Toyota's Dave Hermance confirms impending switch to lithium-ion

I think it's a good idea to wait. If my 2006 Prius had current Li-Ion batteries, I'd be really worried about my car catching on fire like those laptops.

 

That doesn't square with Toyota's stated intention of having a plug-in Prius for the 2008 re-design. I assume that plug-in = Li-ion.

 

It's actually the 2009 redesign (released in 2008, same as the 2007 model was released in 2006), and, as far as i know, converting to a plug-in Prius is still only rumor - To the effect of a couple of people from Toyota saying "we're working on it" and the blogging community taking that to mean it will be in the next major redesign (which is due in 2009, based on past history) - The short is, Toyota hasn't said what will be changed in that redesign, or when plug-in capability will be available. Most likely, they don't want to scare current buyers into waiting for the plug-in option.

Additionally, plug-in does not necessarily mean LiIon. Cheep! has a thread on here somewhere talking about a plug-in mod he helped with recently that used 20 car batteries (sealed, of course) to provide a plug-in, 10 mile EV range.

 

Back in 2001 when just a few weirdos were buying hybrid cars, nickel metal sold for $3/lb or less. Now it is over $15, market demand continues to pull, and there is quite a bit of it in those big batteries. As soon as suitable lithium-based batteries can be made for the price, I have no doubt that Toyota will switch over.

Meanwhile, those of us who might ever need the battery replaced would do well to see if the recycling market will beat Toyota's offer of $200 bounty for a dead one.

 

By the Way, Dave Hermance will be our speaker at the Orange County Prius Club meeting in December- the first weekend. Email to make certain you get an email notification or visit us at ocprius.com. He will be talking about Batteries....

 

That's not exactly what he told the San Diego Prius Club.

Lithium-Ion will eventually replace the current batteries and yes, the price of Nickel is going up. But the next gen Prius will not have them and won't be a plug in. So I seriously doubt the Prius will be plug-in lithium Ion in 2010.

You can read about it here:

October meeting.

He also told us the Prius won't be getting the side signal mirrors, not even as an option.l Not in the U.S.

 

Thanks for the link, Godiva. But which post in particular does this disagree with?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Godiva @ Nov 17 2006, 12:08 PM) [snapback]350852[/snapback]</div>

After reading through the PDF, I am convince that next Gen Prius will be offered with NiMH and Li-ion flavor/models.

Nissan is doing well with Li-ion patents/technology. I wouldn't be surprise if Toyota use Nissan LIB.

 

I was fortunate enough to catch Dave's San Diego Club presentation. It was well laid out and very informative. But as Godiva notes (via the link) the hybrid battery niche is just too small to influence battery manufacturer's R&D or production trends. We pretty much have to wait for better batteries to be developed for other applications (i.e. mass market toys, etc) and patiently wait for manufacturer's to give the hybrid market notice. This is yet another reason for people to purchase hybrid vehicles now. Let's show manufacturers that there is a real and growing market today!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jmccord @ Nov 18 2006, 01:33 AM) [snapback]351335[/snapback]</div>

Exactly. The hybrid market has to become a much, much larger chunk of the battery market.

In the mean time Toyota will be looking at developing their own battery. I hope that, like the HSD system, it will be so innovative, it will lead the market and others will either follow or rent the patent rights. The battery manufacturers need to wake up and realize that not only are hybrids not going away, but there is money to be made there. They need to be like Apple and the iPod...be the first and be *so* first that you have a huge chunk of the market share. None of them has wised up so far.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(inventor00 @ Nov 16 2006, 05:26 PM) [snapback]350353[/snapback]</div>

]I met a Toyata exectutive in June 06 on a Mederterian cruse who is the main cause of my pruchase of my Prius. Can't remember his name. We met through our wife who had a comon interest in quilting. I would surely like to get has name and Email address if any one knows who this might be. I wonder if Dave Hermance might be the man. Can any one help?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mark Derail @ Nov 16 2006, 08:49 AM) [snapback]350164[/snapback]</div>

That's why I'm not buying a gasoline car. I've seen some of them burst into flames. Seriously, now. The batteries used in cars will NOT be the same as those that caught fire in laptops. A few instances of disaster do not spell disaster for the entire technology. It honestly amazes me how comfortable we are with handling gasoline. We park 10, 20, 30 gallons of it in our attached garages every night. I'd personally rather have a stack of risky laptops than a tank of gasoline.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ml194152 @ Nov 16 2006, 08:56 AM) [snapback]350170[/snapback]</div>

While plug-in may very well equal Li-ion. Li-Ion doesn't have to equal plug-in. I have never heard any official annoucement of a PHEV for the next redesign. Just higher mileage with likely modern, higher-density battery chemistry.

And please remember that our buddy Dave is the same guy who told us that PHEVs are NOT viable (pointing to the colossal failure of their EV programh - sigh), and that Toyota was not even looking into them .... just a very short while ago.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(darelldd @ Nov 21 2006, 02:27 PM) [snapback]352750[/snapback]</div>

He also said that Toyota will never bring their intelligent parallel parking to the USA because of liabilities and such. Then look at what Lexus is doing.

 

I don't wish to speak ill of the deceased. Dave just died yesterday at the controls of his aerobatic airplane. Dave was a champion for hybrids, and a detractor of plug-in vehicles. He did his job very well, and he certainly will be missed.