4th generation coming 2015!

The only vehicle I will ever use without a spare tire is a motorcycle, and I have a car/trailer available for a rescue mission, and AAA for those times where that response would be more timely.
Operating a car without a spare tire is something that I "could" do I guess, but I've had flat tires on almost every single vehicle that I've ever owned....so why not just carry a spare tire?
I also have spare keys, jumper cables, a first-aid kit, etc.

Would the lack of a proper spare keep me from buying a pip or a G4?
Nope, but it's something that I would immediately change about the car before I removed the temporary tag.

That's just how I roll.
YMMV.

As far as the G4 is concerned?
My expectations are that it will be a more of a 2016 kinda thing than a 2015, which is good for me.
If I ever buy a Prius, it will probably be a G3 and the best time to do that will probably be in 2016!
I already get close to 60 in the G3!

G4?
Maybe just before the G5 comes out...but given the MPG trends, the Prius may not be the reigning champs by then.

 

Hmmm. Nope. If we knew that gen IV is a 2015 model then we would guess for a reveal during 2014. If it is a 2016 model year,we would have to wait until 2015. So, no can't figure it out....

 

Everyone here seems to be assuming that a Prius 4wd or AWD would be mechanical. It seems far more likely that they would follow the pattern of the hybrid AWD Hylander and add an another small motor to drive the rear wheels under some conditions under the control of the hybrid computer. They already have this technology so it should be easy to scale down as long as they have enough ground clearance between the rear wheels.

I recall that the AWD hylander was actually more efficient than the 2WD (which they subsequently dropped). I think having motors on both the front and rear wheels helps improve regen braking efficiency.

 

Yup, MGR in the rear provides AWD and instead of lowering MPG, it increases due to better regen and probably more efficient electric propulsion resulting from load balancing between MG2 and MGR.

 

Good point guys!

I suppose this is a possibility as another piece to the puzzle to how it might improve FE 10%. Might it be good for a 2-3% improvement by itself?

 

Wow, so much speculation and yearning.

Is it pretty safe to say Toyota will NOT be revealing a 'Gen 4' Prius at the Detroit NAIAS auto show next month. If so, seems there would be leaks. Seems if they were going delver cars to dealer lots middle of next year, they would have a solid pre-production model at the January Detroit show.

I'll bet we're still one year away from a reveal and 1 1/2 years from it on dealer lots.

 

Speculation is in the thread title - so that's not surprising that we speculate here

And if Toyota fails to update their now essentially 10 year old drive train anytime soon there are a lot of new hybrids coming out right now from other brands. So the competition is good for us customers - we have other models and brands to choose from - no need to wait for the Prius.

 

That only applies to those in the market at the time. And it would be fascinating to find something actually competitive with Prius. The choices so far have taken different approaches. For that matter, HSD itself has too.

The age doesn't matter. Good thing, since the cars most people are still buying use much, much older drive trains. 4th generation pretty much brings an end to the "new" perspective, that's all. It means there's nothing left to prove. The time of speculation & doubt is over. Everyone agrees the technology is clearly here to stay.

Failure would be not investing anymore, to allow Prius purpose to fade. Instead, we already know the next will bring even greater engine efficiency. Having to wait a full product cycle leaves you hanging, but ultimately, that is good business.

 

No, no towing with the Prius+. I was comparing more real world MPG with my friends diesel vehicles. They are close to and sometimes below my MPG....[/quote]

Can't really compare MPG diesel and petrol, different energy contents...But to the user is "roughly" the same...
...except for DPF, DMF, clutches, turbos and alternators...which your Prius has not.

 

Even though other manufacturers are bringing out their hybrids, the Prius is still the one to beat - from my point of view. It looks good, it is not too pricey, proven technology, reliable and it does what it says on the tin - delivers!

 

Actually, that's why Toyota has their headquarters for the Americas located in Torrance, CA. and trust me they speak and read English fluently.

