Need Advice

Two of anything is always (by default) more complicated than one of anything? That's a fine example of simplistic reasoning.

 

I'm NOT saying the Prius isn't reliable.

But a come on...Hybrid Synergy Drive? To get the benefits a hybrid does produce...it's NOT magic. It's the combination and blending of two systems that's one whole system more than something not called a hybrid. Electric motors regular ICE vehicles do not have at all...Regenerative Brakes...it's been described as combining an electric vehicle with a ICE vehicle. You can say "The Batteries have proven to be extremely reliable" and I agree. But the fact of the matter is ALL BATTERIES eventually fail, and in a Yaris vs. Prius comparison... with the Yaris, you don't even have a Hybrid Battery to fail someday.

Yes, with over a decade of sales and operation The Prius has a great track record of reliability. But that doesn't change the fact that I think as a hybrid as it ages, there are more potential maintenance issues that can arise from the fact that it's a hybrid. And often those maintenance issues...can potentially be pretty spendy.

Sure, I like the Prius better than a Yaris. The Yaris is a more utilitarian and basic choice. But sometimes a more basic and utilitarian choice can be a more economical choice.

I wouldn't be insulted, nor take it personally if the OP chooses the Prius. Nor would I think it was a horrible choice. The OP evidently has some mechanical skills and can do a degree of repair and maintenance himself...that is also something to factor.

My opinon, which differs from yours, is taking in account more than just I like Prius better...and I own a Prius, I think given the OP's desires and his definition of his situation today and going forward, I think the Yaris would be the better choice.

Could he buy the Prius and get 10 years of great gas mileage and minimal maintenance expense...certainly. My opinion is still with the Yaris.

If the OP was comparing a 2006 Prius with 58,000 miles to a 2012 Prius with 28,000 miles and asked which one was most likely to be the most reliable over the next 10 years, I don't think anyone would say the 2006. So why you insist that somehow the 2012 Yaris wouldn't be more reliable is beyond me.

 

Geesh people....I own a Prius. Get that I like them.

But you have a big hybrid battery....electric motors, inverters, modules and computer controlled systems that are blending the operation of TWO systems to produce benefit. It's a great benefit and Toyota has done it with great skill and created a system that has proven to be very reliable. BUT....

YES IMO that makes it a more complicated machine...not worse, not unreliable, not bad...but more complicated. Even if you can compare some individual components and make the very valid argument that those individual components are built better or simpler than some ICE counterparts.

As a basic ICE vehicle ages...about the worst case scenarios that develop are that you might have to drop a whole rebuilt engine, or rebuild the transmission...maybe suspension issues...but that's about it.

As a Hybrid ages....you could face those same issues..but you add the possible (note I say possible, not likely or inevitable) of any of the separate hybrid components that DON'T exist on an ICE only vehicle failing.

Nobody who has ever owned a Yaris has had a converter failure or had to replace a hybrid battery.

 

The Prius mechanical transmission must rate as the most brilliantly simple mechanism. It has no ratio changes, no clutches or brake bands "unless you count the torque limiter in the engine flywheel and I have not come across a single failure of this" and no reverse gear. No gears ever come out of mesh or re engage. There are two electric motor generators, again permanently fixed to there drives. The petrol engine is a unit based on the Toyota 1500 cc engine that normally revs to about 6500 rpm, in the Prius limited to around 4500 rpm, again connected directly to the drive system.
The clever part is in the operation of the three possible power sources all controlled by a computer. Now I will agree the word computer scares many people, but the fact is the system in the Prius is much more reliable than any auto transmission, and failures are rare.
There have been very few reported failures of gen2 inverters. Perhaps the biggest failing in the inverter, and there are few of those is in the dc to dc converter. But again how many alternators fail, and many of the converter failures are caused by reverse polarity jump starts. Hardly a reliability problem.
Even the much talked about 12 volt battery can and does last well. It is only the fact that unlike other cars the Prius does not show much in the way of symptoms when the battery is getting weak. Again Toyota have put the capability on the display to check the battery, but how many people do. It has come to our notice in the posts on PC many do not even check the oil level.
At the risk of repeating myself I point to the taxi's. Taxi's that are in the workshop do not get fares, and taxi's that cost a lot in replacement parts do not make a profit.

John (Britprius)

 

Your driving habits are fine with regards to the Prius.

The Prius is highly reliable, but if you have an unwarranted failure and depend upon Toyota dealer service, repair costs can be quite high, well into four-digits.

The Prius electronics are highly complex and the car is subject to failures that you would not encounter with a regular vehicle. For example, the inverter, the brake actuator motor (the hydraulic braking system is of non-traditional design), the multifunction display, the electric air conditioner compressor, the transaxle, etc. Not to mention the numerous ECUs which must continue to perform reliably and remain in communication with each other (a partial list includes the engine, hybrid vehicle, traction battery, transmission control, skid control, body, immobilizer, steering, SRS, etc.)

If a non-hybrid car fails, you usually will have numerous independent servicing alternatives. Depending upon your locale, you may not have many competent independent Toyota hybrid servicers available to you.

