Possible harness-damage problem for 04-06 Prius

not the most informative response from tech.

basically, as long as there are no reported problems (and so far there haven't been) they're not going to dig into it too far.

 

While I'm almost regretting creating a monster here, I must say
that's a rather Microsoftian response from Toyota. It would have
been nice to find out what the designers *intended*.
.
That poor harness. It's got a rough life. Not only from a nasty
sharp plate maybe threatening its midsection, but that's also the
one that carries all the MG resolver circuits and just around the
corner from the mob scene here, also has connector M5 -- remember
that one, that's supposed to get greased in SSC 50P? Never got an
answer on why they just go after that one, either.
.
Maybe in '09 they'll re-route the whole thing and come down from above...
.
_H*

 

in my effort to catch up on Priuschat topics when i have spare time (today is my day off) i ran into this.

Hobbit, kudos to you for your wonderful webpage and the insights you have provided during your time here. i dont think you brought up an alarm needlessly. you only presented information. its up to us to evaluate.

now, i must admit that i completely fail to see the issue here. in the original pic by Hobbit, he provided clearance by simply bending the cable. although i have yet to look at mine, that will be my method of "fixing" the issue. i dont see a need to take anything apart.

also, i have full faith that Toyota has seen and addressed the issue here. the inconsistencies with the manual are not far-fetched if a line stop was performed early in the assembly process and the plate reversed due to the sharp edge concerns. the added protection of the cable at this point is more than proof enough to me that the problem was recognized, evaluated and adjusted.

now, should we ignore it. heck no. that is a huge mistake imm because no matter how wrong the opinion seems to be, to discount without investigation is simply wrong. for the peace of mind that it would bring some, its more than worth it to invest a little time.

 

Well, at 12,222 miles I finally got around to doing another oil change and decided to investigate this issue on my Prius. It's tough to see in there clearly (even up on the lift) but I could feel a minor cut in the exterior factory cable housing adjacent to the offending tab. Although it did not appear very deep yet, I could see the potential for real damage if the wear continued. That little metal tab is sharp indeed!
I took some plumbers tape and wound a few layers around the cable to add a margin of safety.
Lift - $4.00
Tape - $0.15
Eliminating the uncertainty of just what's going on down there - priceless

 

Does anyone know if this issue applies to the 2007s?

I'd go outside and look myself, but I live in Chicago, and right now, it's COOOOLLLDD out there.

 

Finally found this thread again. I thought it used to be a sticky. IMHO, it still should be a sticky.

When I first read Hobbit's discovery a few months ago, I went outside and immediately found this problem on my 2006. Taking the easy way out at the time, I added another layer of convoluted plastic split wire loom in the area of the harness being chafed by the sharp edge of the protruding tab.

After finding that Toyota is ambiguous, if not ambivalent in their response to this issue, I decided to take matters into my own hands (why not? my 11 month old 2006 Prius is already out of bumper to bumper warranty anyway) and have a closer look.

I did not like what I saw. The added protection was in contact with the offending tab, and the results of their frolicking were evident.

I removed the plate. The bottom bolt was a piece of cake. The top bolt was VERY difficult to loosen. I eventually had to get a 5 degree racheting box wrench AND attach a one foot long 1.125" ID square tube cheater pipe to the handle end of the wrench in order to loosen the bolt 5 degrees, after which I was able to loosen the bolt halfway with the wrench alone, and finally the rest of the way with carefully positioned fingers snaking around the wire harness stand off and clip.

It might have helped if I undid the entire black plastic air dam, but since the dealer already undid and redid that airdam 4 times while dealing with the headlights, I didn't know how many reinstallation cycles those fasteners and plastic christmas tree rivets had left in them, so I elected to work around the air dam, proving that it can be done this way.

Once removed, I could see for myself EXACTLY what Hobbit is talking about.

But rather than rely on the conclusions of "some guy on the internet" , I set about to make precise measurements of every aspect and reference point related to the fitment of this plate over that hole with my dial caliper.

The plate is asymetrical. The distance of the lower mounting hole to the inspection hole indentation is greater than the distance of the upper mounting hole to the inspection hole indentation. The mounting surface on the hybrid transaxle has a corressponding distance differential betwixt the plate mounting holes and the inspection port... and this differential matches the way the plate is stamped ONLY when the plate is reversed and positioned the way Hobbit recommends.

I also measured the diameter of the hemispherical indentation on the plate, the diameter of the hole itself at various points (since the hole is not perfectly round, but the minimum diameter is still greater than the maximum diameter of the stamped indentation in the cover plate).

