GM in history: The American streetcar

Why do you consistently want dish out ancient dirt on GM? Would you like to go into Toyota's past? If you want to go down that path how about doing a little research on what Toyota was building during the 1930's and 1940's. I am sure it wasn't hybrids. Give it a rest.

 

So you are worried about what GM did to trolley cars in the 1920's and 1930's but are not interested in toyota's participation in mass murder in China and other places in the far east or their participation in the deaths of thousands of Americans. If you are going to dwell on the past mistakes of companies which one is more serious? The mode changing of mass transportation or the death of thousands of Americans and systematic murder of prisoners and civilians. Did toyota commit crimes against humanity, no but they certainly played a supporting role.

 

I recall a tire company being involved in this sort of thing, too. I think it was Firestone, who had a "Rails to Rubber" campaign to 'modernise' our transportation systems. Corporations held their own interests above that of the general public, made lots of money, and left us all the poorer for it. It wasn't just GM, and sadly it's nothing new.

 

Corporations have one purpose. To provide a maximum return to the stockholders. End of story.

 

There's something terribly sad about a society that values greed above all other emotions, and values it so highly that it makes it the be-all and the end-all of its entire economic structure.

 

Quite some time ago, 60 Minutes did a story on this. GM and Standard Oil got together and destroyed the many clean and reliable public transportation around the country. Why? Because when people in big cities have such public transportation, they aren't buy cars or gasoline. San Francisco and a few others resisted but GM and Standard Oil were able to ruin public transporation all over the country in order to make more money.

 

Not that I don't believe you, but I don't think you have the facts right.

Standard Oil was broken up in 1911. So unless the 'clean' transportation was horse drawn carriages, I don't think this is accurate. Did the average person have a car in 1911?

And doesn't GM sell more hybrid busses today (2005, not 1911) than anyone else?

 

As I said, it was a long time ago but I remember what 60 Minutes said so you'd have to take it up with them. Actually, when I was a teenager, I spent a summer pumping gas for Standard Oil and that was back in the 70s so it's entirely possible that my facts are correct. I don't recall when they said it went on but it did go on.

 

I have to book mark this statement next time Malorn complains about Toyota's ethic.

 

Oh, if only that were true

 

How about toyota parading around as the 'green' car company. Don't toyotas burn gasoline and pollute? How does the 'green' auto company come out with the "biggest, badass' truck in the industry?
Or how about Toyota's advertising wrapping themselves in the American flag and touting their 'job creation'.
Why do you only attack GM?

 

Is GM any different than toyota or GE, or Phillips, or any other public corporation? This is the reason that some companies have chosen to remain private over the years. I don't defend GM or Ford in this regard, only when it is inferred that they have different objectives than Toyota.

 

Is it pertinent to any relevant issues of today? Or are you just trying to 'dish some more dirt' on GM.

 

It is relevant because it is a daily fact of life in an economic system where Money is God and Greed is King. It's not just GM. They are merely a convenient symbol because they are so big and so blatant. Boards of directors are required (as you have pointed out) to try to maximize profits for shareholders. There is a widely-accepted myth that the "profit motive" (i.e., the Greed motive) in a free market will magically create the greatest good.

Examples like the dismantling of public transportation show how the myth is a lie: The greed motive benefits nobody but the very few extremely wealthy individuals and corporations that have the good fortune to rise to the top of the economic scale. The Greed motive gives us pollution, waste of non-renewable resources, price-fixing, reduction of competition as big companies use unfair pricing to drive smaller ones out of business, political corruption as big companies bribe legislators to act against the public interest, brainwashing of small children through advertising scientifically-designed to make them want and demand unhealthy foods over healthy ones, etc., etc., etc.

And in the not-so-distant past, the Greed Motive took away our puiblic transportation, as irresponsible public officials yielded to pressure and bribes (the greed Motive again!) from companies who saw good public transportation as an obstacle to their profits.

And we see it now in GM's very successful but dishonest advertising campaign designed to convince Americans that gas-guzzling SUV's are safer. The result of all those SUV's is that everybody is more at risk, and we import even more oil from people who hate us. And GM did it just to try to make money. If more people die, if we have wars over oil, if terrorism is funded by oil money, GM does not care, because all that matters to a corporation is making money. At least Toyota offers one car (and Honda two) that responsible drivers can buy. But they're all out to maximize profits, and greed is at the heart of them all.

Actually, when we go to war over oil because so many Americans drive SUV's, GM wins twice, because now, in addition to all those SUVs, they sell more Hummers to the Army.

 

Toyota is solely responsible for some of the most obnoxious Truck and SUV commercials ever (AKA: adrenelitis that only a Tacoma can cure).

Further, I really don't get all the hatred and venom that's spewed towards GM. Like I said in another thread, I see a 5 door malibu maxx, and I think, "Maybe that won't stall like my Prius. And holy crap, it actually looks comfortable and put together decently, which I can't say for the Prius".

GM is introducing hybrids (Vue/Malibu). They're doing cheap hybrids, which is exactly what the market needs. I know EricGO has pronounced them dead before ever driving one, which is exactly what I would expect from a Toyota Zealot. Since I'm not a zealot for anyone, I guess I just have a bit more of an open mind about this.