 

You might have a point but to many if not most all they care about is the MPG - what you pay at the pump. I don't know about US prices but here in northern europe, diesel costs roughly the same as regular gasoline. Thus, the high MPG diesels has had quite a success in europe. This is not entirely a good thing of course, even though this lowers the fossile emissions we have increasing problems with particles from the diesels. Unfortunately most people don't care about this but only the fuel economy.
That said, the Prius still delivers among the best MPG and reliability and it's a pity more people don't buy it. Might change depending on the Gen IV of course ;-)

 

True but they don't do any engineering on any Prius.

 

While my 2010 was getting a new windshield these past two days, I had a 2012 loaner from the dealer. I thought having the"new" cup holder they took from the armrest instead of just the flip up one would be really nice, but I actually found it was right around the place I usually rest my right elbow, so kind of annoying. I have the little cup holder attachment thing inside my armrest, too. I haven't used it yet, but I can imagine it would be weird if I ended up in a situation with five people in the car where I ended up having to slide the armrest lid back to accommodate a second drink in the front. That said, this car has way better cup holders than my 99 VW New Beetle, which were mysteriously located under the dash in a space so small it made it hard to get a full can of soda in without spilling. Since we're on the subject, I also think cars with cup holders that pop out from the dash (some BMWs have this, I think) are just asking for a spill that will screw up some of the buttons or electronics.

Okay, now I sound like some kind of cup holder fanatic.

Thanks for the dash pics, Cycledrum. I love looking at car interiors.

 

I have wondered heretofore on PC, if 50 mpg is not somewhat like the sound barrier in aviation. I'm wondering if what Dianne says about the G4 not being ready, might be an indicator that 50 mpg is difficult to eclipses?

An observation: During the dry, long, warm temperatures of summer, I can easily achieve 52-54 mpg (calculated) in my 2010 even with the A/c running. But now that it is cold, and the streets sometimes icy with remnants of snow, I'm struggling to do better than 40-44 mpg. My point is, to achieve 50 mpg requires the optimization of all factors, ICE efficiency and low rolling resistance. The ICE continuing to run in stop and go traffic when the cabin heater is on, is a major factor. Plus, the lights are on more during the winter months. These seem to be all important considerations in the Prius Hybrid fuel efficiency. Now, my other car, a conventional gasoline powered, small AWD SUV, is not significantly impacted by these weather conditions, and my fuel efficiency is almost the same, winter and summer. Consequently, I use the SUV more in the winter than I use the Prius.

Anyone else observe a similar trend?

 

That always low under any conditions is an interesting situation to consider. It amplifies & confuses the situation for those not aware of influencing factors. We see it. But conveying that message is problematic.

Overcoming the 50 MPG barrier presents challenges. There's lots of fine-tuning required to take advantage of thermal dynamics. It can equate to cost & complexity, something really only Toyota is in a position to address. They will too. We can see the opportunity for Gen-4.

Beyond that is a mystery. But then again, engine optimization faces diminishing returns anyway. Delivering more than a solid 50 MPG average with PZEV isn't really necessary. Shifting focus over to electric efficiency makes sense at that point. After all, the measure of "kWh/mile" is rarely gets mentioned currently.

Think about how few people know what the vehicle they drive now actually delivers for MPG. Sadly, your observation isn't common. Even worse, most still just settle for low efficiency, not placing a high priority on using less gas.

 

Yes - I've observed this difference in MPG on the Prius+ (Prius v) during the winter season here in Sweden. It differs roughly from 0,55 l / 10 km (47 MPG) to 0,65 l / 10 km (39 MPG) from between summer and winter I made the mistake to not include an engine block heater with my lease. It costs quite a lot to buy and mount one (roughly 5000 SEK which is equal to 750 + USD). Many if not most people here in Sweden use engine heaters during the winter season which significantly lowers fuel consumption during the first minutes of engine warm up. Next time I buy a hybrid I will make sure to include one.

 

I don't think that 50 will be difficult to better for toyota. if they reduce weight and adjust how the hybird works the battery they could use lighter better batt. ect..., winter is difficult with temps.

 

Wonder if changing to Lithium-Ion batteries would provide the savings required to get 55 MPG from a GenIV Prius?

 

It would help, since PHV owners who upgraded from a Gen-3 (like me) get higher MPG after depletion. The non-plug battery would weigh less too.