God: Benevolent or Malevolent?

All knowledge comes from God. How we use and apply it are two vastly different things.

 

If you say so.

Then I must conclude that either god is holding back, or the antenna is broken.

 

^ or perhaps you are holding back?

 

Are you? If not, please ask Him the rest mass of the Higgs-Boson, or the formula for a cure to cancer, or... Since you KNOW you KNOW, and you are not holding back, and God is not holding back, this should be no problem. Once the value you give is tested, I promise to convert to your God. Nothing could be simpler.

If you prevaricate on this, I will know that, in your heart, you aren't quite so sure that know you know.

..

 

Chuck, the following is a very respectful question. One that has no bearing on the existence of God, but one of alternate theologies.

There are many believers of God that see evolution as his mechanism. There are many who see evolution as the secular opposition to his mechanism. Who gets to pick the theology to be put in school?

(Ammobob-Substitute her for his, to match even yet another theology.)

 

Geez, be careful Corwyn. He could hit the lottery and guess the correct mass of the Higgs-Boson by chance.

Then where will you be. Tsk tsk.

 

I thought the lottery was about 1:150 million. IIRC Sig digits for the boson are going to be quite a few more than eight or nine.

When Spidey can win the lottery say a million times in a row I'll take his religious poppycock seriously.

 

I will a guy living in a world with a known value of the Higgs-Boson, or a cure for cancer. Sounds like a great deal to me.

 

I'm unsure here whether you are saying that ultimately god is the source of all knowledge, which would be the logical conclusion if there is a god, and if (s)he is both omnipotent and omniscient; or if you are saying that scripture and direct revelation are the only valid ways to know anything, and that therefore observation and experiment cannot result in knowledge.

Many early scientists like Darwin and Newton believed that god speaks to us through nature, and that observation and experiment were valid ways to learn about the world (rather than relying on scripture or church tradition) and that further, studying nature was an excellent way to glorify god. When they discovered that the churches were wrong about nature, they did not feel they were rejecting god, merely correcting erroneous religious dogma. Of course, this could only happen after the church was deprived of the political power to burn people at the stake for contradicting it.

 

Oh good, I think I have an answer for you...

We know we live in a broken world (sinful) full of bad things. By all accounts, Eden was perfect and so were Adam and Eve (no aging, no pain, etc). They would have lived in perfect, peaceful harmony with their Creator for eternity, probably. But that wasn't the case and all hell broke loose sorta speak (disease, painful childbirth, etc.).

Fast forward today... there are many pestilence that we have to deal with like cancer, AIDs, etc. Natural phenomena like earthquakes, tornadoes and tsunami, and oh my, climate change / global warming or whatever it is called today. Could God remove all this... sure, just by speaking. But would that get Him what he wants? Probably not. What does he want? He wants to be in communion with his creation. So as God doesn't cause these things to happen, He does allow them to happen. In the case of the unbeliever; that they may come to a place in their life that they say, "I have had enough trying to do it my way. God if you are real, show me the way". For the believer (yes, life is not a bed of roses for us either), it is used to build character or the relationship between us Jesus tells us there there will be trouble in this world but not to worry for He has overcome the world.

So, as God gives us knowledge to cure things or procedures for or to create vaccinations for, through science, I am afraid there will always be something else around the corner. Same for discovering the answers for things like the God particle. Figure that one out and there will just be something else. A distraction for those that have science for their idol/God.

God want's our all: our heart, our soul, our mind and our strength.

Blessings

 

Is that all it would take? sheezzz

 

Isn't that what I said?

Proverbs 1:7
Romans 11:33
et all.

 

In other words, God is holding back (contrary to your statement).

He is, in essence, allowing, perhaps causing, disease, torture, calamities etc. because he selfishly wants attention from us

I think that pretty much answers the OP's question.

 

So because Adam and Eve sinned, god visited all the same horrible suffering on the animals that he afflicted Adam and Eve with??? That was a mighty unfair, sadistic, unjust, capricious, and generally nasty thing to do!

And anyway, why didn't he just give them a good spanking and a second chance? They were, after all, just children chronologically, even if they were in the bodies of adults. The serpent, on the other hand, was eons old, experienced in the arts of deception. Only an nice person would seriously expect children to be capable of understanding the implications of the serpent's deception. Eve had never before encountered deception and was trusting by nature and experience, and Adam was a child, too, and only an nice person would have expected him to be able to choose the right path through the morass he found himself in. And anyway, he'd have been a cad if he had abandoned Eve at that point.

Nope. The person described as god in Genesis is not just, or loving, or fair. He's a total jerk. If there is a god, and if god is love, then the story in Genesis is a lie. And if the story in Genesis is true, then god is a petty tyrant who enjoys creating impossible tests just so he can impose bloodthirsty punishments on the people who will inevitably fail the test.

Of course I don't believe any of it. I bring it up as just one more example of the contradictions within Christianity. Judaism, of course, has the same book (and had it first) but I believe the Jews have a very different attitude about god than Christians do. (I am Jewish by ethnicity, but was not raised religious and I don't know a lot about Jewish theology. I just know we have a lot of really stupid dietary laws and bloodthirsty mythology.)

I have on numerous occasions said "God, if you exist, put me straight." I got no reply. If there is a god, I would sincerely and honestly like to know. When I was at Sandstone, the Pentecostal chaplain told me the reason I got no answer was that I was asking god, rather than Jesus. So I asked him what were the "correct" words to use. I don't recall them now, but for several days, having nothing better to do (I was in the hole at the time) I repeated the words the chaplain had suggested. Least you accuse me of insincerity, I repeat that if there's a god I'd really like to know. Again, I got no reply. When I told the chaplain that, he quit speaking to me. But not before telling me that I am going to hell for believing in evolution. He made it very clear that I might be forgiven for being an atheist, but not for believing in evolution. Why he considered belief in evolution to be a worse sin than disbelieving in god has always remained a mystery to me, especially since there are plenty of Christians who believe in both god and evolution.

 

It seems to me that if god were omni-everything in the way of positive
attributes, he/she/it would be perfect and complete, lacking nothing in
those attributes (Pick you own attributes.)

If this is true, then god can not "need" any thing from humankind or
individual humans. Any need would evidence an incompleteness,
something missing, an imperfection in a presumed perfect being.

I am not so certain about a/the god's "wanting" something from us.
A want seems like it has an optionality to it. A want could go unfilled
without creating a lack. Actually, a stated want gone unmet would
seem to carry an implied threat of retribution...

an unsaid, "Or else..."

(Cue flames and sound of hellfire in background.)

 

He doesn't need anything from us... he wants to be in communion with us. Asked and answered.

I often think about a time when man develops an AI with a conscience. Will we think it is funny/cute when it goes rogue or simply pull the plug? Perhaps we just incorporate safe-guards to prevent it from happening. Hmmm.

 

Now there is a conundrum, since science shows us that religion is a pot of hooey.

At least god has a sense of humor, since so much of scientific progress is by atheists. I suppose that makes god malevolent, putting his followers at the shallow end of the gene pool.

 

Really? Cite please.

 

Really? Cite please.