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Traded 2013 Volt for New Prius HB

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Main Forum' started by rudiger, Sep 7, 2013.

  1. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    Yeah, and the Leaf also comes w/no spare in the US. :mad:

    Aussie Leafs come w/them though :eek: : My Nissan Leaf Forum • View topic - Spare tire down under!.
     
  2. Sporin

    Sporin Prius Noob

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    I think that it is great that there are so many choices, and I'm glad you worked out what was best in your situation.

    It should be said thought, that the Volt was not designed for people who drive 30k miles a year.

    I look forward to the next-gen. Volt (and PiP). The future is Hybrids and EV's and it's a future I welcome. :)
     
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  3. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Who is the market for Volt? That question has been asked countless times over the years. The response was never clear. It still isn't either. What about 20k per year? Heck, even 15k becomes uncertain when you consider the demands of heating in the winter.

    What is the best balance of capacity & price? That should be the question asked. Evidence that price was too high is overwhelming at this point. Capacity was too much of a tradeoff, especially when you also factor in rear seating space.

    So, the dilemma of what should be delivered for the next generation is still very much an issue. Taking into the expiration of the tax-credit makes a challenging situation even worse. The topic of "designed for" is a very big deal. Who?
     
  4. Sporin

    Sporin Prius Noob

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    We can go round and round on that one but you know we won't solve it here. :) GM built the Volt to match their own research so it's sort of a moot point to debate it on this end. It is what it is. It either works for you or it doesn't.... as the OP found out.

    To me, an EV with a limited range is, by design, a car for folks who drive a set (limited) number of miles per day, week, year. If you were getting into the gas engine every single day then I'd say that a Volt was maybe a poor choice for your usage anyway. This is not an insult to the OP, as he found this out, this is just my opinion.

    Like I said, it's great to have choices and I welcome more and more of them to the market. GM has done so much work on this, and they are fighting biases the entire way. I think the next-gen Volt is going to be a really great car that will work for a larger cross section of buyers (who need more range, a real back seat, etc). I hope Toyota makes a true competitor as well in the next gens of the PiP.
     
  5. drinnovation

    drinnovation EREV for EVER!

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    While I can agree for the OP switching makes sense that's because he will be facing 30K miles/year without the ability to plug in regularly. No plugin is designed for someone without the ability to plug in regularly.
    The 30K is a red-herring. Note his 30K miles for the first year, with 50% EV, yielded 76 mpg, which is pretty darn good. There are plenty of PiP owners that are not getting that level of gas efficiency (at least on fuelly and the PC MPG spreadhseet). But as the OP is driving 30K per year and the switching cost was low enough and it makes him happy then it makes sense.

    With respect to high-miliage volts, Voltstats shows two 2012 volts with over 95K miles each, with 65MPG and 69MPG respectively. So even at 45K miles/year the volt can be very fuel efficient, if one has a place to plug in. From a different view if driving that much the quality of the ride, not just fuel efficiency matters a lot.
    Most people agree multiple choices are good, and the increased sales rate for plug-ins this year show most of them are attracting some base. Hopefully they will all grow as one size/car does not fit all.
     
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  6. rudiger

    rudiger Active Member

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    Yeah, if you can put up with the other minor annoyances, and have a place to plug-in, it's pretty clear that outside of a pure EV, the Volt is about as good as it's going to currently get for fuel mileage (regardless of the other circumstances).

    It would be interesting to know the fuel mileage of those GE employees who were given Volts as company cars. They're reimbursed for fuel, but not electricity. Consequently, they have absolutely no incentive to plug-in their Volts, ever. It actually 'costs' them money. IOW, what's the real-world fuel mileage of a Volt that was never plugged-in from Day One?

    As I said, if the Volt had been a bit bigger inside (as big as the Prius HB), I had a steady home base to plug-in, and there was a much greater infrastructure for low-cost, hassle-free, non-home charging, I might have kept it.
     
  7. Former Member 68813

    Former Member 68813 Senior Member

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    Is it me or the OP complains sound really minor?
    On the other hand, if one does a whole lot of driving with little time available or no opportunities for charging in between, Volt is not so great option. I'm still undecided if Volt is going to be my next car.
     
  8. drinnovation

    drinnovation EREV for EVER!

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    Well GE does encourage the to plug in at work.. I wish they would pay a flat fee per mile, then people would be encouraged to charge as they would pocket the difference between electricity and gas...



    There is set of GE volts on voltstats: Volt Stats: GE EVs

    which range from 98% EV (and 500+MPG_ to 24% EV and 45MPG. The lowest

    Volt Stats: Details for Volt #2011-03858 (VictorVolt)

    is at about 45MPG, or just slighly below average compare to a prius and above most hybrid models.


