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New Registered key is not being detected

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Technical Discussion' started by Gourockian, Jun 23, 2023.

  1. Jack Maniaci

    Jack Maniaci Junior Member

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    Really? I thought matching FCC ID was a fairly critical element.

    ^These posts strongly suggest that problems may occur if one or both of the FCC ID and board/transmitter number don't match for the new fobs to be created.

    I've inferred from all available evidence on the working key plus forum threads that my one working fob has been programmed using FCC ID HYQ14AAB. It seems probable that I need to match both the hyq14aab FCC ID AND 3370 transmitter # in the existing keyfob.

    It's possible that maybe a locksmith with a hacker's skillset could make any FCC ID work:
    ...but I really just want to get the backups made cheaply [turns out locksmiths charge extortionate prices in Chicago] and stop worrying about it. Better to match the FCC ID and transmitter numbers for the duplicates than to roll the dice and potentially drag this out even longer through one or more ebay returns. Especially at the good prices I finally hashed out this morning.

    I accidentally dropped the one working fob into a muddy rain puddle the other day, and it just about gave me a heart attack. It's already been through one washing machine cycle, too (over a year ago now). I'm just lucky it still works for now; board appears to have been sealed off from the moisture.
     
    #41 Jack Maniaci, Jan 2, 2024
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2024
  2. Gourockian

    Gourockian Junior Member

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    I may have given the wrong impression regarding the FCC ID. Basically, what I was trying to say is that it is not the ID that makes it work or not work. This extract from the FCC website at Equipment Authorization – Grantee Code | Federal Communications Commission may help to explain what I mean.

    “Products subject to certification are required to be uniquely identified by an identifier known as FCC ID. The FCC ID consist of two parts: (1) grantee code; and (2) product code. ----------- The product codes are uniquely established by the Grantee to identify each product approved by a Telecommunication Certification Body (TCB).

    Searching on the FCC database for HYQ14ACX and 14AAB shows that they are both registered to the Denso Corporation, Japan, who make them for Toyota but also shows that they work at different frequencies. 14AAB is 315.0MHz and 14ACX is 314.35MHz so they possibly are not compatible with the same vehicle. Interestingly, these ID’s were issued in 2004 and 2007 respectively.

    So, yes, the FCC ID helps to indicates what keyfob should be compatible with a particular vehicle but it would be quite possible to buy, for example, a used HYQ14ACX shell with a completely different circuit board inside, providing it was a physical fit. In other words, it's not the FCC ID that makes it work, it's having the correct circuit board. That's why, when buying a used OEM keyfob, it is critical to know what's inside and to avoid those aftermarket ones if you want full functionality.
     
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  3. Jack Maniaci

    Jack Maniaci Junior Member

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    I think this is correct. But a lot of various ebay sellers' listings also seem to list inaccurate frequencies (e.g., misrepresenting that just about everything is 315.0MHz) AND inaccurate board numbers.

    As it turns out, the aftermarkets worked perfectly with Techstream. I tried ordering four in total, one Toyota OEM, one Lexus OEM, and two identical brand-new aftermarkets with transmitters made by Lonsdor (or so it says on the boards).

    In the end, I wound up programming and keeping the aftermarkets and returning the OEMs. The sellers represented the OEMs as 'tested;' I didn't assume this would mean 'unlocked' or 'virginized', but figured they were cheap enough that if they needed unlocking, then I'd try the unlock-by-mail service offered by other ebay sellers for as little as ~$16 each plus shipping. Both OEMs proved to be locked / already coded to some other vehicle; I infer this is why they didn't program despite having fresh batteries installed. The Lexus fob also had the wrong transmitter ID (advertised as having 3370 but really had 0140 inside).

    As I think I mentioned before, the ebay seller of the two aftermarket fobs claimed that even though the fobs were unlocked and brand new, they absolutely would not play ball with Techstream, and that I would need to have a locksmith program them using something in the vein of (but not limited to) Lonsdor K518, Tango or Xhorse VVDI Key Tool Max.

