Punitive taxes for hybrid owners.

It isn't a fine, it is a tax.

But if you don't like it, feel free to pay several times that difference in higher fuel bills for a non-hybrid. And highly likely end up paying more in total taxes too.

 

There are 2 flavors:

1. Fred’s House of Pancakes where only off topic threads reside
2. Fred’s House of Politics where the true off topic threads reside and the kid gloves come off

Just a heads up.

 

We’re trending towards #2 at this point .

Get ready for purgatory .

 

I most certainly don't worship government, but am seriously frustrated at our modern levels of deficit spending. Citizens who demand discounted services, paid for not by you and me but instead by that guy behind the tree, most certainly are not helping keep us from this fiscal collapse.

 

Any car even a model T only needs to meet the laws at the time of manufacture, my 81 Comutacar is in the same category.
Just brought the title in walked out with plates. My Insight will get free lifetime plates next year when it turns 21.

If I run the Subaru right to the floor boards continuous I get 50mpg at redline
Around town with mild hypermiling I can get
usually around 80ish if I’m not actively trying but I do run 38psi in the tires. (Manual calls for 24)

The old foggies on the 360 forum throw the consumer Reports quality of review in with the Consumer Reports spontaneously exploding battery description of the Citicar.

Not sure how you would get that low, even with the choke on brakes dragging in winter.
Maybe CR tested the 360 3 speed pickup?

 

Shaould we tax VW diesels that get north of 40mpg too? What about plain gas cars that are in that range of fuel economy? It seems unfair to single out hybrids (not plug-ins, but pure hybrids) just because they use technology to improve efficiency. They are still a single fuel (gas) vehicles. I understand taxing EVs or plugins that are able to drive without using any gas, but hybrids are just gas cars after all is said and done. Why didn't we tax fuel injected cars when the carburetor was the norm? It's just stupid!

 

You won’t convince him with data.

Even when the tax affects around 1% or less of cars, you won’t convince these guys that this isn’t about funding .

Ohio has lower than normal penetration of hybrids in general already, plus this tax affects the start stop guys that only get a few mpg better (if that)
Add it up and this is a regressive tax that tries to make the consumers decisions about what they should buy for them.

One Ohio guy with a Camry Hybrid figured out the hybrid saves him $20 a year over the non-hybrid he would have bought instead had he known about the tax, you take the price premium into account and the hybrid has negative payback with these taxes.

Nothing like government sponsored failure promoting pollution and waste.

 

Taxing progressive technology is backwards. We should and will strive to reduce fuel consumption as we have done in the past. No one singled out fuel efficient cars for more taxation before. That is unfair and works to stifle progress of fuel efficient vehicles in society. There needs to be a change in the way roads are funded, that is clear. This will become much more an issue as more and more non-gas cars hit the road. If the electric dream comes true and most cars are electric the gas tax funds will dry up. And we theoretically want to stop using gas for transportation fuel, no? These kinds of taxes oppose that goal. We need to transfer the gas tax elsewhere, that is as clear as day. The longer we keep the gas tax system the longer we keep the gas powered transport. This hybrid tax business is dirty and wrong and should be fixed systemically by removing gas taxes altogether and obtaining funding by other means. I am not an economist, so I can't really propose a better way, but I can see that the current way is outdated and not conducive to positive climate outcomes.

 

All this dispute would be 'solved' by shifting to per-mile road taxes in place of fuel taxes. Which some state are now exploring with pilot programs.

Of course, new solutions such as this nearly always lead to new sets of problems and complaints ...

 

At what speed?

Subaru 360 - Wikipedia
"Equipped with a 3-speed manual transmission, the 360 had a top speed of 60 mph (96.6 km/h), and with a curb weight under 1000 pounds, the 360 was exempt from compliance with US safety regulations. Consumer Reports recorded a 0-60 time of about 37 seconds and reported 25–35 mpg‑US (9.4–6.7 L/100 km; 30–42 mpg‑imp), despite Subaru's claimed 66 mpg‑US (3.6 L/100 km; 79 mpg‑imp)."

Remember that at appropriate speeds, Gen2 Prii and original Insights top 100 mpg. And they met the passenger car crash standards of their era.

 

"... with a curb weight under 1000 pounds, the 360 was exempt from compliance with US safety regulations."

 

Only 45% of crude oil goes to individually owned cars (which is actually up from past years)

The end game for commercial plug ins is actually much further down the road than cars.

So even if EVERY non commercial car was an EV you would still have 55% left to tax should we choose to do so.

What I am saying is we could easily just add a tax to crude for a LONG TIME and maintain existing tax rates without massive increases to the rate.

Further hidden in your electric bill are taxes paid by the electric company typically called municipal substation taxes which apply to every consumer kwhr that pass through each substation on the way to your house along with the property taxes, etc paid by the utility on the same and lines. These taxes directly affect your rate and...

These taxes that go directly into the general fund are a VERY significant portion of the usage fees you pay.

What I am saying is EVs already pay 20-50% of their “fuel” costs into the general fund in most areas, so it’s not as though EVs pay no tax and many communities use the general fund to pay for roadwork.

So again this fair share nonsense is just large interests trying to skirt their responsibilities everyone already pays lots of tax except those who get subsidized.

 

Exempt is still within the law and my car is a 4 speed, with 38psi in the tires my top speed is scary, I’ve never taken it above 75, redline is only 5mph faster
it’s just as floaty as a 60’s VW

 

Exempt means that it is a different category, not at all comparable to the legal category known as 'passenger cars'.

 

Given how easy they are to plate it doesn’t much matter,
(Wisconsin isn’t normally an easy place to title an old car)

my Comutacar which has the federal highway compliance sticker in the door jam was actually harder to title than the Subaru

A bit of Trivia a famous modern car that was exempt from crash tests is the Think EV