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Advice for HV battery modules vs. full replacement

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Technical Discussion' started by Jonathan L, Nov 18, 2020.

  1. Jonathan L

    Jonathan L Junior Member

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    Hi all,
    Been a lurker for several months learning a lot and applying the skills immediately on a ABS actuator/brake pump replacement and diagnosing a misfire, which turned out to be water buildup in the upper spark plug chamber likely from rain buildup. After many hours in the garage rewatching videos and feeling empowered, both issues have been fixed, so I'm happy to report between you folks here on PC and YouTube, you all have saved me well over a grand and I get to retain the know-how for the future!

    The issue at hand:

    I have a '04 with 223k miles, second owner. The HV battery that's currently in it is a refurbished pack installed 2 years/15k miles ago that was done prior to buying the car from a friend in December 2018. The warranty on the old pack is out. Since I've had it, The car hasn't been driving much for extended periods of time (multiple weeks or months) due to overseas travel and work.

    In the last 3 weeks - right after the ABS actuator install - I've gotten multiple codes on the Hybrid/HV battery system (P3000, P0A80, C1259, C1310, P3012, P3013). I've been driving at lower speeds (<55mph) around town, noticing that the regen has been hardly working (and at times not at all) - half of those regen car icons at the most. The electric system assists significantly less than usual and the ICE is constantly running - pretty typical symptoms as I've been learning. The MPG has been high 20s-30 with mixed driving.

    This morning, I just learned how to get Techstream and the miniVCI cable to work on an old Windows 7 laptop (all learned from here too) and ran a 20-minute test and loaded the car with the AC on max and some throttling in the last few minutes. Just as the P3012 code suggested, the voltages on Block 2 significantly differ (1-1.5V+) from all the other blocks. Even though Block 3 was also identified by the ECU (P3013) as weak, I didn't notice that its voltage fluctuated much beyond 0.2-0.4V from the others. The other Blocks were all pretty similar throughout the 20 mins - 0.1-0.4 from one another.

    Solutions?!

    After lots of reading on PriusChat here and watching dozens of diag videos on Youtube, I cannot decide between going the full replacement route OR go a more DIY route to replace the bad modules. I currently have a cheapo BT OBDII adapter that doesn't work with Dr. Prius/Torque + Techstream/VCI as mentioned above. No dischargers/chargers on hand yet. I am looking to depart within the next couple weeks from the Pacific Northwest and road trip with this Prius down to southern California. It is my only vehicle, so there is a time sensitivity to get this car running better/sooner again.

    As most of you probably know already, individual HV battery modules can be purchased for ~$30 on ebay, and I've located a seller from Bend, OR, who is a certified hybrid tech selling reconditioned modules and backs them with a 90-day warranty. My train of thought is 3-5 modules = $90-150 + several hours of time could perhaps get me 6 months or more of driving peace of mind, vs $700 for a refurbished set with 6-months warranty from Hybrid Battery Exchange in Portland/Gresham, and upwards to $1600 with brand new cells with 4-year unlimited miles warranty with Green Tec Auto in Kent, WA. There are options in between too.

    Advice needed
    FWIW, I am unsure if I am going to keep this car for long. I guess If I can get it running in good condition for the next several months, there's a likelihood I'd sell it in the spring/summer next year.

    Any insight from y'all Prius/HV battery techs would be great and appreciated. Thanks heaps for your time in advance!

    I've attached a few screenshots showing voltage numbers from the test this morning.

    Cheers,
    Jonathan

    PXL_20201118_191525558.jpg PXL_20201118_190826327.jpg PXL_20201118_191247851.jpg
     
  2. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Welcome to PriusChat!!

    Since you're within the Seattle metroplex, let me ping @PriusCamper - who can help guide you in the right direction.
     
    Jonathan L and Raytheeagle like this.
  3. Moving Right Along

    Moving Right Along Senior Member

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    I’d say either get a brand new battery (either one from Toyota or one from newpriusbatteries.com (2kToaster’s site)) or get rid of the car. While this isn’t true of all new factory batteries, refurbished batteries and replaced cells WILL fail, and you won’t know exactly when. So I’d say either send the car to the junk pile and get something else without a huge impending repair bill, or do it right and get a new battery that will last the remaining life of the car.
     
