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A/C works but no cold air.

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Technical Discussion' started by AFFriedl, May 29, 2020.

  1. AFFriedl

    AFFriedl Junior Member

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    I have a 2007 Prius with 284,500 miles on it. I just received a repair estimate for Evac and Recharge at $141 along with Replace Evaporator Core for $1,341. Given that the car has such high miles, needs struts and tires it seems like this may be the time to just let this car go.

    I have the ability to do some of my own work like the struts but it seems like this may be a diminishing return.

    How would you other Prius owners approach this?
     
  2. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    13 years and 284k miles? Stick a fork in it. You've won; this is the very definition of being ahead. Recommended action rhymes with "wit."

    Sure you could fix the air, tires & struts but the HV battery, brake boost pump and 3 other very expensive problems are all drumming their fingers out in the hallway.

    And congrats- I'd call this a very tidy exit to a great career for this car, if that's what you choose.
     
    #2 Leadfoot J. McCoalroller, May 29, 2020
    Last edited: May 29, 2020
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  3. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Was that a quote from the dealership?

    Go get a second or third opinion, just like you might do before considering a major surgery o_O
     
  4. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

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    A couple questions...

    One..Could you please describe the symptoms you're experiencing? Complete failure, intermittent operation, etc? I don't exactly understand what you mean that the AC works, but there's no cold air. Who provided the inspection and recommendations?

    two...if it has been verified to be a leak....how bad is the leak? A slow leak can take all season to actually make the refrigerant level low enough to cause problems. A very slow leak will also lose very little, if any lubricant. A fast leak will vent refrigerant quickly and entrain lubricant with it. Why do I ask? Because there is nothing special about the refrigerant in a Prius. A can of pure R134a can be purchased for 5 bucks. Make it about $25 and you get it in a charge rig. If the AC is still factory, and there is ANY refrigerant left in the system, then there should be no air and it won't require evacuation, just addition.

    So my answer? If it were my car, I would take a look at Toyota's charge procedure and try adding a bit of R134a (make sure the can is pure refrigerant and has no oil). I've had a few cars and an F150 where I had to add a can of refrigerant every Spring. $5 every spring? No big deal....

    There's also a handful of threads on here about the Prius AC system that could be a good read.

    Where are you located?
     
    #4 TMR-JWAP, May 29, 2020
    Last edited: May 29, 2020
  5. AFFriedl

    AFFriedl Junior Member

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    I did replace the main drive battery with a rebuilt unit 2 years ago to the tune of $1300 and I replaced the brakes on all 4 corners last year. Interior is still like new inside including the carpets. Few dings on the outside but no real dents. Didn't know about the brake boost or other problems looming around the corner. Considering I spent $4,000 on this car back at 120K miles I feel like it's been a good investment.

    Quote was from an independent shop (Christian Brothers Auto) who have been very reliable to date. They "fixed" the A/C three years ago when it first failed, then last spring and now this spring they claim they finally found the leak inside the cabin and recommended their repairs.

    Last year they simply recharged the A/C, with added dye and charged me nothing. I'm wondering if I can simply re-charge the system myself since they want $141.00 for this. I'm pretty handy with tools so I'd rather spend the money on tools and fix it myself and end up with the tools for the next time around.

    Knowing what to buy to recharge these systems is confusing.

    A/C failed for the first time three years ago in the spring and I had it "fixed". Last spring it went out again and the auto shop recharged the A/C and added dye to try to find the leak - at no cost. All good until spring's warmer weather and it went out just last week. They say there's a leak that they've finally located and recommended replacing the Evaporator Coil.

    I'd rather (as you suggest) spend money every year recharging the system myself and just let it leak due to the miles. Knowing specific products and equipment to buy are key here but finding a specific list or video has not been easy. Some videos I see people using products others say are bad for the compressor.
     
    #5 AFFriedl, May 29, 2020
    Last edited by a moderator: May 30, 2020
  6. dolj

    dolj Senior Member

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    Search for Gen 2 threads by @lech auto air conditionin. He is a professional A/C tech who kindly shares his knowledge here.
     
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  7. lech auto air conditionin

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    i know that evaporator is some times a deal breaker. i would get a 2ed opinion on that evap job. unless if get a big obvious hit with my refrigerant leak detector I do not like to replace a persons EVAP because it is so expensive. if it a vary slow leak more then a year to get low I prefer to put UV tracer dye in it recharge it let the customer drive it to make dam sure it is the EVAP so I can 100% prove it is leaking to the customer and my self. Unless it is so big the refrigerant leak detector is screaming as soon as it get close to the dash.

    If the leak is slow it give you time to save money for the EVAP replacement or just sell it.
     
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  8. AFFriedl

    AFFriedl Junior Member

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    Thanks for the information. If the system leaks too badly I will move the car along and look for another Prius. Other members tagged you as a knowledgeable source on the A/C. Can you tell me what to purchase so that I can do the recharge myself? What brand or kit?
     
  9. ydpplqbd

    ydpplqbd Active Member

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    Remember the following regarding AC:

    1. refill refrigerant from low side only. and

    2. thick refrigerant line is the low side.

    PS Once charged, the thick line (AKA low pressure line) will get cold. While thin line (AKA high pressure line) will get hot.
     
  10. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    @Grit , 'a/c works but no cold air'
     
  11. lech auto air conditionin

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    im not a top off person seen too many compressor burnouts.

