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Prius Plug-in and Volt Pros and Cons

Discussion in 'Gen 1 Prius Plug-in 2012-2015' started by Bill Norton, May 9, 2014.

  1. GregP507

    GregP507 Senior Member

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    I'm not a heated seats fan, I always feel itchy down there when I have them on. 10 minutes of engine running is enough time to warm things up in the interior of the car.
     
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  2. Jeff N

    Jeff N The answer is 0042

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    Nope, I paid $41,000 MSRP (including destination fee) in 2010 to get one of the first modern J1772 plugin cars delivered (VIN 42) and have been happily driving it for just under 3.5 years and 82,000 miles. I could have waited for prices to drop but had already been waiting years for a real plugin hybrid and I wasn't going to wait any longer.

    I have a long commute and can recharge at 240v at work so I typically drive EV 80-100 miles per day without range anxiety. I think of it as having saved $50,000 by not getting a Model S.
     
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  3. -1-

    -1- Don

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    :)Our thoughts and PIP experience are almost identical. No other EV plans for me at the present.
     
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  4. usbseawolf2000

    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

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    The source is from a paper GM wrote. That's where all the misinformation are from.

    I lived in Queens, NY. The electricity isn't cheaper than gas but cleaner. If it weren't for the very short commute, gas would have been cheaper to run.

    Short trips are bad for gas due to cold start up penalty. You won't get 50 MPG, more like 35-45 depending on how short.

    That's where the benefit of short EV range comes in.

    Now that I am in NJ, the electricity rate is lower.
     
  5. Jeff N

    Jeff N The answer is 0042

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    Huh?
     
  6. Lourun

    Lourun Member

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    Welcome to Jersey!
     
  7. Bill Norton

    Bill Norton Senior Member

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    Really? I had a '10 Prius, I looked into the homebuilt kits to turn it into a PiP.
    I'm pretty sure I studied the subject.

    The only difference with a factory PiP is the SW allowing higher speeds and some more torque from MG2 before the stinker comes on. MG1 is still consuming power to keep the engine at rest; is this true? Can someone with the Torque app weigh in?
    It is perfectly suited for some people. Although is routine engine maintenance scheduled strictly by the odometer?
    Some PHEV's leave the engine in hibernation for a long time and adjust engine maintenance accordingly.

    Don't know about a 'GM Paper'. I do know Lutz wanted a "Leap in Technology" over the Prius.
    The PiP is a kind of an added little trick, a short skip?
    But, it suits some perfectly. Especially the Tough Guys that drive it short distances all winter without heat. I'm a geek. I'd do it that way too !!
     
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  8. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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    Chevrolet recommends using the seat heaters rather than HVAC to keep warm during Winter.
     
  9. Bill Norton

    Bill Norton Senior Member

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    Say what?
    I never saw this stated anywhere.
    I choose to heat my Volt anyway I want to.
    Which usually involves a 10 minute "Precondition" while the car is plugged in. At home and at work. You can do this twice plugged in or not.
    This can be started via the phone app from anywhere with cell reception.
    I can start the preheat or precool as soon as I'm on the ground at the airport, for example.

    My EV range has been as low as 23 miles once in -5°F weather. But I was comfy! The car was comfy as soon as I opened to door to start my commute. I did not make the engine come out of hibernation. ( you can hack that 15°F engine assisted heating thing. don't tell.)
     
  10. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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  11. mindmachine

    mindmachine Member

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    I drove all winter with just seat heating, but hay it's no big deal, how much does a car warm up in 4 or 5 miles unless you fire it up in the drive and let it idle a long time before you depart. Plus short trips are bad for the engine and exhaust system. Plus short trips in the winter in my 2010 Prius were low mileage on gas. I would only get 35 MPG most of the time and occasionally 40 MPG.

    Anyway I just filled up on my way home from church today, first fill up since 12/28/13. 598 miles driven, 95 straight highway (interstate too)miles driven all in one day and the rest local rural roads and some highway 7 miles highway every Sunday. Took 3.9 gallons. Of that total 95 miles were all on one day of 60 to 75 MPH, that would be around 95 miles/56 mpg= 1.7 gallons, so the remaining 403 miles rural mostly EV during this winter 403 miles/2.2 gal= 199.5 MPG and 92 kwh of electricity ($11.50 for electricity). This was mostly winter miles with temps in the 20, 30 and 40 deg F range. So $11.50 for electricity and $ 7.70 for gas is $19.20 / 403 miles = $0.0476 per mile.

    A Volt would not serve my need as well as the Prius Plug-in because we drive 600 miles a day in the Prius when we go on vacation. When on the freeway driving 70 to 75 MPH I will get 56 to 58 MPG. So if you want a all around PHEV that excels in both worlds then the Prius plug-in is the class leader in my book.
     
  12. jdk2

    jdk2 Active Member

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    Can you expound on this sentence please? Total miles for the mileage stated and was a fully charged EV part of the equation?

