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Toyota to double up on hybrids

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by DaveG, Jun 14, 2006.

  1. DaveG

    DaveG Member

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    Toyota Motor said on Tuesday that it would double the number of hybrid cars in its vehicle lineup soon after 2010, renewing its endorsement of the technology as critical to reducing pollution and oil dependence.

    Link to Full Article - ZDNet.com (June 13th)
     
  2. TonyPSchaefer

    TonyPSchaefer Your Friendly Moderator
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    From the article:
    I'm sensing two seperate trains of thought here.
     
  3. larkinmj

    larkinmj New Member

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    Another interesting comment in this article (although probably not relevant to us here in the U.S.):

     
  4. DeadPhish

    DeadPhish Senior Member

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    Consider this link from the Toyota Georgetown website:

    http://www.toyotageorgetown.com/hybrid/ths4.asp

    Note that all the technologies being considered, including diesel, advance up through a hybrid technology 'multiplier'. I read your article as further confirmation of this diagram. Whatever powersource can be visualized there will be some hybrid technology to make it even more efficient.
     
  5. bigbaldcuban

    bigbaldcuban New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(DeadPhish @ Jun 14 2006, 05:06 PM) [snapback]271372[/snapback]</div>
    OK, I'm about to make an nice person of myself, but someone complete this list for me
    1. Prius
    2. Higlander
    3. Camry
    4. Lexus 400h
    5. Lexus Sedan
    6. Estima Minivan (In Japan)
    7. ??????
     
  6. larkinmj

    larkinmj New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(bigbaldcuban @ Jun 15 2006, 02:47 PM) [snapback]271751[/snapback]</div>
    Tundra
     
  7. ken1784

    ken1784 SuperMID designer

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(bigbaldcuban @ Jun 16 2006, 03:47 AM) [snapback]271751[/snapback]</div>
    I think the seven models are for Japanese market. They are...

    Prius
    Estima Hybrid minivan (Japan only)
    Alphard Hybrid minivan (Japan only)
    Crown mild Hybrid sedan (Japan only)
    Kluger Hybrid (Highlander Hybrid)
    Harrier Hybrid (Lexsus RX400h)
    Lexsus GS 450h

    Ken@Japan
     
  8. hobbit

    hobbit Senior Member

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    Do they still not acknowledge that there is already a HUGE demand
    for hybrid minivans [estima or sienna or whatever] in the US??
    Crikey, almost everyone I tour around the Prius these days says
    "I really want something like a minivan". C'mon, Toyota, get with it.
    .
    _H*
     
  9. Jonnycat26

    Jonnycat26 New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hobbit @ Jun 15 2006, 09:32 PM) [snapback]271940[/snapback]</div>
    Toyota is probably (justifiably) worried about the reception a hybrid minivan would get. After the HiHy's dismal sales for last year, and the fact that they can only move them by offering incentives that would make GM blush, I'm sure Toyota's carefully weighing the cost/economy scales.
     
  10. larkinmj

    larkinmj New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ Jun 15 2006, 09:34 PM) [snapback]271943[/snapback]</div>
    Two simple ways to ensure better success than with the HiHy:
    1. Get real improvement in fuel economy. Most reports I've heard on the HiHy say real-world MPG in the upper 20s- better than non-hybrid SUVs, but hardly spectacular. Notice that the minivans sold in Japan have 4-cylinder ICEs?
    2. Price it realistically. Loaded HiHys are selling for over $40K; not too many folks want to pay that much for family transportation.
     
  11. rufaro

    rufaro WeePoo, Gen II

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ Jun 15 2006, 06:34 PM) [snapback]271943[/snapback]</div>
    I do not know--to me, "Hybrid SUV" sounds more than a teeny bit oxymoronic...Personally, I would prefer to see a hybrid minivan choice available...I guess that is a predjudice of mine own, but, seems to me that soccer moms and such have more credibility in minivans than suvs--offroad with the team much, mom? [​IMG] And the urban warriors who "need" that SUV to feel "safe," well, my perception that they are more Cadillac buyers--those who pay the 50k or whatever for the Lexus hybrid are a tiny fraction of the market, are they not? I do not know, I'm rambling. I guess all I REALLY mean to say is--I believe there IS a market for hybrid minivans and I would love to see Toyota tap it.
     