    The absolute lowest %EV Volt on voltstats is 10%
    Volt Stats: Details for Volt #2011-99072 (Voltron)
    who has an overall 47.65MPG.. at 10% EV.

    Note because of how "EV" is counted its possible to get a few percentage of EV without ever plugging in (using MM or coming down hills and then turning the car off with above minimal SOC, when the car restarts it will be "EV".
     
  9. Paradox

    Paradox Prius Enthusiast / Moderator
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    My neighbor works for GE and was given a Volt very early this year. But here's the kicker with GE... Part of the program was another program where they would install GE Wattstations at the homes of those getting the Volts. They cancelled the program but still got people the Volt. Since he isn't the homeowner (It's his father in laws house) he won't take up the driveway for ~10 hours so he just uses gas and GE pays for it anyway so he doesn't care. It's a shame GE spent the money to buy their employees these cars and then just gave up on installing the L2 EVSE's that they themselves make.

    He says they cancelled the program due to cost but wow, he says most people with them he knows are using gas as well because of the long L1 charging time. IMO, GE should have just gotten employees regular Prius liftbacks since they were not going to roll out the L2 chargers to go along with the Volts. That would have saved them the most money if cost was an issue.

    Other than the charge I gave him shortly after getting it, off my GE Wattstation ironically, he's never charged it. Last I spoke with him he was 34.something MPG lifetime.

    Afterthought: I wonder if it was only cancelled in NYC and he simply doesn't know if it was. I say this because of how $$$ it can get for permitting fees just to add a 220v outlet 'legally' here and GE said the heck with it.
     
  10. Jeff N

    Jeff N The answer is 0042

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    The 11 members of the GE drivers group averaged 67% EV and 105 overall MPG which seems typical of the overall average that OnStar reports for Volt owners. Members of Voltstats.net have an average of 74% EV and 136 MPG and the median is 80% and 177 MPG.
     
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  11. stephensprius

    stephensprius Active Member

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    welcome back!
     
  12. Robert Holt

    Robert Holt Senior Member

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    Watt? You haven't kept up with the Volt times Current situation?
    Ohm my god, isn't that against the Law?

    Seriously, our driving plan included many 1,000+ mile trips and that plus the 21,000 price tipped us in favor of the regular Prius rather than the Volt or even Plug In Prius.
     
  13. Fore

    Fore Don't look back!

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    Wow! Wish I had money to burn like that. What you saved in mileage was most likely lost in depreciation in your trades I would think. Just guessing but welcome back!
     
  14. css28

    css28 Senior Member

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    I think the issue about the 8A default setting is ridiculously overblown. I charge L1 exclusively and when I shut the car down the efficiency screen comes up on my center stack. One push of the leaf button brings up the charging screen. A press on the "change charging rate" button brings up the 12A button and I'm done.

    Considering the number of photos I've seen of charred ancient 15A outlets I don't blame GM one bit.

    I often set the charge rate while I'm waiting at a light on the way home but the pop up efficiency screen always reminds me anyhow.

    Sort of like the Volt owners who swear by driving in L all the time because they don't want to have to lift their foot from pedal to pedal in slow traffic. Really?
     
  15. JeffHastings

    JeffHastings Member

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    A lot of us wish we had that problem. But for its greater price at the time (2 years ago), I might've ended up with a Volt. But it was also newer and as yet, less proven so it seemed a bigger risk. I agree the lack of charging options in many areas its appeal but I nonetheless think the Volt is a very good car that is a more sensible choice for most buyers than near comparably priced and even lower priced EVs.
     
  16. css28

    css28 Senior Member

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    I'm very happy with mine after the first couple of months.

    One advantage of the Volt setup is that you can truly use the battery's full range. Sure, a Leaf has nominally twice the range but how often will you be comfortable planning to use all but the last 10 miles?

    I have used less than 2 gallons of gas so far after my first 1800 miles. 40 miles a day and I have 12 left over this time of year.
     
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  17. bigrin

    bigrin Junior Member

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    OP, excellent post! Very informative. Understood, convenience is the key. The Prius has set the bar, is fine tuned and dialed in. Welcome Back!
     
  18. John H

    John H Senior Member

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    Going "Back" to a Prius from a Volt after losing your plugin opportunity is like going back to abstinence from a condom after being dumped by your girlfriend. :)
     
  19. dbcassidy

    dbcassidy Toyota Hybrid Nation, 8 Million Strong

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    John,

    Well said.:)

    DBCassidy