    This turned out to be 100% not true. In the end, the aftermarkets were the only ones out of the four that programmed correctly with Techstream. All told, I spent a net of $66.22 per key (net price of two fobs plus price of the Mini VCI divided by two) after being quoted $250 per key by several different locksmiths. And sending the OEMs out for unlocking would have pushed the net price up somewhat, but more importantly would have meant considerable delay in getting this done.

    The aftermarket fobs came in bags labeled with the correct FCC ID (HYQ14AAB) and transmitter ID suffix (3370), but the actual boards had no numbers of any kind printed on them - they just said 'Lonsdor.' They came from an ebay seller who appears to sell under many different names but is based in Walnut, CA.

    I figure that at this price point, cloning two brand-new aftermarket backups for roughly the same net price as one heavily-used OEM backup is fantastic. You never know how many washing machine cycles a used OEM fob has endured, either.
     
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  4. Gourockian

    Gourockian Junior Member

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    Hi Jack, I'm very glad to hear that you managed to get your two keyfobs set up correctly using Techstream. It's certainly somewhat surprising that the 'unlocked' OEM ones did not work but the non-OEM ones did. Did you manage to also get the proximity features to work okay? That was the only thing that wouldn't work for me, when I tried the non-OEM one.

    This should be an encouragement to others who need to get new keyfobs but they would be well advised to get them from the same source as you did and ignore what he says about them not being compatible with Techstream.

    Now all you need to do is keep them well away from the washing machine.:LOL:

    Al
     
  5. Jack Maniaci

    Jack Maniaci Junior Member

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    I don't think they were really unlocked, just "tested." I'd think the seller would explicitly say they're "unlocked" if they'd gone to the trouble to unlock them.

    I guess maybe 'tested' with their originally paired vehicle? You'd think that the seller got them long after the originally paired cars had gone to the junkyard, though. Who knows?

    The fully unlocked used OEMs for this particular flavor of fob (HYQ14AAB / 3370) started at $100 when I last checked earlier this month. Since I really just wanted backups for my sole working OEM fob, and I already had both working aftermarkets programmed and fully operational (after a long ordeal of trial and error with getting Techstream off the ground), I'm happy to settle for two non-OEMs that definitely work for the same approximate net price of one OEM that may or may not work (and are manufactured by a company whose name I actually recognize).

    This is the thing that makes it a so-called "smart key," right? Where it senses the key as you approach and unlocks it automatically? The old OEM key never once did this, so it wasn't something I expected to work in the new keys. Someone elsewhere in the forum speculated that AABs are "dumb," while ACXs are "smart," i.e., AABs are made from older transmitters without this proximity feature. If this is true, then I was starting from a "dumb" original fob with no proximity feature.

    I'm still figuring this part out though. I know I selected "w/ touch sensor" (see screen cap below) in setting this up, and I noticed some slightly different unlocking behavior in using new key last night. But it didn't do anything when I approached it carrying the new fob just now. It's frankly way more features than I actually need, and I'd rather not accidentally unlock it if, say, I had to double back for some reason and walk past the parked car well before I intend to drive it.

    [​IMG]

    I think there were at least half a dozen sellers with identical listings for these aftermarket fobs; they were all based in Walnut, CA. So I can only presume they are in reality one and the same seller. Prices varied between these identical listings, though.
     
    #45 Jack Maniaci, Jan 19, 2024
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2024
  6. Gourockian

    Gourockian Junior Member

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    I was just going by what you said earlier.
    No, mine doesn't unlock automatically but it does unlock without me taking the keyfob out of my pocket. There is a sensor at the back of the driver's door handle and, in some models, the passenger door also, which only unlocks the door when it detects the keyfob to be in very close proximity. Likewise, I can lock the car by touching the ridged area of the front door handles or by pushing a button under the hatchback release. Of course, I can do both of these using the remote control feature, as standard.

    Another feature is that when starting the car, the keyfob just needs to be somewhere inside the car when pushing the Power button so again, I don’t need to take it out of my pocket.

    I wouldn't be too concerned about this as you have to physically touch the back of the door handle to unlock it, in which case you would hear it beep to alert you. If you did happen to forget something and walk away, you would then be able to remotely lock it again.