    1: recovery of old refrigerant with refrigerant recovery equipment
    2: manifold gauges
    3: vacuum pump
    4: vary accurate scale, I never use little cans. I use 30lb. containers. If using small can guess is all you can do, as close as you can + or - 2 or 3 oz. . NAVAC NRS2i01 Electronic Wireless Scale this is the most accurate scale to date i have used for mobile and rugged wireless.

    In no way shape or form do I condone cans but people do get cold out the dash.
     
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  12. lech auto air conditionin

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  13. AFFriedl

    AFFriedl Junior Member

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    So, this tale currently ends with:
    • watching a few videos on YouTube
    • buying a can of R134a for $8
    • $25 filling tube with a guage from O'Reilly Auto Parts
    • loading the can of R134a through the low side of the system.
    The result is cold air. Based on cost I will probably do this for the next several spring seasons.

    The A/C system registered very low of the guage - so low that the compressor would not turn on until refrigerant had been loaded. My remaining question is now that the system is partially loaded can I add the ND11 lubricant - I'm thinking I should.
     
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  14. lech auto air conditionin

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    No need to add oil because you did not replace any components. When that shop that recharge your car before and put UV dye in the system do you V die as a carrier oil usually has 5 mL of oil added with it. So you are good to go.

    The O’Reilly canna refrigerant works it get you cold out the dash at a very cheap price but the pressures that you read on that gauge will depend on ambient temperature and will change when it hits that little green section that says it’s good dependent on ambient temperature. This is why it’s not accurate. But you will simply get cold out of your dash that is guaranteed.
     
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  15. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    *sigh!* :(
     
  16. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

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    Well done for finding a cost effective solution to your specific situation!! If desired, Toyota does have a procedure that can be used to adjust the charge based on looking at the system sight glass and evaluating bubbles. Is it perfect? No. Will it get you pretty darn close? Absolutely. I can't imagine Toyo would have the procedure if they didn't want it to be used. I'll take a look through the manual to see if I can find the exact procedure. If I find it, I'll post it later this evening.

    Starts on page AC-136
     

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    #16 TMR-JWAP, Jun 1, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2020
  17. AFFriedl

    AFFriedl Junior Member

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    Sad update to my A/C saga - blowing hot again. Refrigerant lasted about two days. Looks like I'm in the market for a next vehicle. I was looking forward to sailing past that 300K OD reading this summer :-(
     
  18. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    Wish you were closer.

    It's getting harder and harder to find G2s in good condition to use as a project car.

    Good Luck with the next car!
     
  19. lech auto air conditionin

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    on pg, AC 107 is were the bubble sight glass description is. but it is a re-write from the early 80's some OEM even still reprint info from the 1970's you know when they tell you to slowly vent the refrigerant to the atmosphere and flush the a/c system with R11 LOL.

    I believe I have posted some videos of systems nearly half empty and had clear sight glass and video of system with bubbles sight glass with 100% full systems. There are a lot of things not in the books that should be and a lot more that should not. Using the sight glass is one of them.

    example: when would I use the sight glass ?. but I would also use at the same time the high and low side PSI in conjunction with the TEMP of the suction line to get the supper-heat with the TEMP of the condenser liquid line to get the sub-cooling. All the means nothing if the guy before you who topped it of got air contamination mixed with the refrigerant and the guy before him even performed a vacuum to get the moisture out. If any of that is in the mix none of your pressure reading , TEMPs, or bubbles DONT MEAN SQUAT !!!... Lets not even mention contaminated refrigerant with other gas mixed.

    OK back to using sight glass. If I had a 1960s to 1970s car with a fixed piston large slow rotating compressor, Back then they had 3.5 lb. to 5.25lb. systems and been 2 to 5 oz + or - would not even make a difference you could see on your gauges or read on your dash TEMP. Oh Yea dont forget a large condenser that was 25'' to 35" long 20'' to 25'' high 1 1/2'' thick weight 20 lbs.
    One more thing that made a big difference for using bubbles. It must be R12. Then I was sure I was in the ball park topping off.
    Only if the fluid thermal fan clutch was new or less the 30,000 miles so air flow was correct across the condenser if not all bets are off.

    After the introduction of R134 the bubble method was dead but still used with many burned up compressor it was great business back then. Got to love those hard headed old timers.
    Then back in 1985 or was it 1987 ( hate Alzeimer's) Cadillac introduced the V5 Variable compressor. Variable compressors soon spread every were. It was money making hand over fist. old timers with 20 or 30 , 40 years experience keep topping refrigerant off compressors keep burning up. But they blamed the compressors. They said a lot of defective compressors was the word of the day. (" I can tell you it was defects that was for sure. Not the compressor. Think DNA, lack of reading and understanding the basics").

    NOW TODAY: refrigerant R134a & R1234YF and soon to be ? blend ? CO2 ? R32 ? R152 ? R600 ? R290 ? it's comming. They all have a different (BUBBLE POINT) that's a hit.
    Now they have started using IHX ( another hint ) Throw in the small parallel flow condensers WITH micro channel ( another HINT !!!)

    Did I forget to mention todays refrigerant charge as low as 12oz to 16oz ( 340 to 450g.) and BUBBLE BOY is going to guess ???. and be 2 or 3 oz undercharged or two or three oz over charged to get a clear sight glass. I got a youtube video on that to.

    BOBBLE BOY make parts houses 7 digit figure profit margins just replacing his compressor burn ups. I need another Buggatti ( bugatti.com - Google Search )

    With love to all the BUBBLE BOYZ