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Red Triangle 2009 Prius, Hybrid or Aux?

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by TampaToma, Jul 31, 2020.

  1. TampaToma

    TampaToma Junior Member

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    Hi I've recently gotten the red triangle twice. First time was on the highway in the middle of a 1 hour commute. The car wouldn't go over 45 mph so I got off the highway. I was able to make it to my destination and later all the way home by not running the AC to conserve power. I drove the car for several weeks after that (although with covid I only drive short distances a couple times each week)

    Then recently I started another trip, but only got about 5 miles before getting the triangle again and drove back home. I put the car into diagnostic mode so I could see the voltage. In park it was showing the voltage as 13.9v but as soon as I put the car into drive gear the voltage dropped to 13.3v.

    Is there a simple way to diagnose if it is a hybrid battery issue or Aux battery issue? The car is 11 years old, I've only owned it for about a year and I'm not sure if either battery has ever been replaced.

    Also I'm wondering if anyone knows anything about the Dr Prius Lithium Iron-Phosphate batteries. If I'm going to put in a new battery I would consider that option. Thanks!
     
  2. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Welcome to PriusChat!!
    Find or buy a toyota hybrid compatible OBD2 scanner and retrieve the stored codes (DTCs), many prefer a "mini-vci" cable and a copy of techstream on a windows device, others get by with an OBD2 bluetooth adapter and use a phone app like Dr. Prius or Hybrid Assistant.

    From your description, it sounds like you have a DTC P0A93, aka a bad inverter coolant pump. But reading the codes will tell you for sure.
    Some here do know about them, as they are in the wild being and still being tested, no release date has been offered that I know of.

    You might ask the developer @jacktheripper directly, or if you find out additional information elsewhere please report back or PM me.
     
  3. TampaToma

    TampaToma Junior Member

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  4. TampaToma

    TampaToma Junior Member

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    When I put the car in Diag mode tonight the voltage on the Aux battery was 12.1v. When I put the car in Acc mode it went down to 11.8v. When I fully turned the car on it went to 13.8v. I drove the car around the block and red triangle disappeared. Before that I used the Dr Prius app and got the codes shown in the screenshot above.
     
  5. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    This could be one of those situations were you need a 'mini-vci' cable and techstream, as both of those DTCs (P0A1D and P3000) have related INFs (subcodes). Knowing the related INF for a DTC may help with diagnosing the problem, and might save you time and money.

    How many miles on the vehicle, and has there been any known water intrusion in the cabin area?
     
  6. TampaToma

    TampaToma Junior Member

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    126K Miles and no water in the cabin area that I know of.
     
  7. TampaToma

    TampaToma Junior Member

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    The P0A1D refers to the hybrid powertrain control module. I tried to do research on this code and was surprised to find not much info on it. The most important info I found was in this screenshot on a car repair website. It has me very intrigued so I'm going to take a look at my AUX battery and check the connections. I also ordered a NOCO Genius5 12V battery charger and will try charging up the AUX battery. I'm thinking maybe it got weak from lack of use during covid. Also I do remember once a month or so ago that my smart key stopped working randomly one day and I thought it was very odd, but then it started working again a few days later. seems related to this issue I'm having now.

    If none of my tinkering uncovers anything obvious I will take it to my mechanic to have the codes looked up on techstream. Thanks so much for your input!
     

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  8. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Though there are over 50+ different subcodes (INFs or detail codes) for DTC P0A1D, many of the workups talk about R+R'ing the HV control ECU. These workups are from the 2004 manual, they are old and have likely been updated, but they will give you an idea of the importance of knowing any associated INF(s). Not all DTCs have associated INFs (AKA subcodes or detail codes).

    Here is just one example of a workup for DTC P0A1D with INF 142 : https://share.qclt.com/%E4%B8%B0%E7%94%B0%E6%99%AE%E7%91%9E%E6%96%AF%E5%8E%9F%E5%8E%82%E8%8B%B1%E6%96%87%E6%89%8B%E5%86%8Cpdf%E6%A0%BC%E5%BC%8F/Repair%20Manual/04pruisr/05/21bpm/0a1d142.pdf

    Below are the workups for DTC P3000, not much there when compared to updated repair workups :

    Here is the workup for DTC P3000 with INF 123, INF 125, and INF 603: https://share.qclt.com/丰田普瑞斯原厂英文手册pdf格式/Repair Manual/04pruisr/05/21bpm/3000123.pdf

