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Peace march 1/27/07 Washington DC

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by chogan, Jan 28, 2007.

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  1. Sufferin' Prius Envy

    Sufferin' Prius Envy Platinum Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Jan 29 2007, 08:46 AM) [snapback]382293[/snapback]</div>
    I don't think Hanoi Jane ever stood on top of a shot down American plane . . .
    . . . but she did man a North Vietnamese anti-aircraft gun.

    [​IMG]
    "I, a socialist, think that we should strive toward a socialist society, all the way to communism."
    - Jane Fonda
    http://www.1stcavmedic.com/jane_fonda.htm

    I guess that's way HER way of supporting the troops. Applaud the enemy and man their guns. :blink:

    Hey, but she was young and stupid then.
    Now she is just, um, old and stupid. :rolleyes:
     
    #21 Sufferin' Prius Envy, Jan 29, 2007
  2. chogan

    chogan New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mystery Squid @ Jan 29 2007, 01:43 PM) [snapback]382362[/snapback]</div>
    Sorry, but you're only demonstrating your lack of understanding of statistics here.

    The accuracy of a random sample, for estimating the true average of a population, is solely a function of the size of the sample. It is not a function of the fraction of the population that is surveyed. This is a common mis-perception, but any statistics textbook will set you straight, if you'd care to learn.

    The survey, and the margins of error, are correct as they stand. The were performed competently, with the full cooperation of the US military. The overwhelming majority of US troops in Iraq favor withdrawal, as the article said.

    In case you disbelieve the sample size issue, I just googled up a few dozen references. Any one will do, they all say the same thing. Here's one:

    http://www.macorr.com/ss_methodology.htm

    "The mathematics of probability proves the size of the population is irrelevant, unless the size of the sample exceeds a few percent of the total population you are examining. This means that a sample of 500 people is equally useful in examining the opinions of a state of 15,000,000 as it would a city of 100,000. For this reason, the population size is ignored when it is "large" or unknown. Population size is only likely to be a factor when you work with a relatively small and known group of people (e.g., the members of an association)."

    Here's another one:

    http://www.robertniles.com/stats/sample.shtml

    "So a sample of 1,600 people gives you a margin of error of 2.5 percent, which is pretty darn good for a poll. (See Margin of Error for more details on that term, and on polls in general.) Now, remember that the size of the entire population doesn't matter here. You could have a nation of 250,000 people or 250 million and that won't affect how big your sample needs to be to come within your desired margin of error. The Math Gods just don't care."

    Upshot: There is no technical flaw in the polling method. You have no rational basis for disbelieving the results. You can choose to disbelieve them, but in fact, the majority of our soldiers want withdrawal. That does not change the fact that to disparage a strategy of withdrawal is to disparage the opinion of the overwhelming majority of our troops in Iraq.
     
    #22 chogan, Jan 29, 2007
  3. dbermanmd

    dbermanmd New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(chogan @ Jan 29 2007, 01:49 PM) [snapback]382364[/snapback]</div>
    Tour - de - force - from the looks of it more like the tour - de - france :lol:

    i remember the good old protests in the 60's with hundreds of thousands of hippies and other future college professors and actors and directors and newpaper editors and reporters.
     
    #23 dbermanmd, Jan 29, 2007
  4. Mystery Squid

    Mystery Squid Junior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MegansPrius @ Jan 29 2007, 03:54 PM) [snapback]382368[/snapback]</div>
    Ok, take your wikpedia, and run the math... You've got all the numbers, and come back and tell us precisely, or more accurate, how "confident" stated poll is...




    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(chogan @ Jan 29 2007, 04:09 PM) [snapback]382374[/snapback]</div>
    :lol:
     
    #24 Mystery Squid, Jan 29, 2007
  5. chogan

    chogan New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(livelychick @ Jan 29 2007, 01:31 PM) [snapback]382357[/snapback]</div>
    I will reply in a private message. That's too nice a topic for exposure in this thread.
     
    #25 chogan, Jan 29, 2007
  6. burritos

    burritos Senior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mystery Squid @ Jan 29 2007, 11:51 AM) [snapback]382296[/snapback]</div>
    Nope. The insurgents would like to thank fresnecks like YOU who give idiots like bush the power to supply them with an endless amount of targets.

    Our soldiers will stop dying when they are out of iraq, not before.
     
    #26 burritos, Jan 29, 2007
  7. JackDodge

    JackDodge Gold Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mystery Squid @ Jan 29 2007, 11:51 AM) [snapback]382296[/snapback]</div>
    Ah, there we go, a rightard telling us that Americans exercising their right to peaceable assembly aids terrorists. Probably just a coincidence that you disagree with the antiwar demonstrators and just love to watch a good war. :rolleyes:
     
    #27 JackDodge, Jan 29, 2007
  8. Mystery Squid

    Mystery Squid Junior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JackDodge @ Jan 29 2007, 05:17 PM) [snapback]382394[/snapback]</div>
    ca-ching, yet another one takes the personal attack initiative!!!




    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(burritos @ Jan 29 2007, 05:09 PM) [snapback]382391[/snapback]</div>
    It's people like you who can't be reasoned with that should really, well, to put it bluntly, be herded into the ocean...

    ...but since we're a civilized society, marginalizing fools as such will do fine.

