Featured Trump tariffs put the US auto industry in disarray

There are no $20,000 American-made cars.

While I feel for the people who's jobs are at stake, I'd rather have one of those cool Chinese cars than any of the American-made cars, even if the price were the same or a bit more.

 

And just reason #1,000 on why we need tariffs against China!

Personally, I wouldn't touch any Chinese vehicle with a 10-foot pole. About 15-years ago, a co-workers bought a Chinese 150cc scooter and didn't know anything about maintenance so I had him drive it over to teach him. Cheapest thing I'd ever seen but did teach him how to change the oil. It started having issues within a year (lost power) so he called around to the motorcycle shops to see if they'd look at it....nope, not a single shop would service a Chinese scooter. He ended up selling it.

 

Seeing how I know plenty of people in other countries who are happy with their Chinese EV's I don't believe the stereotype that anything that's cheap from China is worthless.

On the other hand, I do know 6 different people who've bought a Ford Escape only to see it have a $5,000 to $9,000 transmission failure between 60k and 100k miles.

 

At least not in Europe it wasn't the cause of the war.

 

What you are describing is anti dumping tarrifs? People don't object to those. But what about general tarrifs. These have been tried in the past and always hurt the economy imposing them.

The US has severe trade restrictions on chinese made vehicles, so no americans can not except with few exceptions buy chinese made cars. Chinese companies own factories in the US, UK, and EU and it is likely with the 10% tarrif on UK vehicles, and 15% tarrif on EU vehicles, that they will pay higher tarrifs for raw materials (aluminum and steel have 50% tarrif) and parts (25% tarrif) for vehicles made in the USA. So no if the idea was to move manufacturing jobs to the US, these tarrifs will have the oposite effect and are already causing job losses in manufacturing (lost jobs every month trump has been in office, likely because of the trade policy and uncertainty). If you check the employment figures today they were really bad.

So yes you could put a 25% tarrif on cars assembled in japan, UK, and EU and move manufacuring slowly to the US. The steel aluminum and parts tarrifs will only raise prices and decrease employment in the auto industry, and every industry that uses a lot of steel and aluminum. I post earlier the fed's analysis that steel and aluminum tarrifs decreased employment in industries using them, and employment continued to fall in those two industries in the US, so a lose lose for most americans.

What do we get from these tarrifs. US businesses and consumers pay, but prices increase more than the tarrifs in many cases because they eliminate competition. Right now buying parts ahead, and eating the loss is happening, but that is ending according to july economic data. Trump is getting golf courses and help from those that he tarrifs, but most americans will end up being poorer because of it. Stagflation is the likely effect.

 

If this is the case then even the DNC will be able to beat him or anybody he backs when he runs for office again.
However (comma!) THUS far the Donkeys are making themselves look foolish by prognostications just like the one that prompted the title of this thread...AND they are assisting Trump in winning the fight!
Think about it.
If Trump had just come out and donked the EU on the head with a 15% tariff back in February, then the economy would have reacted very negatively.
Now?
Most norms are giving him a (well deserved) Dubbaya because he was originally threatening over 100% - and REMEMBER......the lowest VAT in the EU is STILL 17% - and some people luuuuuve VATs becuase they are....a tax.

If the Dems keep saying that Trump is going to end all life on earth as we know it and that people are going to be struggling to push ox-carts full of $100 bills around to pay for a loaf of bread, and we only get 10% inflation then.....they're going to be made to look like the fools that they have been acting like.
Go back six months and it was going to be the summer of empty shelves, hyperinflation and mass unemployment.

Quite frankly I AM glad that the fed is keeping the interest rate where it is because lower interest rates are making runaway spending as attractive to the Pubs as it is to the DNC.....and the current rate might serve to throttle the lingering Bidenflation...

Stagflation?
We will have to see....
The Pubs are talking like they want to give away $600 rebate cheques which would result in the US spending over 190 billions of dollars because we took in 27 billion more than we spent in June.


-can't make this stuff up, folks.

 

+1

Please check your figures and your wallet. Stagflation looks like it is here. Instead of a 3% growth rate that we would have predicted with no big ugly bill and no increased tarrifs, we have a 1.25% growth rate of gdp in the first half. Of course q1 and q2 have oposite effects of the tarrifs, with increased imports in q1, then decreased because people stocked up in q2.

June's surplus is a result of timing when that is taken into account the US had a deficit of $71B in june even after $18B in tarrif tax revenue. The deficit in the first half of the year was 7% higher than last year, but this is likely to increase in the second half of the year. The deficit rose to $1.3T. Just as the negative gdp growth in q1 was because of imports being pulled forward, the lower imports in q2 mean that q3 imports will be taxed at a higher rate. It is best to remove some of the seasonality caused by the tarrifs and the calendar.

There is an absurdity of putting in place a highly complicated tax system which is the current tarrifs based on a fake emergency, then saying you will give some people back some of those taxes. Why collect them in the first place and put a lot of possible corruption in the system if you are going to give the money back. That money has already been allocated to those making more than $500K/year through the tax cuts.