    I'm trying to wrap my head around a 56-58 MPG trip at 70-75 MPH. I don't doubt you but I'm just very curious as I would think are others.
     
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  13. GregP507

    GregP507 Senior Member

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    I made nearly exactly that same trip last night, going home from the farm in my PIP. I had a full EV charge, but I deliberately turned off EV mode, and kept the car in Eco mode all the way home, which was almost exactly 120 km (76 miles). The temperature was about 10C which is about 50F. It was a fairly busy 4-6 lane highway, and traffic was moving at a fairly constant 120 kph (75 mph). My tripmeter showed 4.2 L/100 Km average, which equals 56 USMPG.

    I won't say the EV charge didn't help, because it went from 18 km EV range when I left to 15 km EV range by the time I got home, but I doubt it was very significant to the overall mileage. What may have helped a bit was the slipstream of other traffic, but it couldn't have been very much, as I maintained a distance of at least 4 car lengths behind other vehicles.
     
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  14. mindmachine

    mindmachine Member

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    When on the interstate I drive at an average speed of 70 to 75 MPH and in HV mode get typically 56 to 58 MPG.

    Of the 598 miles(all in HV mode) since I last filled up on Dec, 28,13 , 95 miles were on the freeway driving. The other 503 miles were regular local city/rural miles of which 7 miles per week were on a state route back and forth to church on Sunday (50 t0 55 MPH), all other in town. So (i see a mistake in my previous post) anyway. That 503 miles was around 80 plus%
    in EV mode. The result energy usage was 92 kwh of electricity at $ .125 /kwh or $11.50 plus 2.2 gal of gas for $7.70 or total $ 19.20 for 503 miles or $19.20/503= $0.038 /mile.

    The point was the 95 miles was in the 598 miles since I last filled the tank. Those 95 miles were all 4 lane freeway miles driving at 75 MPH and the gas consumed would have been at 56 to 58 MPG, so I used about 1.7 gallon.

    The remaining 503 miles were short trip local rural driving from 12/28/13 thru today when I filled up the tank with 3.9 gallons. So the 3.9 gallons minus 1.7 gallon estimate sets the stage for my winter driving of 503 miles on 2.2 gallons and 92 kwh of electricity. Shows how little or infrequently the ICE ran in those 4 month's.

    I know I went around robin-hood's barn a few times here. Hope it is a little clearer as to what I am trying to say.
    (for volt owners that think the Prius plug-in can't do much in EV mode and has to be forced to do EV.......)
     
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  15. jdk2

    jdk2 Active Member

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    Thank you.
     
  16. Bill Norton

    Bill Norton Senior Member

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    I believe you had an indicated 56-58 MPG.
    But how can that be?
    You know a 30 MPH tail winds can really help. Round trip tests usually factor this out.
    On a good day my Gen3 would maybe get 48 MPG going 70-80 MPH.

    I have a bud that drives 500 miles a night as a bank courier with his Gen3. He has accurate Speed vs. MPG data using round trip data at different temps. He can tell you his Prius never sees anything close to 56-58mpg.
    He has the Fuelly page to prove his claims. I'll ask about posting his link.

    Yes, 600 mile vacations are fun, but do you base a car purchase on a few(?) vacations a year?
    I go weeks and weeks getting MPG and my engine maintenance needs adjust accordingly.

    Hey, I made a round trip to the airport today and burned some gas !! And my engine got up to temp for awhile!
     
  17. mindmachine

    mindmachine Member

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    Actually I had a headwind that day, I was traveling east to west.
    You did not read my info did you or full comprehend what I said. I have the 2014 PLUGIN Prius, I agree in my 2010 Prius IV I only got 50 to 52 MPG over the exact same route!!! I guess you just hate to see 56 to 58 MPG in HV mode compared to your VOLT.

    I base my car purchases on overall value for sure!
     
  18. Bill Norton

    Bill Norton Senior Member

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    OK, I see, you got 56-58 MPG and act like electricity is not a factor in those numbers.
    I could tell you my "Lifetime MPG" number, but like I said before, these numbers are silly.
    They pretend electricity if free. Fuelly numbers are silly for these cars also.

    (Cool, I had a '10 Prius IV w/ solar sunroof. Loved it! But didn't get 50-52 MPG going 70-80 MPH.)
     
  19. mindmachine

    mindmachine Member

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    I am not acting like electricity played no part but it did not, I was driving from Baltimore Maryland all in HV mode as my EV charge was DEPLETED THE NIGHT BEFORE AND I DID NOT HAVE ANY PLACE TO RECHARGE AS I WAS FROM OUT OF TOWN. 410 MILES ALL IN HV MODE AT AN AVERAGE 57 MPG.
     
  20. mindmachine

    mindmachine Member

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    The best I ever got in my 2010 Prius IV was 52 MPG on the same trip. The extra battery capacity in the Plug-in helps recover more energy on this particular trip, Baltimore MD to Columbus OH. Hence 57 MPG even with a headwind. This is a trip we make frequently, exact same route.
     
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