I also noticed that dirt had slipped in behind the cover plate as mounted, as evidenced by a ring of dirt that was offset from the indentation circle. It appeared to me that better sealing would occure of more of the flat surface of the cover plate were mated with more of the flat surface of the mounting boss, which wasn't possible in the manner that I found the plate since the hemispherical indentation was protruding convex away from the flat surface.

With Hobbit's proposed mounting, that is supported by two out of the five service manual references mentioned earlier in this thread, the indentation of the plate would seat in the hole, and more of the flat surface of the plate would contact the flat surface of the machined mounting flange of the transaxle.

Once you have the plate off in your hand, and look at the different mounting hole distances from the center inspection hole, and once you trial fit the plate back over the mounting surface in every possible manner and configuration (well, there are only two ways really, since the protruding tab prevents the plate from being mounted the other two ways... and it just now dawns on me that that is probably why that tab exists!)

Anyway, once I felt the fitment in my own hands, it was obvious and readily apparent how to remount that plate. And it wasnt' the way I found it.

Before bolting the plate back on the right way, there were a couple of issues I had to address.

First, the factory obviously torqued the top bolt waaaay beyond the torque specification for that application, and the unintended consequence of this is that the plate itself was found to be gouged from the split lock washer. If left unaddressed, the gouged metal pushed up by the lockwasher would prevent the plate from sealing flat against the mounting surface when the plate was reversed.

So, I used a very flat cold chisel to knock the burrs off, and a very fine triangular file with the plate on a 110 lb. anvil to retrue the surface around the bolt hole.

Second, because the burrs were made up of base metal pushed up and out of the cover plate, they obviously left tiny gouges in their wake, which I felt should be filled to provide the optimum sealing surface. I micro-troweled a very thin layer of Permatex RTV around the bolt holes of the cover plate, and continued spreading this very thin and flat layer of Permatex around the outermost perimeter of the plate. Even with full torque applied to the plate, this layer was thin enough and far enough from the inspection hole itself not to spread into the hole when tightened, yet is contiguous and evenly spread so that it will provide more of a seal from dirt than I found when I removed the plate.

So, with that, I mounted the plate, bolted it up, and now enjoy the confidence of no dirt, and no more idiotic periodic inspections of how that wire harness protection loom is holding up.

Good luck getting Toyota to address this. Sometimes the obvious just needs to get done without all the red tape.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MegansPrius @ Dec 7 2006, 02:36 AM) [snapback]358764[/snapback]</div>

I can confirm that is installed the same way in my 2007.

 

Mine also had the tab rubbing against the harness. I have the oil changes done at an independent shop and I mentioned it to them. They attempted to just flip it over moving the tab away from the harness, but when it is flipped over the holes do not line up for the bolts. So they simply used a grinding wheel to grind off the tab and they put the plate back on - Problem solved.....you could also cut it with a hack saw if you are a do-it yourself type. Cmon people this is not Rocket Science, If Toyota is dragging their feet, take sme action and get it fixed elswhere, it is NOT a big deal and very easy to fix

 

Once again... getting it fixed somewhere besides Toyota makes it that much easier for Toyota to drag their feet because they don't see the problem reports come in... . Simple math.

 

I saw this thread and was concerned. I can see it from above easily, and the cable is about 10-12mm away from the tab, no problems. The tab is still the way posted here. My car was made in Feb 07. I think the tab is correctly positioned, as the cable is not supposed to be touching the casting either. The cable has an extra protective sleeve in this area, they have thought of the problem. I think the tab is supposed to act as a standoff in case the cable somehow moves, and if it does move it will touch the tab first with the extra sleeve. IMHO it looks like the fix is to form the cable away.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mr.Vanvandenburg @ Mar 29 2007, 08:22 AM) [snapback]414156[/snapback]</div>

I looked at this situation on my '05 last weekend while changing the oil. My cable also has the sleeve that makes moving the tab unecessary. i purchased the car used from the dealer and did need to get the "computer" replaced under warranty so maybe mine was fixed somewhere along the line. All I can say now is that there is no problem with the current setup.

 

Had my car in for 15K service at Wondries Toyota and took with me the pictures of the plate and harness.

My service guy flipped the plate without charging me for the labor and said that the harness was a good inch away from the offending tab; one less thing to worry about.

 

Update from a 2009 Prius owner.

Same on my 2009 Prius.

I was glad to see these comments until later further down the thread...

Unfortunately not. I looked when changing oil on my 09 Prius and the cable was touching the tab like the various photos already posted.

Makes me wonder if I was able to do it even if I wanted to.

Looks like three strikes to the factory's mounting orientation.

This looks like too big a job for me...

I suppose I could easily add another wrap of some kind of tubing to further protect the cable. And I will see if I could smear some silicone around the edge of the cover plate to help prevent dirt getting into the engine-transaxle coupling - too scared to touch the two bolts.