set the timer in the PiP tonight for 5:00AM, so the car will be charged by 7:00AM (a little before actually), when you plug it in, the relay clicks on, then clicks off, and should resume at 5:00AM, we'll see, but I don't expect a problem.

I also built an OpenEVSE, for a total cost of about $400, so I'll be testing that as well with the timer later in the week as well, if you are mechaniclly/electrically inclined, and have some basic tools, you can do that as well, most seem to just want to buy something complete though, but you do learn a lot building your own.

If you are curious, here are some pics of the OpenEVSE I built:
[ame="http://s461.photobucket.com/albums/qq333/mitch672/OpenEVSE/"]OpenEVSE pictures by mitch672 - Photobucket[/ame]

Here are pics of my Schnieder install:
[ame="http://s461.photobucket.com/albums/qq333/mitch672/2011%20EV%20work/"]2011 EV work pictures by mitch672 - Photobucket[/ame]

 

Nice design. I like the stacked boards. As I don't have an EV this isOn paper only. I'm using Siemens gfci breakers for their additional disconnect function although this limits the max current. My relay of choice for L2 only is a Omron G7Z=4A 4pole by 40amp/pole 4pst normaly open (no) relay in a 2x2 configuration for 80 amp maximum rating. Switched by the aux 12v relay that comes as an add on. An option would be to use an Omron G7Z-2A2B 2p no(40A)/2p nc(25A) to feed from the nc side 2 20A switched outlets for L1 use when not using the L2 function.

Still working on a PV microinverter to powerline communication to variable pilot pwm amp signal control. Idea is to have the charging current track a % of the PV array output realtime. Not sure any of the current PHV/EV models chargers will follow the pilot amp signal up and down at this time. Guess I need the log in at the open esve project and say hello. (Lets start with L2C )

 

It may be "legitimate," but it will never pay for itself, financially. Maybe if you're cramming 50 kWh/day into a Tesla, but a PiP consumes less than 90 kWh in a month, if you charge only off-peak. If electric rates swing between 10 and 20 cents per kWh, you're looking at a maximum savings of $9/month, $108/year, $1,080/decade... The $2,000 electric meter can't possibly pay for itself. You're better off installing LED light bulbs in your home and taking other conservation measures, or put the money towards solar panels. Measures like that save more money and consume less energy. Installing a second meter doesn't consume any less electricity.

 

What denotes a level 2 charger??