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SO how do I drive this thing?

Discussion in 'Gen 5 Prius Main Forum' started by MyPriusMarvin, Aug 19, 2023.

  1. HacksawMark

    HacksawMark Active Member

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    How many miles per year do you drive? Any guesstimate on freeway vs city driving? Gasoline has a shelf life of between three to six months. If you don't fill up that often, I would definitely use a good stabilizer.

    Note: Ethanol breaks down in as little as one to three months. Not sure if gas with ethanol breaks down faster than pure gas.
     
  2. MyPriusMarvin

    MyPriusMarvin Member

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    It varies. My last car averaged about 8K a year but you have to figure the pandemic where I barely drove anywhere at all for a while. It’s probably slightly more. I would say I filled up my old Prius C about once every 2 weeks.
     
  3. HacksawMark

    HacksawMark Active Member

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    If you fill up every two weeks or even every two months, you should be fine.
     
  4. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Maybe it’s a comprehension threshold thing. I’ve a personal analogy:

    Purchased a MK I Canon 5D (digital single lens reflex camera), spent a few hours reading the manual, played with the menus and controls, customized a few things for convenience, got comfortable with it.

    A few years later, upgraded to MK III version, which had loads more “stuff”. The camera’s menu had evolved from a simple scroll, to a multi-page rabbit warren, the controls and complexity increased as well, and I kinda hit a wall. It’s still usable, but I spend inordinate time going back to the manual, just too much to retain, and I end up eschewing a lot of the features.

    either that, or my brain calcification is progressing, who knows. Either way, the new one was an ill fit.
     
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  5. tovli

    tovli 2023 Prius Prime replaced 09 Prius

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    While the manual indicates the car will demand that you use half a tank a year, I am planning to force use of half a tank every three months if I have not done so from regular use.

    My use pattern is primarily EV but once a month or so I usually find a reason to do 80-100 freeway miles. That should translate into using half a tank every three months, although I may fill it after each highway excursion to keep the tank full. Supposedly a full tank ages better.

    If I find I haven't used HV mode in a while, I plan to let the SOC (state of charge) go to ----% and charge to 80% using the HV Charging mode. I calculated this should use about a gallon of gas, and I am curious to see how fast it works also.
     
  6. MyPriusMarvin

    MyPriusMarvin Member

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    I was hopeful with the EV range (I definitely do not drive 30-40 miles a day consistently) that this car would be mostly EV for me. I did know that gas does not last forever but I was hoping I could cycle through it in a few months and not every month.
     
    #26 MyPriusMarvin, Aug 20, 2023
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2023
  7. HacksawMark

    HacksawMark Active Member

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    For peace of mind, I would add some stabilizer to the fuel then and not worry about it.
     
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  8. MyPriusMarvin

    MyPriusMarvin Member

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    Yes, the jump from 2015 Prius C to 2023 Prime is formidable. And the car I had before the C was a Camry that was so basic it practically had roll-up windows.

    Plus with XSE I am paying for features that I’d like to at least try and use.

    But in terms of researching this car I was so well-prepared several dealers remarked on it. This wasn’t the only car I researched though and the videos I watched and things I read were more comparative to see what was my best fit rather than “This is what to do if you’ve literally never used a plug-in vehicle in your life”.
     
    #28 MyPriusMarvin, Aug 20, 2023
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2023
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  9. sam spade 2

    sam spade 2 Senior Member

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    That advice is basically correct.
    Don't use more than the recommended amount of stabilizer; more is not better.

    Non-ethanol gas will stay "good" a bit longer.
    IF you can use most of the tankful in 3 months, Ethanol should be fine. No stabilizer needed.

    IF you stretch it more than that, E0 would be better with stabilizer added.
    The general consensus is that you should not try to stretch it longer than 6 months though,
    stabilizer or no.
     
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  10. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Read that gas loses about an octane point a month. That's in the basic plastic can used to fill the lawnmower.

    The fuel tank of a car is more engineered and better sealed than that simple gas can. The exchange of air in the head space of the tank is much slower; less oxygen and humidity is getting to the gas. The loss of volatiles in the fuel to the atmosphere is a fraction what is seen in that gas can and lawnmower. The fuel tank and evap control system of a low emission car like the Prius is even better.