    Jonathan L likes this.
  4. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

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    Hi Jonathon, I'm a hour south of you and your predicament is budget driven. If you can afford a new pack it takes a couple hours to install and you'll have nothing to worry about for a decade and you can use that same new battery pack if you upgrade to a Gen3 Prius some day.

    The person in Bend you're in touch with is who I get all my replacement modules from and they are high quality because he has expensive equipment and it will fix that bad module you have, but that doesn't find your next bad modules. There's more than a dozen ways to find bad modules before they go bad, but takes a while to learn that, as well as having lots of equipment.

    For your road trip, having more modules and the tools to replace them would be wise... Alternatively you could borrow/rent a loaner pack from me for your road trip so you can swap out packs. But again how thorough you want to be has to do with how much money you want to spend.

    Currently your computer is detecting the problems in the pack and trying to protect the system by shutting it down when you drive around, so that needs to be fixed before the road trip.
     
    #4 PriusCamper, Nov 19, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2020
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  5. Jonathan L

    Jonathan L Junior Member

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    Totally appreciate that @SFO !
     
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  6. Jonathan L

    Jonathan L Junior Member

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    Points well taken and considered.
    The idea that I have a 60/40 chance of selling the car sometime next year, and the fact that I am on a tiny budget compared to most car owners make me apprehensive about dropping 1.6k+ on a car worth about that much, hence why I'm considering the middle road of $700 for a refurb unit that will keep me going a knowingly shorter time period.

    edit: FWIW too, Hybrid Battery Exchange in Portland/Gresham offers a 3rd gen cell-built HV battery for our 2nd gens for $1399 with a 3 year warranty. Hmm!
     
  7. Jonathan L

    Jonathan L Junior Member

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    Definitely budget driven, as you likely have picked up from the language in my post ;) I totally hear you and Moving Right Along are saying though.
    I just don't know how long I'll keep this vehicle, so the (temporarily) investment of 1.4-1.8k with the income that I have seem unwise.
    I've been considering something else which can tow a camper to accompany my already mobile lifestyle, though of course nothing can match this mileage efficient. From all the threads I've read of folks towing with the 2nd gen, it seems I could go with a tiny teardrop - which I'd be totally cool with, but with the higher mileage in my '04 and recent problems, I am not feeling hyper confident even with a fresh set of HV battery.

    Oh right on, that's Joe right? I talked with him on the phone yesterday. Super knowledge and helpful guy. It was after talking with him that I felt more steered in the direction of replacing the whole unit rather than trying to do Whack a Mole or do extensive testing/module replacement.

    Well this is a tremendous offer! I'd be curious to talk with you some more. Let me PM you directly @PriusCamper
     
  8. DaviDino

    DaviDino Junior Member

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    Jonathan, have you done any price comparisons of Toyota dealers around? They are getting competitive and offer 3yr-36Kmi warranty when dealer-installed. Am opting to use one for $2745 tax included.
    BTW: A problem most of us discover the Hard Way- these Prii need to be driven fairly regularly to prevent battery decline. Since you mentioned it could be sitting idle, that might recommend you swap off to a conventional gasoline alternative vehicle (IMHO).
     
  9. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Not worth it, don't buy a used mix-matched set of modules at that price point, toss in an extra $200 and get a NEW OEM battery.
     
    Raytheeagle likes this.
  10. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

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    Thanks for connecting us @SFO ....The OP just rolled out of here with my very first original 2007 HV battery that's never had a bad module and I just re-conditioned it and it passed every test and he paid less than he had planned to pay for the cheapest rebuilt one at PDX hybrid battery exchange ($699) and also gave him a one year warranty. But mostly he has the peace of mind of having a spread sheet of a battery pack that's always had perfect numbers and no issues ever.

    And because of the Dr. Prius Lithium pack testing, as well as the amount of packs I'm working on this rainy season that I usually test in my car, it made sense to give away my best pack to a good home where it's gonna get used all the time and not sit on a shelf...
     
    #10 PriusCamper, Nov 20, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2020
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  11. Tbkilb01

    Tbkilb01 Active Member

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    If done properly rebuilds can last for years and fairly inexpensive...