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Little and big things that should change

Discussion in 'Gen 4 Prius Main Forum' started by pakitt, Mar 24, 2016.

  1. pakitt

    pakitt Senior Member

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    I ordered my gen4 this past Monday. I test drove it before that and clear I had a good enough impression to decide to give in my gen3.
    There a few little and big things that I hope they have changed in the new version and maybe somebody with a gen4 can already tell me if there have been positive changes.
    In no particular order:

    • The wiper relay that "click clacks" when using intermittent mode
    • The AC that starts stinking after 2-3 years of use and needs cleaning/disinfection from the dealer
    • More fuel efficient heating in winter that doesn't require to set the cabin temp to 19C rather than a comfy 22C for city trips, because otherwise the engine would be a lot of time on simply to heat you...(e.g. better cabin insulation would help...)
    • Higher speed that the electric motor can sustain at higher speeds or when the better has only 2-3 bars left...
    • That the engine starts the warm up process when I am actually moving from my parking position and not when I am still standing there looking at something in my phone or setting up navigation, wasting fuel for no movement
    • That the electic motor can push the car at city speeds when increasing a bit speed even when the mid-line of the energy bar has been reached, essentially that the electric motor has enough power now to make some noticeable acceleration rather than simply gliding up to a certain (limited) speed
    • (This is actually going to be new for me, I don't have it on my gen3) That the IPA can actually park the car where I cannot or I think I cannot...
    If I come up with other items I will add them later.

    Thanks for any hints or data about the above!
     
  2. JohnF

    JohnF Active Member

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    #2 - I did not have this problem with my Gen 3. Perhaps something in the air where you drive causes this?
    #3 - Cabin air is used to heat/cool the hybrid battery. The Gen 3 has an air intake near the right side of the rear seat. Possibly the car tries to warm up the cabin air to help the battery get to operating temperature?
    #4 - Toyota definitely changed something in the HSD in the Gen 4 so that it will go EV at far higher speeds than the Gen 3. As I understood it, the Gen 3 was limited to 46mph (74kph) in EV to avoid overrevving one of the electric motors. Because of the way the planetary transmission works, when the gas engine kicks in it slows down the electric motor(s). I don't know how Toyota engineered around this. And yes the battery in the Gen 4 seems stronger than the one in the Gen 3 did.
    #5 - I agree that is very annoying and it seems the same in the Gen 4. On the other hand, this means that the car will run the gas engine as necessary to maintain its interior temperature and battery charge while just sitting there in neutral. Handy if you leave a person or pet in the car while you are shopping or whatever. I'm not sure if there is a logical way around this.
    #5 - Stronger battery in the Gen 4 improves this. An even bigger battery would be nice but it would increase cost, add weight, and take up space (as it does in the Prime and the Volt) so there is a tradeoff.
    #6 - Yes parking a Prius in a tight space is tough because the bumpers scratch so easily. I keep thinking of the Smart car that people park PERPENDICULAR to the curb, at least in Italy. The car is about as long as the width of the parking lane. "Smart Parking" indeed!

    The #1 item on my wish list would be threaded mounting points integrated into the roof underneath the rubber strips on either side. If you wanted a roof rack, you would buy a set of Toyota accessory side rails, peel back the rubber strips, bolt the side rails to the mounting points, cut out sections of the rubber strips, and reinstall the strips. This is how many other vehicles handle it. Very little aero drag with just the side rails, and if you needed to carry something on the roof you would simply clip crossbars to the side rails. The crossbars could be aero cross section and in any case could be carried inside the car when not in use (no wind noise). For people that carry bicycles, this would be better than adding a heavy trailer hitch assembly to carry them behind the car, which adds weight (50 lbs for the hitch assembly?) and impairs access to the rear hatch. Probably will never happen.
     
  3. randomwalk101

    randomwalk101 DYI'er

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    Are you describing the $120k Lexus LS600h or a $30k Toyota Prius?
    It's a $30k to get you to work cheaply. I don't expect too much other than it runs. However my $200k weekend car my expectations are a little higher ;)
     
  4. pakitt

    pakitt Senior Member

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    If you are referring to my original post, my 30k€ gen3 was otherwise quite good and those are small annoyances I didn't notice (AC and wiper relay noise) in my previous 20k€ VW Polo. So there are ways to do better with less.
    I hope that Gen4 is actually better on those little things.
    The rest is due to overall power train design - and "nice to have" changes.
     
  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    from what i've read here, most of those things are improved.
     
  6. 'LectroFuel

    'LectroFuel Senior Member

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    The battery is definitely stronger in G4. I can't say about the G3, but my G2 can barely run on electric only for 1 minute.

    The battery has never gone below half in my G4 while driving or stopped. It's FREAKY. I was stopping to pick up my son from soccer practice one night. I waited in the car for about 30 minutes and the car only dropped one bar during that time with the A/C turned on and the radio playing.