    The engineers were aware of the potential for the gas to go stale in a PHEV. Being overcautious is part of the reason the gen1 Volt called for premium. These cars track the age of the fuel in their tanks. They will take steps to use that fuel up, and get fresh gas added to the tank. The PiP and Volt were quite 'vocal' about doing so.

    I do not delve into every subforum here, but the PiP came out about 10 years ago. If gas going stale in a Toyota PHEV caused problems, it would have come to my notice like the EGR, head gasket, and coolant leak issues. This is not something to worry about.
     
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  11. tovli

    tovli 2023 Prius Prime replaced 09 Prius

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    I believe I read an EPA survey of PHEV drivers reported 50% EV mode use on average, which may be why Toyota doesn't mention fuel stabilizer in the owners manual, but never-the-less adding fuel stab sounds as scary as old gas to me.
     
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  12. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Fuel stabilizer isn't going to hurt your Prius but as a general rule don't take advice from the dealership as they often say the wackiest things. For instance here, unless the Prius is in storage long-term - the car will automatically run a maintenance cycle so that fuel will not get stale.
     
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  13. brucewil

    brucewil New Member

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    These are not full EVs. The Internal Combustion Engine is meant to be ran somewhat regularly. If you don't want stale gas, just keep the tank at 1/4 full and drive a few miles here and there on HV mode.
     
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  14. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    I'd replace the fuel at least twice a year - once in the spring to get the summer fuel blend and once in the fall to get the winter fuel blend. Unless you live somewhere mild, probably not a good idea to run one season's blend in the other just for engine operability and appropriate temperature performance.

    When?

    I did an experiment when my Prime was new and I ran 72 days without the engine coming on for "maintenance mode". I only ended the experiment because I was going on a road trip.

    The manual says "No New Fuel has been added recently. Please refuel" message will pop up after 12 months if the fuel door hasn't been opened but it never did for us.
     
    #34 Tideland Prius, Aug 20, 2023
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2023
  15. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    With fuel injected engines, the difference between the blends is mostly about evaporative emissions outside of regions with severe cold. Warm weather leads to more evaporation, so summer blend has less volatiles. Winter has more, but that is likely more important for carbureted engines that rely on a more passive method of getting fuel into the air. Today, it is more about letting refineries use up the butane stocks that built up over the summer.
    This could be a case of accumulated data leading changes in design. With more lab tests and the miles driven on PiPs, it maybe that the fuel doesn't age as quickly as originally thought. Then add improvements to fuel tank design, and the engineers are confidant in letting the car go longer between requiring fresh gas being added.
     
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  16. MyPriusMarvin

    MyPriusMarvin Member

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    I am really appreciating this conversation. I think I’m going to see how my driving habits translate to this car for the next few months. The battery was low and the hybrid engine was on as I drove it home yesterday so some gas has definitely already been used.

    Here in the Washington D.C. area we have much shorter winters than summers it’s seems. I had no idea about seasonal blends or anything before this conversation and I’m really getting quite an education over here. I think I will stay away from fuel stabilizers for now. I have a road trip coming up in late September to Pennsylvania which will give me some good gas turnover anyway.
     
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  17. tovli

    tovli 2023 Prius Prime replaced 09 Prius

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    Be sure to include a "What Am I Going To Do With A Flat Tire?" plan.
     
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  18. sam spade 2

    sam spade 2 Senior Member

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    Where exactly did you read that ?
    Seems to me like the first things to go would be the most
    highly volatile components.
    And loss of them might actually make the octane rating go UP, not down.
     
  19. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Several articles on stale gas mention the octane dropping. The point a month came from one talking about the Volt when it was new, IIRC.
    Gas isn't just losing volatiles as it ages. It is also oxidizing, and that will degrade the high octane compounds in the mix.
     
  20. MyPriusMarvin

    MyPriusMarvin Member

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    Few more notes after a couple days. I really do not have any issue at all with display behind the wheel. I have complete visibility and it never even crossed my mind as an issue. The Toyota app went nuts on me today and froze and had a strobe effect that was weird, so when I attempted to restart my phone it sent out an SOS signal, which was definitely unintended. But the car drives like a dream. I am definitely getting used to the EV noises…one noise reminds me of a very faint chorus of angels which is very funny and the other sounds like a very very faint siren which is a little crazy. I guess that’s what music is for.
     
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