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Rapid full/empty battery cycling

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by Drew Gallatin, Feb 24, 2015.

  1. Drew Gallatin

    Drew Gallatin New Member

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    I have an 2006 prius with ~137K on it. We parked at it at the airport for a week (SFO, so cool, somewhat salty air, temps between 40F and 70F).

    On the way home it started acting funny. At the airport, my wife commented that the car seemed to have less power than usual, but we chalked that up to having gotten used to the more peppy rental car we had on our trip. After we got off the freeway & onto 35 mph surface streets on the way home (after about 25miles at 65mph, so car was fully warm), we noticed the car running & stopping at odd times. It was about 55F outside, and the heat & A/C were both off, with just the cabin fan running on the lowest speed.

    While on the surface streets, I turned the MFD to the battery display, and I saw it cycling rapidly between very low (purple, 2 bars) to very high (green, all bars). It cycled at least twice in the space of a mile on 35mph streets. No warning lights were lit. I've been driving this car for almost 9 years, and I've never seen it act like this.

    Is this a failure symptom for the hybrid battery? We bought the car in NC (non-carb), and later moved to CA, so I expect that I'm outside my warranty period.

    Thanks,

    Drew
     
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    ugh. sure sounds like it, those are classic symptoms. check in with luscious garage.
     
  3. Drew Gallatin

    Drew Gallatin New Member

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    Thanks.. For whatever reason, I had a fairly hard time finding the classic failure symptoms... Most everything I found about failure suggested there would be idiot lights on.

    Any chance it is the 12v? The car's almost 9 years old, and that has never been replaced..
     
  4. Kevin06prius

    Kevin06prius Junior Member

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    If the 12 volt was never replaced I would do that about 5 years ago. I would take it to autozone or advanced auto parts and have them test it. Either way, if you plan to keep the car I would get that done.
     
  5. Britprius

    Britprius Senior Member

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    Although in general agreement with the comments on the 12 volt battery because of it's age it cannot be that bad if it started the car after a week of none use.
    I'm afraid as already stated rapid cycling of the HV battery is a sign of failure. It may be that a grid charger re balance at this stage could extend it's life. It would be best to do this before there is any chance of reverse charging one of the cells.

    John (Britprius)
     
  6. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    if you're going to keep the car, start with the 12 volt, since you need one anyway. who knows, might get lucky?
     
  7. Drew Gallatin

    Drew Gallatin New Member

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    Thanks, all.

    I will get the 12v checked and maybe replaced soon. If that doesn't fix it, I'll take it in to the dealer we use here to see how they'll handle the warranty issue before trying luscious. If there's a chance I get get this fixed for free, I don't want to miss it..

    Thanks again,

    Drew
     
  8. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    This car is under warranty in California. Let the hv battery fail and throw a code. You'll get a new one for free. Do not prolong the battery life. You'll hate yourself for doing it
     
  9. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    the car was purchased in north carolina.
     
  10. Drew Gallatin

    Drew Gallatin New Member

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    I assume from other threads I've read here that since the car was purchased in a non-CARB state, that means that I'm out of luck. Assuming its not the 12v (and I still have not had time to have it checked), I'll try to take it to the dealer.
     
  11. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    never hurts to ask, all the best!(y)
     
  12. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

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    I've also had funny behavior after sitting in the airport a week, especially if A/C is on you drain battery.
    What I try to do in this situation, let the car warm up and charge the battery for a few minutes before pulling away. Another thing might help if it is cool, put the heat on a little a this makes the ICE run to make the heat and charge up the battery a little more. In any case, I 've also noticed on sitting for days or weeks the HV batt seems to dive. I also turn off the SKS system (button under the steering wheel) to preserve the 12v, but even so it still seems the HV batt needs a little warm up.
     
  13. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

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    That's probably true but if you live a CARB state, that's the first requirement. Toyota often helps if asked properly and somebody's gotta tell me why a CARB certified Prius registered in a CARB state does not qualify. But I am not sure HV battery is bad yet.
     
  14. exstudent

    exstudent Senior Member

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    Hate to rain on your hope for CARB HV Battery warranty, but here's the likely reality.

    1) Previous owner(s) in non-CARB State may have had warranty work performed during course of ownership; ie Inverter Pump recall, Intermediate Steering Shaft, etc.
    2) Dear owner letter sent out to registered owner about the extended warranty on the combo meter display.
    3) Any maintenance performed at a Toyota Dealership will have logged VIN, license plate (State of vehicle registration).
    4) Because of 1,2,&3 above, Toyota will see that the car was in a non-CARB State.

    Current owner can check what has/hasn't been done to his Prius by inquiring online at Toyota
    Toyota Owners Official Web Site: Service Coupons, Owner's Manuals, Service Scheduling And More

    Look-up status of any recall. Remote possibility that NO Recall work was performed; if so, current owner might have some hope, esp if previous owner never had a Toy dealership perform any maintenance work.
    Lookup Safety Recalls & Service Campaigns by VIN

    You can always ask and hope that Toy gives you a good will gesture.
     
