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Prius' E-Four vs. High Output E-Four

Discussion in 'Gen 4 Prius Main Forum' started by Tideland Prius, Mar 22, 2017.

  1. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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  2. alanclarkeau

    alanclarkeau Senior Member

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    Is this only the Japan market? And it didn't mention if the rear motor regenerates on braking?

    Isn't this already happening in other makes - it's a bit like the Mitsubishi PHEV (2012->) which has separate front & rear electric motors (though I think it might directly drive from the ICE?).
     
  3. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    For the Prius? Yes, it's for the home market only. I'm not sure if it does regenerative braking.

    For other markets, they do have the high output E-Four. In North America, it's labelled as 4WD-i or AWD-i. The Highlander Hybrid (Kluger) and RX400h were the first in 2005 (2006MY). @efusco had a 2006 HiHy back in the day. I think @hill has an RXh. Those had rear motors that do regenerative braking. AWD versions actually got better fuel economy than 2WD versions because of that.
     
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  4. pakitt

    pakitt Senior Member

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    I am honestly totally puzzled by Toyota's central and regional marketing teams. They sell the most nonsense configurations sometimes and with the E-Four totally ignored, because "they know better". They know for some reason that nobody wants a 4WD Prius... how? They never offered such a thing...
    Or maybe they don't have the production capacity....
    Or like offering the Prius Prime 12k€ more expensive than the regular Prius. Smart choice to make sure you will sell them....at all....
     
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  5. bhtooefr

    bhtooefr Senior Member

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    It could also be a case of cannibalizing higher-profit vehicles - for instance, they probably make more on a RAV4 Hybrid than they would on a Prius E-Four.

    The Japanese market demands AWD on almost everything - even kei cars - whereas the US market will buy a higher-profit crossover to get AWD. (And, for that matter, the US market will buy that crossover even in FWD trim, to get the higher ride height.)

    Also, I suspect the Prius Prime pricing strategy in the US is compliancey - the ZEV credit system is requiring the Prime to subsidize all other models that Toyota sells in 10 US states.
     
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  6. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Lexus/Toyota's (our) RX-400 /hihy have offered AWD for over a decade on these hybrids. They're just now getting around to tooting their own horn - as others are offering it up too - as mentioned in another post above.
     
    #6 hill, Mar 23, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2017
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  7. jdenenberg

    jdenenberg EE Professor

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    In my case the lack of a Prius AWD option cost Toyota a sale as we bought an AWD Subaru Crosstrek to go with my 2016 Prius. Had Toyota offered the E-Four option, we would have purchased two of them last year.

    JeffD
     
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  8. bhtooefr

    bhtooefr Senior Member

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    Keep in mind that Toyota owns 16.5% of Subaru, too...
     
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  9. jdenenberg

    jdenenberg EE Professor

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    So Toyota only lost 83.5% of a sale to my household due to their marketing decision.

    JeffD
     
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  10. pakitt

    pakitt Senior Member

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    In Germany (Europe) they promoted the Rav like crazy. I hardly ever saw an ad on the road about the Prius.
     
  11. David Beale

    David Beale Senior Member

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    The really funny thing is on "Driving Television" they constantly say "AWD" is a must have in Canada to sell cars/SUVs. Maybe the local Toyota "managers" aren't listening? Or maybe the Canadian market is too small to matter? It's smaller than California!
     
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  12. jdenenberg

    jdenenberg EE Professor

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    Toyota Prius marketing is focused on California and Florida where Prii sell well. They miss how many more Prii would be purchased in northern climes if the offered AWD.

    JeffD
     
  13. bbald123

    bbald123 Thermodynamics Law Enforcement

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    So, I'm curious why everybody thinks AWD would help Prius sales in the snow belt.

    With the low ground clearance, I find it hard to rationalize how the extra drive wheels would help much. By the time you need the extra traction provided, you're alreay pushing snow with the front bumper and underside of the car, I would think.

    I have driven in a couple of inches of new snow on hard-pack and had no issues with the FWD. Maybe thing are different when you are in an area with powder snow versus the slop we normally get in Pennsylvania?
     
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  14. jdenenberg

    jdenenberg EE Professor

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    Our issue in CT is mostly ice on a slope and there AWD is very useful. Good tires help a lot - I use Nokian WRg2's on my Prius.

    JeffD
     
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  15. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Studs too (not permitted in all states - but still) .... they've saved us on several icy trips over the decades in MT & ID.
    .
     
  16. bhtooefr

    bhtooefr Senior Member

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    The Prius E-Four does also have slightly higher ground clearance, IIRC.
     
  17. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    There is the matter of cost of certification and cost of the product. Yes people want AWD (it's amazing how well that marketing works) but how much will they pay for it? And also, this is the first compact AWD-i system for use in cars. So far, it's been for use in larger vehicles like the Estima, Alphard/Vellfire, LSh, HiHy/RXh and RAV4.

    Yeah I think the ground clearance is the same as the Gen 3.
     
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  18. bhtooefr

    bhtooefr Senior Member

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    LSh isn't using electric AWD, it's using a mechanical AWD system similar to the LS 460 AWD.
     
  19. David Beale

    David Beale Senior Member

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    We think that because the great unwashed public thinks that AWD is "better" in winter areas. Don't muddy the waters with facts. It's what people think that matters. Just like with the stock market. ;)
     
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  20. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    Really? Huh. I must've forgotten. Thanks!