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Influenza US 2019/2020 and vaccine

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by tochatihu, Sep 30, 2019.

  1. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    Shingrix@19. Both this and seasonal flu vaccines contain inactivated virus. Localized antigenic responses mean that your immune system recognizes the foreign items and is mounting a response. In terms of what shingrix is intended to protect you from, this can be viewed as a good thing. If somebody punches you 'right there', you might not view it as favorably.

    Flu season@20. It is certainly accurate that current US flu season is dominated by type B/Victoria. Also that B is much less variable through time and so a survivor of a previous B infection is more likely to retain innate immunity. However if one regardless of age manages to develop serious infection of either A or B, the chances of adverse outcomes seem to be about the same

    Comparing Clinical Characteristics Between Hospitalized Adults With Laboratory-Confirmed Influenza A and B Virus Infection | Clinical Infectious Diseases | Oxford Academic

    and this is in contrast to public perception that B is not a heavy hitter. In this case no complaint can be made against @Stevewoods as he played by the rules and 'took it in the arm'.

    ==
    It is perhaps interesting that China has about 2% annual vaccination rate of general population (much lower than median forties% in Europe and sixties% in US). So here, the herd isn't vaccinated and flu pretty much gets to play. Resulting mortality is in teens per 100,000 in areas with better medical service and about 3 times higher in rural. Those rates do not seem remarkably higher than in US. Were one to draw any conclusion, it might be that flu vaccination does not prevent death, it mostly prevents a memorably uncomfortable week. I expect to regret writing those words.
     
  2. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Not really. I'm 70 and my wife is older. For us, flu is more than an unpleasant week.

    Bob Wilson
     
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  3. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    agreed. depends on your immune system i guess. i avoid it like the plague
     
  4. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    When various biosystems go out of warranty, what should be an inconvenience can lead to secondary problems. It's now almost a month since I tripped and fell down and my right leg is only now back to spec. So yes, absolutely.

    The other side is that hospitals can get overwhelmed managing symptoms of what ought to be minor diseases. If beds are fully occupied it is difficult to manage more serious problems coming in through the doors.
     
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  5. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    Plague-wise, Madagascar looks like a place not to be. That and DR Congo but one could think of several other reasons to remove that from your tourism list. Oh but the trees! man oh man.
     
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  6. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    around here, all the hospitals advertise for patients, but if you get sick, they don't have any beds available
     
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  7. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    Around here, livenewsnow allows one to stream Fox News, CNN and MSNBC. A lot of breadth :)

    But the ads are very hard for me to endure; guess I'm out of practice. Dominated by "ask your doctor about" the latest medical treatments for the latest not-so-serious ailments. So I have great sympathy for y'all on that side of the world.
     
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  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    the pharma ads on tv are depressing. i would hope my doc knows before i tell her
     
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  9. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    Big Pharma gifts to medical professionals are depressing as well. But I'm digging myself some very deep holes here so I'd better 'click the X' in upper right hand corner of the screen. Go shopping for food and 120 meters of wire for...some reason.
     
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  10. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    ... and a significant contributor to our highest-in-the-world health care costs.

    Not just the ad expenses themselves, but also the higher prices enabled by the artificially (and medically needless) boosted demand.
     
  11. Stevewoods

    Stevewoods Senior Member

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    once again, I just don't see this flu season as presenting much of an issue. B- strain, ho-hum Having said that, I may be dead by Easter.

    The deal is the "docs on the street" are never up on the latest. Case in point, way back in the 1990s, my kids had whooping cough.

    I HAD WHOOPING COUGH back when was a kid, so I knew it. But, my kids had been vaccinated against it,so the doc said "no way." i SAID "YES, WAY," BUT LOST THE BATTLE. Kids got over it, and then a few months later, some report comes out that says the vaccine for whooping cough does not seem to last and --- well you get the picture....
     
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  12. RobH

    RobH Senior Member

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    I think I've had the flu/cold 3 or 4 times in the past 10 years. I feel something coming on for maybe a half day, and start my anti-sickness protocol. I take 150,000 IU of vitamin D3 a day for maybe 3 days. Add enough liposomal vitamin C to suppress symptoms (start at a tablespoon per 2 hours), and back off as it takes effect. Ends up as 2-3 days of sinus problems, and several weeks of an irritating cough.

    This builds on a base of 20,000 to 50,000 IU of D3 per day when healthy. I've heard that both high C and high D cause kidney stones, but you won't prove that by me. People who take high C/D get kidney stones, people who don't take any C/D get kidney stones. Really doesn't look related despite the theories.

    Oh, and I don't get flu vaccinations. Had them exactly twice and I was wiped out for weeks both times. No thank you.

    While most people are deficient in D3, there are some who can get into problems probably with anything over 10,000 IU per day. The doctor who put me on the 50,000 regimen said that the most important thing to watch is calcium. Vitamin K2 helps with putting the available calcium into bones instead of arteries. So do blood/saliva testing of D3 to verify that it's getting absorbed, and calcium testing to verify that it isn't too high.

    Other things I do include a primarily vegan diet (people who eat sick cattle/chickens get sick), cycloastragenol (increase telomeres), senolytic clearance with dasatinib/quercitin every 6 months or so, and a gram of NMN daily for DNA repair and energy. YMMV.

    I'm 75. Maybe when you youngsters grow up you'll see it more my way :)
     
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  13. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    That's dog years. RobH is goin' on 11.
     
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  14. RobH

    RobH Senior Member

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    When George Church gets his act together, we can all be a perpetual 30. And genetically immune to the flu.

    Meantime, see Lifespan
     
  15. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

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    I am an ACS member...if Tequila is the question, I approve!
     
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  16. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    Lifespan@34 includes a favorable review by Leroy Hood. There is little that one could do better to 'sell' me on this idea. Hood is right up there...
     
  17. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    has anyone considered the impacts of longer lifespans?
     
  18. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    A couple 96 and 92 went to a lawyer’s office to get a divorce.

    Lawyer, “Considering your advanced age, why now?”

    Wife, “We wanted to wait until our children died.”

    Bob Wilson
     
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  19. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    Definitely. Social Security and Medicare have been concerned about the funding impacts for decades. This is why Social Security taxes were boosted even back during the Reagan Administration. And probably even several times earlier, before my memory.

    And it is also the reason the SECURE Act of 2019 (Setting Every Community Up for Retirement Enhancement) was passed a bit more than a week ago. This makes numerous changes to retirement plans, including:

    * Pushing back the age for RMDs (required minimum distributions) from IRAs from 70-1/2 to 72 (starting Jan 1, not retroactive);

    * Abolishing the age limit for contributing to IRAs, for folks still working;

    * Allowing annuity options to be added to 401(k) plans (in response to heavy lobbying by the insurance industry);

    * Abolishing "stretch IRAs" for people who inherit IRA monies (except for spouses and minor children). New heirs must now take (and pay taxes on) all the money within 10 years, so that Uncle Sam can grab his share sooner. Not retroactive, so existing "stretch IRAs" are grandfathered.

    More here, I'm sure other articles will be out soon:
    Newly signed SECURE Act is a game-changer for retirement plans | The Seattle Times
     
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  20. t_newt

    t_newt Active Member

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    There are actually a reasonably large number of universal flu vaccines in development right now, some of them already in human trials. One shot of a universal flu vaccine supposedly gives immunity against all variants of the flu, so the flu can't mutate the way it does now to avoid the immune system. You never know whether or not these things will pan out, but if it does, this could give us a chance of wiping out the flu just like polio.

    Imagine a world without the flu.

    Next step--the common cold.