    8 years, 8 years... :lol:
     
    #28 Mystery Squid, Jan 29, 2007
  9. dbermanmd

    dbermanmd New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(burritos @ Jan 29 2007, 03:09 PM) [snapback]382391[/snapback]</div>
    funny, since our soldiers have been doing such a heroic job in light of all the anti-America and anti-military sentiments expressed by the dems and the media - we have suffered NO casualties at home to innocent american civilians.

    our soldiers want to do the job - too bad they have to fight not only the enemy but the enablers of our enemies.
     
    #29 dbermanmd, Jan 29, 2007
  10. burritos

    burritos Senior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Jan 29 2007, 03:23 PM) [snapback]382398[/snapback]</div>
    You're right. It was a plane full of afghanis and iraqis that crashed in 9/11. Maybe if we kill them all, they won't do it again. That's what you want right doberman? To kill all the brown people in the middle east, right?
     
    #30 burritos, Jan 29, 2007
  11. MarinJohn

    MarinJohn Senior Member

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    I'm not sure why you guys are so intent in even attempting to reply to the right wingers. They follow their leader in ignoring facts, scientific method, changing circumstances, and instead plow ahead with their uneducated fallacies. 'It's tough being green'.
     
    #31 MarinJohn, Jan 29, 2007
  12. dbermanmd

    dbermanmd New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(burritos @ Jan 29 2007, 03:30 PM) [snapback]382399[/snapback]</div>
    u r catching on - a little slow - but making progress just the same. its best not to respond to righties anyhow - less chance for kumbaya's failing
     
    #32 dbermanmd, Jan 29, 2007
  13. Pinto Girl

    Pinto Girl New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Jan 29 2007, 03:23 PM) [snapback]382398[/snapback]</div>
    1. You don't know if, and there is no way to prove, that the current military action has anything to do with our suffering no casualties at home (post 9/11).

    2. We, as American civilians -- by the very ways in which we live our lives -- are not, as you assert, 'innocent.'

    I'm really disturbed by the 'kill all the brown people' sentiment. Words cease to be 'just words' when they express thoughts such as these.
     
    #33 Pinto Girl, Jan 29, 2007
  14. chogan

    chogan New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MarinJohn @ Jan 29 2007, 03:33 PM) [snapback]382402[/snapback]</div>
    Yes, at this point I agree. I was naive to believe otherwise.

    I'll leave off this thread with two positive statements.

    First, every year since the war started, I've donated $1,000 to the USO, for care packages to be sent to our troops. It buys 40 care packages at $25 a pop. BFD. But it's something. And unlike most Americans, I could not stomach putting a "Support Our Troops, Bring Them Home" bumpersticker on my car knowing full well that I had not done one tangible thing actually to support them. So, before the sticker went on, the check went in the mail.

    So, right-wingers, talk is cheap. You want to impress somebody with your patriotism, you want to support our troops, then put your money where your mouth is, and make a donation to the USO. The website is:

    http://www.usocares.org/src/uso_home.htm

    Click Donate Now to put it on your credit card. And you get to send a message of encouragement to the recipient of your package. So, if you feel that staying the course is a sound concept, you can say that directly to the men and women under fire. Or you can just thank them for their service, as I do.

    Second, today I wrote and mailed letters to Senators Warner, Webb, and to Congressman Davis. In less time that it takes to reply to this thread, you could do the same, to your elected representatives. If you really think that the best possible course is to stay in Iraq for ... ever ... then write your sentiment to the people who matter.
     
    #34 chogan, Jan 29, 2007
  15. JackDodge

    JackDodge Gold Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mystery Squid @ Jan 29 2007, 03:20 PM) [snapback]382395[/snapback]</div>
    You ought to be using Mel's arrest picture for your avatar, it would be funnier and more in line with your hamster-brain intellect.
     

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    #35 JackDodge, Jan 29, 2007
  16. burritos

    burritos Senior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JackDodge @ Jan 29 2007, 04:56 PM) [snapback]382456[/snapback]</div>
    Why are you insulting hamsters?
     
    #36 burritos, Jan 29, 2007
  17. JackDodge

    JackDodge Gold Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sufferin' Prius Envy @ Jan 29 2007, 01:59 PM) [snapback]382371[/snapback]</div>
    there's something about a woman in uniform yum yum
     

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    #37 JackDodge, Jan 29, 2007
  18. JackDodge

    JackDodge Gold Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(burritos @ Jan 29 2007, 05:47 PM) [snapback]382496[/snapback]</div>
     

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    #38 JackDodge, Jan 29, 2007
  19. Mystery Squid

    Mystery Squid Junior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinto Girl @ Jan 29 2007, 06:13 PM) [snapback]382425[/snapback]</div>
    Maybe "medical" marijuana is the answer right? :lol:
     
    #39 Mystery Squid, Jan 29, 2007
  20. hycamguy07

    hycamguy07 New Member

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    I guess theres nothing wrong with a peaceful protest, it really doesn't change things it just makes them (protesters) feel better. And the rest that choose not to protest to look at the protesters as un-american.

    I was waiting for the initiative to start their personal attacks, after all everyone that doesn't look through the same rose colored glasses as they do. Would be concidered rightards even if your not a right-winger..
     
    #40 hycamguy07, Jan 29, 2007
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