If you plan to DIY, I suggest you subscribe to techinfo.toyota.com so that you have access to factory repair manual information. You can save a substantial amount on repair costs if you use used parts from salvage vehicles, to the extent that your car suffers failure of an expensive part.

 

That kind of driving will net you so much gain with the Prius. The more you drive it, the more money you will save. So that's about 1000 miles a month or 12000 a year. At that rate, that 06 would likely last you 8-10 years with very few issues, net you about 43+ mpg (I say 43 to take in acoount for the winter months where you live), save you tons of money on tolls and get you from point A to point B in comfort.

 

No worries, I'm sorry to hijack your thread. Good luck

 

For the Prius being used on a daily basis is good the stops will not harm the car and the US version has a system that pumps the hot coolant from the engine into a thermos tank when you turn it off. When you restart it the hot coolant is returned to the engine to give a speedy warm up and the engine produces lower emissions.
The Prius doe not have a starter motor in the normal sense, and does not start the engine using the 12 volt battery. It uses one of the motors built into the transmission, and the high voltage traction battery spinning the engine up to speed in milliseconds before adding fuel and spark. It does this almost silently.
If you buy the Prius I would recommend the date on top of the 12 volt battery is checked and if original get it changed or better still have it changed by the seller as part of the deal.
Because the 12 volt battery is not used for turning over the engine you do not get that slow struggling noise you get with a normal car. The 12 volt battery in your situation will lead a good life as it is only used to boot the computers and run some pumps when starting the car "actually called being made ready since depending on the circumstances the engine may not start, but you can drive away.
The Prius also does not have an alternator since the engine does not run all the while around town, something it was built for in particular the gen2, the gen3 (2010 on) was built more with freeways in mind.
The AC also runs from the traction battery not the engine and the compressor varies it's speed automatically as requirements vary. Again this is because the engine may not be running. It therefore does not have such an impact on mpg.
In short the Prius is ideal for the sort of runs you are likely to be doing.
The car does like the warmer weather producing better mpg figures in the summer, but it is very good all year round.

John (Britprius

 

I recently had to euthanize my 1993 Toyota Corolla DX Wagon (292k miles - NHDMV Inspection failed - (sob!)) - I was looking for something to replace it - I looked (briefly) at a Yaris, but was somewhat turned off by the distinct "clang!" made when the driver's door closed. I thought my old Corolla was not only quieter, but nicer to drive. After looking at some others, I ended up with a 2009 Gen II Prius (83k miles - only just broken in for a Toyota) - for pics see my photos, its name is "Chuggypig" and after only a month and a half, I'm starting to really love it!

 

I think people have misunderstood or become unnecessarily defensive about my post.

I was striving to give advice to the OP. Specific to the situation he was outlining.
He said some things in the original post that would lead me to believe that budget and reliability going forward might be paramount to his ownership experience.
Primarily that a Yaris was at the "Top" of his budget, he has 2 kids under 5, and had been driving a 02 Monte Carlo.

The Prius he was considering is now 8 model years old. While the mileage is low for a vehicle that age, there are concerns with any vehicle that starts to reach the decade old stage.

This lead me to potentially recommend the newer Yaris...over the Prius. Which seems to have offended some of my Prius owning brethren. But I just think the Yaris in this situation has a better chance of a lower ownership cost over the next 5-10 years.

Could I be wrong? Certainly. But those championing the Prius choice could also be wrong, we are predicting the future reliability of a machine.

The OP wanted "advice"...I offered my opinion.

I would not be offended if the choice turned out to be The Prius...and it could become a very successful choice. I own a Prius...I like Prius.

Congratulations on your Prius choice. I hope you have many, many years of enjoyable Hybrid ownership. I'm enjoying my ownership right now.

 

I do love all three of those cars--each of them would probably be a good, practical choice. I think the test-drive really tells most as for which one to select. Often, the car picks the driver. Everyone is different (thank goodness), and each driver has different preferences in a vehicle. Once you narrow down your favorite vehicle, it might be a good idea to find some more examples and not limit yourself to just those three.

I am definitely a proponent of the 2nd-generation Prius. It is a more upscale vehicle than the other two choices, and Toyota's Hybrid Synergy Drive (HSD) is absolutely groundbreaking in its operation, ownership experience and driving experience, not to mention the reduced exhaust emissions and fuel consumption.

It can be difficult to get a grasp of failure rates and reliability from a user forum, due to the human nature of being much more likely to publicize failures in a product than satisfaction. The impression from reading user forums can be pretty grim but for each post of a problem or failure, there are likely hundreds of drivers out there having very satisfying ownership experiences.

I just picked up Consumer Reports' auto issue, where Prius reliability continues to be praised. They list it as among the most reliable vehicles in production. The Prius C has been selected again as the lowest-cost car to own and operate. Toyota traction pack failure rates have continued to best the industry, with rates at a fraction of one percent for 2009 examples and 3-4% for 2001 (with the shorter-lived packs than the subsequent generations). In comparison, failure rates for the traction pack in the Honda Civic Hybrid for 2009 are approaching 30% (I was stunned as well).

Odds are good that the Prius will save you money over the other choices, but there is a slight risk of expensive repairs, as with any vehicle.

Good luck!