    Here is the workup for DTC P3000 with INF 388 : https://share.qclt.com/丰田普瑞斯原厂英文手册pdf格式/Repair Manual/04pruisr/05/21bpm/3000388.pdf

    Here is the workup for DTC P3000 with INF 389 : https://share.qclt.com/丰田普瑞斯原厂英文手册pdf格式/Repair Manual/04pruisr/05/21bpm/3000389.pdf

    A quick scan with techstream can give you the INFs for DTC P3000 / PA01D, which may or not offer some clarity to the problem at hand.
    Here is an image of the white connector that may be corroded, just above the circled black popup retainer :
    [​IMG]

    Here is an image or the green corrosion that can build up on either side of the connector :

    [​IMG]

    Here is a link that should help with taking apart the rear hatch area on the passenger side, where you will be able to clean the HV fan and check/clean the above white connector. 2004 – 2009 Toyota Prius Plug-and-Play Car Harness Installation Instructions | Hybrid Automotive

    While checking for corrosion of said white connector, you may want to also clean the HV fan as mentioned in step #23, if the HV fan cleanliness is unknown. Guessing you would do steps 1 through 5, then steps 7 and 8, but on the passenger side.

    For P3000, you may want to check the HV battery ECU, connectors, and the HV battery voltage sensing wires for corrosion as well. In which case you would follow all of the above instructions to gain access to that ECU, and then the protective cover from the HV battery.

    Image below shows where corrosion can form on the ECU pins and connector :

    [​IMG]
     
    #8 SFO, Aug 2, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2020
    dolj and Raytheeagle like this.
  9. TampaToma

    TampaToma Junior Member

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    Wow! Thank you that is super helpful. I did take all of those connectors out yesterday and inspected them and didn't find any corrosion. I will double check again now that I have these pics and know exactly what to look for. Also took the front kick panel off and looked there as well. I hooked the battery up to a battery charger and let it run for about 6 hours last night. The charger indicated that the battery was full so I disconnect the charger and checked the voltage using the car's diagnostic screen and it was only showing it at 12.0 Volts and as soon as I put a small load on it (stepped on the brake pedal) I saw the voltage dip to 11.4v, so at this point I'm thinking it's just a totally dead aux battery. I'm going to order a battery and try that. The charger I bought also had a battery repair feature that I might try as well, but at least I will have a backup battery on the way.
     
  10. TampaToma

    TampaToma Junior Member

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    Can you explain what you mean by "R+Ring?"
     
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  11. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Should've wrote "removing and replacing".
     
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  12. edthefox5

    edthefox5 Senior Member

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    On the mfd the center screen over the radio do you see a car icon in the upper left corner?
     
  13. TampaToma

    TampaToma Junior Member

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    hmm... a red car? I believe I did when I was having the issue. The codes have all cleared now. I've ordered a new 12V battery that should be delivered on Wednesday. I took out the original battery, ran it on the auto charger and then performed the repair function on the charger. I'm using the Noco Genius 5 charger [ NOCO - 5-Amp Smart Battery Charger - GENIUS5 ] which is a 5 amp charger but it has an AGM mode so I'm assuming it lowers the amps for an AGM battery. I also ordered a new volt meter so I can get a more accurate reading on the battery. The one I have now is not digital so it's hard to get a precise reading. After charging and running the repair function on the original battery I installed it back into the car and checked the voltage in the diagnostics again and it was reading 12.1V and dips down to 11.8 when I turn the head lights on. So at this point I'm pretty sure that 12v battery is bad OR there's something wrong with the control ECU that's causing it to report the wrong voltage. On wednesday with my new meter I will be able to double check the voltage on the existing battery, and can also hook up the new battery to see if I can a different result.
     
  14. edthefox5

    edthefox5 Senior Member

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    yes red car.

    If you see the car icon in the upper left corner its usually means hybrid battery failure of some kind. And you have a bad 12 volt battery too.

    Very very common now that nobody drives much anymore both battery's are tanking. You stop driving a high mileage g2 and it will kill the hybrid battery. #1 post on this site. 12 volt battery used to be #1. Nothing wrong with the ecu. Stop double checking the 12 its bad and so is the hybrid.

    Mine bought new 07 hybrid started to fail at around 115000 miles mainly because the car was not driven much and the intense heat. I assume the car lives outside.

    next move for you is to get an obd scanner that is hybrid capable. Use the search forum tab up top and search

    mini vci

    for discussions on obd testers. The best have Toyota Techstream software installed on them same software the dealer uses search that also.