  12. Jonnycat26

    Jonnycat26 New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(larkinmj @ Jun 15 2006, 09:49 PM) [snapback]271952[/snapback]</div>
    I agree with you, but I just don't see how a Hybrid minivan is going to achieve much better than 35mpg. The 'SUV economy champ', otherwise known as the Escape Hybrid, nets a combined mileage in the low 30s, and I just don't see that a hybrid minivan is going to do much better. And I can't see one selling for less than the Camry Hybrid, and it's too early to tell whether that will do well or not in the market.

    And loaded HiHy's are loaded for a reason... the hybrid drivetrain ain't cheap and Toyota wants to make as much as possible on each car. But with the incentives they've offered it's safe to say they probably lose money on each HiHy that goes out the door.
     
  13. hobbit

    hobbit Senior Member

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    forget the hihy and the lexus bad-boy equivalent; those are two
    icons of failure on Toyota's part. Let's concentrate on what we
    know is the right way to go.
    .
    _H*
     
  14. galaxee

    galaxee mostly benevolent

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    well if they took the technology and used it for mpg instead of horsepower and torque... and if they decided to lay off the luxury crap that the average minivan driver doesn't care about... they'd manage a good product with decent mpg at a reasonable price.

    the hihy was a bad idea- that and the lexus rx400h. a very bad idea that gave hybrids a reputation for being overpriced and not efficient. at least call the thing a power hybrid and make it obvious what your intent is...
     
  15. larkinmj

    larkinmj New Member

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    Again- I think I see a consensus from other people, and I know what I want- a relatively small, space-efficient hybrid people-mover that seats 7 passengers (not a big, bloated minivan or an SUV) and that gets real world fuel-economy on the order of, say about 40 MPG. If Toyota builds it and prices it fairly, it will sell like hotcakes (why do hotcakes sell so well, anyway? :) )
     
  16. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    Indeed.. a hybrid Corolla Verso maybe?
     
  17. paprius4030

    paprius4030 My first Prius

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    I agree a mini van has to be a 4cyl ICE and seating for 7. We need that Estima mini-van in the US
     
  18. NYHybrid

    NYHybrid New Member

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    I lease a 2006 Highlander Hybrid and own a 2006 Prius (which my wife drives). Obviously the Prius is the mileage king, but the Highlander is awesome.

    I traded in a 2005 Tacoma for the Highlander and am very happy with it. I get 27-28 mpg CITY and haul all sorts of stuff around. Way more room than the Prius, plus its AWD, something we need in the winters in upstate NY. BTW, real life city mileage in the 6 cylinder Tacoma, after 1 year and 20,000 + miles, was just under 18 mpg.

    As for the bad rap SUV's have gotten, I don't really care. I need the room, and the power, for my daily business use. I also happen to own a Honda Minivan. It has its uses, but even with the eco mode, which really does little, it gets real life mileage of just about 17 mpg around town.

    I am just thrilled getting 50% better gas mileage, and still I have 3500 pound towing capacity, AWD, and room for 7. I have actually gotten 7 people in the Highlander Hybrid. The back seats had two kids in their early teens. No problem.

    The one problem I see with the Highlander Hybrid is the steep price premium. With incentives, I paid $16K for a 3 year lease, 45K miles. I think if the Highlander Hybrid sold for $30K, it would be a steal. All in all, I think Toyota was very smart in producing this vehicle. They just got their price point a little high. Just wait until gas is $4 a gallon. Then it will move...
     
  19. Jeannie

    Jeannie Proud Prius Granny

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(paprius4030 @ Jun 19 2006, 11:05 PM) [snapback]273868[/snapback]</div>
    Does anyone have MPG estimates for the two hybrid mini-vans sold in Japan? And I thought I read that the Estima hybrid isn't out yet - it's a 2007 intro - but I may be wrong (astonishing thought! :blink: )
     
  20. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    I think someone quoted the Estima getting 47mpg in the Japanese 10-15 cycle (keep in mind the Prius gets 80mpg or sth like that in Japan)