    The IPA works OK, as long as you scan for the correct spot. My car thinks you can parallel park in a 1 foot "parking spot" between two cars. I found that pulling up beside the car you want to park in front of and then scanning the spot works best. It works fantastic as long as the car scans the right spot.
     
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  7. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    Due to the increased efficiency of the inverter and electric motor (reduced electrical losses), you can accelerate more easily with the electric motors. With our 2016 (Li-ion version), you can accelerate past the midway point on the HSI and still have the engine stay off. The battery meter swings more wildly than the NiMH versions of the Gen 3 and Gen 2 (I think the Gen 3 has a larger range for the 6th battery bar than the Gen 2 because it doesn't move as often and when it drops to 4 bars, it continues dropping precipitously to 2 bars while on the Gen 2, it's more evenly distributed). Anyway, the point is, the engine is more eager to stay off.
     
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  8. pakitt

    pakitt Senior Member

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    Note: the versions sold in EU have all the NiMH battery to my knowledge.
    Aren't the 2 types equivalent in terms of stored energy, except of course size and weight?
    And then, why selling a Li-Ion version in the USA only? (What about Canada?)
     
  9. JohnF

    JohnF Active Member

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    The battery on my 2 ECO has been down to 2 bars. Just like the Gen 3, at 2 bars it gets anxious to run a regen cycle, I've never gotten it down to 1 bar. Perhaps Toyota thinks we will worry if only 1 bar is showing? At the top end, I don't think I have ever seen the top bar lit.

    Not on mine. If I push the load a touch past the midbar the gas engine kicks on. It allows maybe one bar-width above the midbar and only briefly, unlike my Gen 3, which triggered exactly at the midbar. On a fairly level section of road I drive frequently, the speed limit is 40mph, which puts the load just at the point where it triggers the gas engine. I can manage 38mph on the battery but 40mph is a juggling act.
     
  10. I'mJp

    I'mJp Senior Member

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    If I had to guess, and I am.
    Perhaps there is a patent, or a tax or some other governmental block.
     
  11. KenzoTH

    KenzoTH Member

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    Yes, a recessed threaded mounting system would be excellent. I have a hitch mount on my Gen 3 and it works but is heavy with the rack. I am considering the SeaSucker suction cup mounting rack for my bike on my Gen 4- although Rhino Racks makes a top rack that fits both my Gen 3 and 4- but it has the metal clamp mounting brackets that will invariably cause scratches to the door edges.
     
  12. pakitt

    pakitt Senior Member

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    On my gen3 I never saw one single bar, but I have seen very often the battery fully charged.

    They sell the Prius v/+ with LiIon battery inside.
    I think it has to do more with marketing and the lack of need of selling such type of battery to a market that hardly considers the Prius as a car to buy, apart from Taxi drivers.... :(
     
  13. kithmo

    kithmo Couch Potato

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    UK Excel Gen 4 has an ECO setting for the heater, which acts the same as if you had the car in ECO driving mode when you don't. You can also choose S-Mode where it directs heat only to the front seats and the window vents (for demisting) and if the passenger seat is unoccupied only to the driver (and vents). The gen 4 does make more use of the electric motor and regen seems more efficient than the Gen 3 was. The SIPA is way better and quicker than the old gen 3 one was. With this one you just roll up press the SIPA button, once for parallel parking, twice for back in parking, and follow the screen prompts for when to brake and when to select D or R and it takes you in. If it looks like it's going to hit something it tells you to stop, change gear then resume, so it sometimes shuffles back and forth where a more skilled driver (parker) may get in first time. But it can get in to quite tight spaces where a less skilled driver may not have the confidence to attempt to park (although I personally choose not to park in tight spaces for fear of getting door dings). The engine still starts up about 10 seconds after the READY light comes on, but you can prevent this by pressing the EV button as soon as the READY light comes on, as you could with the Gen 3. Sorry but the stinky AC I'm afraid is down to you, you get out what you put in, if you let the inside of the car get damp, use the recirc button a lot, drive in stinky (industrial) areas and/or don't change the cabin filter often enough, you're going to get bacteria in the AC system vents.
     
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  14. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    Canada has the Li-Ion but those models (Touring and Technology models) are only sold in 3 metropolitan areas - Vancouver, Toronto and Montreal. Only the NiMH model (which is the base model) is sold nationwide.

    But yours is a NiMH battery. This is why I mentioned that mine is Li-Ion. We can start to see the differences between how the batteries behave even though the output is the same.

    It's nice that they separate ECO mode (for throttle applications) and ECO Heat/Cool (for climate operations) so that you can pick and choose the combination you want.
     
  15. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    interestingly, when i'm out of wall charge, my li-on behaves almost exactly like my '04 and '08.
    i wonder if the newer batteries have changed, the software, or both.