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VW Faces $17B Fine for Emissions Scam

Discussion in 'Environmental Discussion' started by Jeff N, Sep 18, 2015.

  1. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Lab rats and mice would have been a better choice.

    Bob Wilson
     
  2. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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    And there's a place to get them real cheap. :p
     
  3. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Not if you want to control for variables like disease and parasites. A 'generic' lab mouse started at $10 each back in the '90s, and it climbs from there. Some are literally priceless.
     
    bwilson4web and tochatihu like this.
  4. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    I thought he was going to collect them at certain executive office buildings.

    But you are right. If the experiments require controlling for existing diseases, parasites, and other factors, then those may not be good enough.
     
  5. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    I came across this YouTube about recent diesel problems:


    Perhaps we'll see an end of these:
    [​IMG]

    Bob Wilson
     
  6. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    Also spinning tires so this ticks all the PM 2.5 boxes.
     
  7. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Just needs to ride the brakes more.
     
  8. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Cheat software by any other name .... one can't help but notice the narrator of this video never uses the nasty words, rather makes reference to diesel emisions "issues", "condition", "programming", "problem" .... he never had the cojones to call a spade cheat a spade. Then you have to love some of the comments to the video - where diesel owners brag how they'll take the $3,000 fine/diminished value money .... have it fixed, & then when they get home tear all the new emissions stuff off. Too bad someone can't run a hose from their exhaust into their living room.
    .
     
    #1988 hill, Aug 8, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2019
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  9. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    A poster on another forum went and blocked the EGR on his Civic VX, and I recall that being popular for other cars. Knew someone that admitted to running a pipe through his Ranger's cat.
    Diesel owners aren't the only ones purposely circumventing their emission controls. It's just more obvious when they do.
     
  10. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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  11. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    In terms of particles, a DPF does do that. Wouldn't replace my room air filter with one though.
    Some petrol cars will require exhaust filters in Europe, so this won't remain a diesel 'advantage' for long.
     
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  12. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    I believe!
    Where can I get a Peterbilt - & vent it into my living room ....

    .
     
  13. wxman

    wxman Active Member

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    Apparently, GPFs are not as efficient as DPF in removing exhaust particles, yet anyway - http://nanoparticles.ch/archive/2019_Czerwinski_PR.pdf
     
  14. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Aren't their particles finer to begin with?
    If GPFs are starting at DPF 'mesh' size, their not doing as well at filtering wouldn't be surprise then.
     
  15. wxman

    wxman Active Member

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    Yes, gasoline engine particles typically are finer.

    The explanation I've heard though is that diesel engines generally have higher engine-out PM mass, and thus "coat" the filter substrate more quickly than gasoline engines. A "coated" DPF is more efficient at removing particles from what I understand.
     
  16. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Did work on filtering Anthrax spores out of milk using a cross filter. It was suspected that the milk fat was doing the same thing.
     
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  17. wxman

    wxman Active Member

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    Here are graphics from a CARB report ("California’s Informal Participation In The Particle Measurement Programme (Pmp) Light Duty Inter-Laboratory Correlation Exercise (Ilce_Ld), Final Research Report"), showing particle concentrations of HEPA-filtered background air and exhaust of a diesel passenger car. Signals are noisier in the exhaust measurements, especially the EEPS counter, but not much different overall.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  18. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    This 2008 report?

    I appreciate particulates have been well studied and understood. Now that DEF has finally gotten full approval and everyone is looking for defeat devices, diesels are better. Just I remember reading about some UK drivers who defeat their particle filters instead of fixing them. Of course we have our own 'rollin coal' and semi-trailer gliders for rebuilt, pre-emissions diesel engines.

    Diesels are much improved but to borrow the old Prius claim that they were making the air cleaner begs the question: "From what?"

    Bob Wilson
     
    #1998 bwilson4web, Aug 20, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2019
  19. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Maybe they cmight consider advertising , "we are now cleaner than mountains of coal ash - sometimes"

    .
     
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  20. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Owners of gasoline cars also defeat emission controls. The results just aren't visible to the naked eye.