  15. Drew Gallatin

    Drew Gallatin New Member

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    As an update.... I'm the original owner. I paid full price, waited months, & didn't even get to pick the color back in 2006 when I ordered it. I had it serviced at the dealer where I bought it in NC for the first 6 years of its life until I moved here.

    My wife took it to the garage around the corner this morning. We had not driven it since the weirdness on the way back from the airport. When she started it, the idiot lights were on. The shop read the codes, which indicated the hybrid battery has failed. They called the dealership they deal with & the dealership is claiming it is out of warranty (as expected) since it was originally purchased & titled in NC. We got a quote for $2700 for a new battery & $600 to install it. We actually don't like/trust this dealer, and I'm trying to get a quote from the dealership we like. We're also trying to find out what the warrantee on the replacement battery is.

    Right now, I'm trying to decide between going with a new battery from the dealer & a cheaper rebuilt option from an independent shop or evenh something like battery4prius. This is a second car , so we're not in a rush to spend $3300
     
  16. exstudent

    exstudent Senior Member

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    NEW Toyota HV Battery Warranty is ONE year, unlimited miles. This warranty applies to nearly all of their parts as well. Except struts/shock if installed by an overpriced dealer, then you get "lifetime" warranty.

    NEW HV Battery will outlive a rebuilt. But this is your decision and payment. A NEW HV Battery could increase the resale value?

    Camelback Toyota (Phoenix, AZ), has a NEW Battery for $2174.48. However, there have been people who have had difficulty in getting a dealer to sell them the HV Battery. Maybe call and ask Camelback to see if they will sell to you. If they do, you'll have to do a road trip w/ the old battery to drop off when you pick-up the new battery, to avoid the $1350 CORE fee (refundable).
    2007 Toyota Prius Parts - Camelback Toyota Parts - Genuine OEM Parts - Free Shipping

    Dealers always want to replace the ECU that in housed inside the HV Battery compartment. I believe it is Part Number: 8998147212 (Control Module), $310.01 at Camelback. Many people who have replaced the original HV Battery w/ a NEW or rebuilt one, seem to have been OK reusing the control module. You could knock off $300+ in parts by reusing your original control module.

    You can still call Toyota and ask if they can cut you a break (25%, 50% off), since you did buy it new, and had it serviced by a dealer for all those years. Worst they can say is no, which is where you are at.

    If you are in the SF Bay Area, call Lusciou's Garage (SF) or Art's Automotive (Berkeley) to see what they charge.
    If you are in the LA area, try Avi's Advance Automotive (1050 S La Brea Ave, Inglewood, CA 90301); (310) 426-8432; www.hybridfix.com

    Good luck.
     
  17. Drew Gallatin

    Drew Gallatin New Member

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    Interestingly, the dealership I like claims, after looking up the VIN, that they'll be able to get it repaired under warranty. They are a much bigger operation, and my guess is that they have more pull with Toyota. Either that, or it is some kind of bait & switch.

    This place is ~12mi from my house. Do I dare drive it? They said I should probably have it towed, but were a bit wishy-washy (He didn't actually say this, but it seemed like he'd get in trouble saying not to tow it, but he would not personally tow it if it were him)
     
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  18. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

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    Wow that is great! I do not know I guess tow is safe approach but you might clear codes and limp over OK. I'd go late or something to avoid traffic. The disparity on how these cases are handled is mind boggling.
     
  19. Drew Gallatin

    Drew Gallatin New Member

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    As an update, I was able to get the battery fixed under warranty at Piercey Toyota in Milpitas. It took a while, as they wanted to replace a filter/fan assembly along with the battery, but it was back-ordered. I didn't want to press them very hard, since they were doing me a huge favor, but it was still back ordered after 10 days, so they went ahead & replaced the hybrid battery pack, and gave me the car back while they wait for the filter/fan assembly to arrive. I highly recommend this dealership; it is also where we bought our 2014 Prius V.

    I've had the car back for a day, and after 50mi on my normal roads, it seems to have regained about 7Mpg, rising from roughly 43Mpg before the battery failure back to the 50Mpg it had when new.
     
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  20. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

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    OK great well I did not want to jinx it! so I was quiet about it.

    But this positive outcome this is consistent what I said above earlier: I do not personally live in a CARB state, but if I did, somebody would have to explain clearly to me why a CARB certified Prius (they all are) does not qualify for CARB warranty in a CARB state. Especially a 2006 which I don't think has wording in the warranty to say anything to the contrary.

    If there is a better explanation of why Toyota covered in this apparent non-warranty exception (purchased outside CARB) please let me know if possible (PM if necessary).

    PS- How'd you end up getting the car to the dealer for service?
     
    #20 wjtracy, Mar 15, 2015
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2015