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Concerned about Avid Ascend MPG

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Main Forum' started by Kurt Weiske, Mar 29, 2019.

  1. Kurt Weiske

    Kurt Weiske Active Member

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    I have a 2014 PiP and a 2014 Subaru Crosstrek, both with around 100K miles. I replaced Michelin Defenders and Pirelli PZeros with Avid Ascends, and both cars, with close to 1500 miles, seem to be taking a SERIOUS MPG hit. I'd expect the Ascends to perform similar to my Defenders, and beat the Pirellis once broken in.

    I used to get 48-50 mpg in the Prius, now seeing 40-46. The Subaru is rated at 25 city/33 Highway, in 40 miles of highway and street driving it's reporting 19.8 mpg.

    Has anyone else seen a mileage hit with Avid Ascends lately? Maybe I got a bad batch?
     
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    often, new tires require break in. also, the radius will be larger compared to worn tires, affecting your odometer.
     
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  3. Kurt Weiske

    Kurt Weiske Active Member

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    I'm still seeing a MPG hit, and I'm at almost 2000 miles. I'd think any break-in would be over by now.
     
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  4. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    This part is much less than people think. Remember that the contact path on the road doesn't have a radius. It is flat, so the normal circle equations don't work.

    The more meaningful wheel measure is the length of the steel belts beneath the tread. These control the working rolling circumference more strongly than does the actual tread radius, and should not change much with tread wear.

    A better check is to compare the RPM (revolutions per mile) spec on on new vs old tire data sheets. If these are different, the change will impact both odometer and speedometer calibrations, and thus MPG too.
     
  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    what do we know about avid ascends?
     
  6. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    For tire size 195/65R15:

    Michelin Defender: RPM = 832, dia = 25.0"
    Pirelli PZero: n/a this wheel size
    Avid Ascend: RPM = 828, dia = 25.1"

    The Ascend's RPM differs by 0.5%, but because it shifts both odometer (car goes farther than odo displays) and speedometer readings {testing at higher wind drag point) readings, net result will be about a 1% shift in apparent (not real) MPG.

    This accounts for part of your MPG loss, but certainly not the bulk of it.
     
  7. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    Also, make sure that you were comparing against earlier winter MPG, not some remembered MPG tests from last spring-summer-fall. Winter mileage is hampered by lower energy content of the seasonal fuel blends, and often by weather. Both should be improving about now.
     
  8. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    My PiP had Avid Ascend TouringS tires. On a recent rainy and windy trip to North Carolina, I averaged a whisker over 50 mpg.
     
  9. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    This was some years ago, but I had Yoko Avid Ascend on my HCH as summer tires. I was getting 48-52 mpg which was better than later changed Ecopia.
     
  10. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    Here is an illustration of the difference. The Michelins with 25.0" tread diameter, compute out to a rolling diameter of just 24.24". The Avids have 25.1" tread diameter, but only 24.36" of rolling diameter. Between both sides, that is 3/4" of rubber, or 12/32nds" on each side, that doesn't contribute to the working rolling diameter.

    12/32nds is slightly deeper than the original tread, so the true rolling circle surface is slightly below the actual tread. I.e. about where the steel belts are.
     
  11. BZzap!

    BZzap! Senior Member

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    The original Yokohama tire that the Prius (2012) sported were developed especially for the their low rolling resistance. It’s partly responsible for the fuel mileage figures that Toyota was able to post. They were very light weight (18 lbs). The Avid Assends that OP put on his car are full 3 pounds heavier than the original stock tire, coming in at 21 lbs per tire. That mass requires more horse power to get the car rolling and up to speed. Hence, the fuel mileage is going to suffer.