 

As far as my wallet?

I'm the victim of a labour union, and thus I get regular raises AND the thrill of watching many of my co-workers get surplussed.

Since I didn't go into debt for a $250,000 degree in underwater basket-weaving and since Robbie the Robot (quoted: above) cannot use test instruments, fiber circuits, or install circuit packs I'm probably going to be OK until I decide to retire.
I'm on track to make 10-20% more this year than last year, and I will probably max out on the OT deduction.

 

This country was founded and run with money from tariffs, we didn't even have real income tax until around 1900.

Up until this point almost all the 1st world countries we trade with had higher tariffs on us than we did on them. China had a 30% tariff on us and we only had 10% on them. Because the multinational companies prefer the slave labor, and a tax break and tariff benefit offshoring policy encourages that. Apple pays $20 to make a I-phone in China at a Foxcon factory that has suicide nets on the workers dormitory buildings. Do I-phones cost $1500 because of tariffs?

No Chinese cars in the USA is for multiple reasons. First most of them can't pass DOT regs, mainly crash tests. (They still haven't built a large passenger jet that can pass the wing break test.) Secondly the big three being run by predatory capitalist bean counters means they spend as little as possible on future tech investment, and they would die if not protected from cheap imports. The Japanese are at least 10 years ahead of them on tech. None of the big 3 would ever build something as successful as a Prius, at one point the 2nd gen was the single most prolific model of car in the state of California, they are too lazy, uncaring, and focused on short term profit.

The current president has just recently acquired a $500 Billion pledge of investment from Japan to build new auto factories in the USA, he gave them a break on tariffs in exchange. So tariffs were used as leverage for benefits. That means good paying factory jobs for US citizens. Would you rather import Chinese cars that are cheap because of cheap labor?

 

^ The netting in post #229 image, for garbage? Jumpers??

 

Yes, that's at an iPhone factory in China to catch the jumpers trying to kill themselves. The Chicoms leave a LOT to be desired as far as human rights and liberty and freedom.....that's for sure....

 

So you want to go back to the early 1900s? I do not. The last 75 years had a income tax and global trade. We are not going back to an agrarian economy where england taxes our tea. Why is ok for the president to declare a fake emergency and tax our coffee?

iphone would according to apple cost around $3000 to produced in the US, and it would be in a very automated factory with few employees. Their isn't a tarrif on iphones today, the 25% tarriff has been postponed to august 12, and I expect it will be postponed again. If it goes into effect that $1000 iphone will retail for $1250 and will still be manufactured outside america. If just china was targetted maybe this would make sense, but canada? Vietnam? I would pay more for my phone if it was produced with better labor practices, but apple isn't going to bring jobs here for the iphone nor is samsung. So avacados, penguins, coffee, how does any of that make sense. Why are we taxing aluminum from canada at 50%? There seems to be no method only madness. Just so we can't see the effects trump is firing the guy putting out labor statistics, since the numbers were bad today and he wants someone that will fudge the numbers.

There are specific regulations against importing cars from china. CHina is the number 1 car market, and EU last year put on tarrifs to slow their sales. So I don't know why if you hate the way the big 2 plus stalantus (not really american anymore), why there should be a 15% tarrif on a prius, and tarrifs on the japanese parts so it is unlikely toyota will build them here.

Remember when foxconn pleged to invest $10B in an american factory during trump's first term? Remember china pleging to import a ton of US stuff? I doubt these pledges mean anything. I do thing the trade wars mean most countries will move away from trade with the US and more to China and Brazil Really a 10% tarrif on imported cars rising 5% a year to 25% and no tarrif on steel or aluminum would move factories here. I expect auto employment to drop in the US. Check back in a year. Global tarrif tantrum that disrupts supply chains is bad for everyone except inside traders and those oligarks the government favors.

 

I still don't get why it's okay for China to have a 30% tariff on us and we only have 10% on them? That's how it's been for decades. If it's so wrong for us to do it now, why wasn't it wrong for them to do it all this time?

What do you trust more, a pledge from China or a pledge from Japan?
Not to talk down on them, they have a very hard life, but the Chinese are inherently corrupt and the Japanese are the opposite.

All politics aside, if you don't think moving $500 Billion in Japanese manufacturing to the USA, of the cars we are buying anyway, is a positive then I can't tell you anything.

 

Tariffs work both ways folks.

 

It's a Foxcon factory dormitory. Just the thought of that alone and the implications of a company home. At the time the photo was taken it was a 12 hr day 6 day work week, not sure what it is now. Apple has gotten some pushback. I think it was taken 10 or 12 years ago

 

I used to work 7-12's...and I'm still here

 

I worked 6-12's for a long time but never 7. Would be interesting to know what their wages are and the cost of living. Vids of the poor areas of China are interesting and they are very clean. Also drive through vids of the largest city in the world Guangzhou China are amazing, crazy architecture and roads

 

. . . and lazy MBA management! They were the ones who "outsourced" what they could not design, engineer, or build.

Bob Wilson

 

You know he can't right? I mean, unless he changes the Constitution..which he might.