Crazy Neighbors Bad Behaviour Escalating

For God's sake, don't provoke them and be careful. This is a major incident waiting to happen. I would put big time pressure on the association. Talk to an attorney and see what sort of lawsuit could be filed against the association if they fail to act. Check your CC&Rs for any potential violations these guys may be doing and bring them to the attention of the association. Be careful, careful, careful. Lock your doors, stay away from the creeps and get a dog - a big, big dog. Consider arming yourself too if you feel threatened. I am not a handgun kind of guy, but maybe some mace just in case. Also - how about getting a male roommate. I don't mean to be sexist, but a big male roommate. Really.

Also, I don't mean to offend, but I find it ironic that people don't want to move to the suburbs and live in tract homes but they are willing to put up with this kind of crap. I mean, when I was in my 20s I lived in a beach community with lots of noise, drunks, and partying. No more, thank you. I live in suburbia with great neighbors - nice and quiet, reliable, etc. No guarantees in my neighborhood either - but I have a Doctor, Realtor, Salesman, and Consultant in my cul-de-sac. I shiver every time I think about living back in a congested urban environment with out of control neighbors with no sense of decency and homeless drunks fumbling through my trashcans at 2:00 in the morning. No, I will take the boring look alike houses in my community any day over that ever again.

Anyway, I really hope you do get your situation straightened out because I can tell you love where you are at. But if not you really ought to consider a move.

 

I have similar QUALITY OF LIFE ISSUES where I live.

Since when have the sidewalks become living rooms?
Who owns the property??? I doubt it's a group of vets.....
Why should homeowner/taxpayers be held hostage to folks who are just renters, or even worse, don't pay their rent?

Definitely bring the issue to your condo association! The police are paid by whom???? The taxpayers !Next stop- city council or the mayor's office!

 

Like I said - my intent was not to offend. As I mentioned, bad neighbors can be anywhere. Though in my experience, the denser the area the more likely you are going to have problem neighbors. And I bristle at the constant barrage of negativity toward the 'burbs. I as you, love my neighborhood - and for a lot of reasons.

Anyway, my sincere best to you in getting these creeps cleared out.

 

These things are always hard because you don't know what would provoke them to attack and harm you. The police are great at arresting people after they had done something to you, but then its too late.

You do have a better chance of having the police and courts intervene because of the power relationship they have over you (big male, small female). Videotape will absolutely be the best thing, even better than detailed notes. Audio tape will work too, but you have to be closer to them for the audio tape to work well. Having a friend or neighbor across the street with a video camera would be best, but it is hard to know when these nut cases are going to go off the deep end. A dog is a very good idea, and so is a handgun.

BTW - just because they say they are vets doesn't mean they are. A local survey here by the newspaper a few years ago showed that 80% of the long hair pan handlers who claimed to be vets were not. Any long-haired, hippy loser who has blown out his mind with too many drugs will claim to have been in Viet Nam (but they usually can't tell you what outfit they were in or where they were stationed).

Reporter BG Burkett ran into a brick wall in trying to raise money for the Texas Viet Nam War Memorial back in the late 1970s, as even corporate donors were hesitant to donate to honor the "losers" who committed atrocities in Viet Nam:

From http://www.nationalreview.com/flashback/ow...00404230859.asp

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priusmaybe @ May 14 2007, 10:30 PM) [snapback]442096[/snapback]</div>

Bottom Line file a complaint with your Police dept. wait three days and go pick up a copy of the report. Keep a record fo dates/times they harrass you.Check with other tennets and see if they too are getting harrassed take the information to your condo board and ask that something be done about the problem and that you really like where your at and dont want to move. If you feel threatend ask for a protection order (that says they can not talk to you or harrass you in any way). Next would be get an attorney or move....

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(fshagan @ May 15 2007, 10:55 PM) [snapback]443108[/snapback]</div>

I sure hope that you aren't saying that everyone who served in Viet Nam is a "looser who committed atrocities in Viet Nam". I take GREAT exception to that.

As to these two whack jobs you are having to deal with, there is no excuse for this kind of behavior. They probably aren't Viet Nam Vets. are they in their 60's? I keep seeing panhandlers who are in their 30's, who claim to be Viet Nam vets . I ask them, "did you wear diapers while you were there"?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(screaming red @ May 15 2007, 12:46 AM) [snapback]442209[/snapback]</div>

I like the Rottweiler idea a lot, but if this behavior is predictable, I would hire an off-duty policeman to work in plain clothes and spend some time witnessing this activity. And if it was a female cop, all the better.

Also, if you can definitely tell when they are smoking pot, I'm sure the cops would appreciate a call.

Good luck.

 

I agree with the other posters who feel you should be proactive about the situation.

In CA, I've heard that it's possible to bring yourself and your neighbors into mediation with a neutral third party, just to give you a chance to hash out your differences and not have the tone of the discussion escalate/become personal quite so quickly.

Also, from what I've been told, you'll have lots more leverage in court if you go through the mediation process first(or attempt it...there's no way to force your neighbors to participate if they don't want to). But, even trying to initiate this is a positive sign.

It seems like you really can't control their feelings with your behaviour. You may think that being nice to them or whatever will do it, but one never knows for sure. For all you know, it conveys weakness on your part(?!?)

Or not...it's difficult to tell...

That's why it seems like you might as well step up your efforts to confront the problem. The way I see it, doing what you're doing currently, they continue to hassle you...and actually the situation is degrading...so why continue in this way?

Also, I don't mean to be confrontational --it's clearly not your fault-- but I'd consider attending the owner's association meetings with greater frequency. It'll convey to others that you're not scared (even if you are) and that you're still a part of the building community, and perhaps will also give other people a chance to show their support for you.

I mean, if these guys are as bad as they sound, I'll bet you're not the only one who's being annoyed! Perhaps you might be able to rally support personally, and demonstrate that you're not overreacting. It might be a battle of public opinion...this way you can get more of your neighbors on your side.

Also, if someone does happen to have a beef about your pruning the shrubs or watering or whatever, it might be good to hear those concerns and accept them as valid. This might demonstrate that you're willing to listen and make changes.

Finally --and most importantly-- remember that bullies are never, *never* as tough as they appear!!

 

May I suggest that you buy a bag of quick set concrete. Late at night find their water meter. This is usually an underground concrete box near the curb. Maybe in a condo unit they're different. Anyway, remove the cover, shut off their water valve, then fill the box with quick set concrete mix. By morning, they will have a real problem on their hands. Of course you should try to not get caught. Buy the conrete with cash, wear a disguise, use an astronaut diaper.

If your cordless phone is not a digital spread spectrum phone, lose it right away. Buy a scanner and see whats out there on the airwaves. Some people still have cordless phones that are wide open on the air. (in the clear) Just make sure they are not able to listen in on your conversations. They might be listening to you, and they might be pressing your buttons because they can. Apartments and condo clusters are jam packed with all sorts of wireless devices....wink wink. If you can figure out which brand of phone they are using, buy one just like it, but do not plug it into the phone line. Power up the base unit and charge the handset, but do not use it....to make any calls.....next time they plan on buying some.....take notes.

Be careful. Get a side-arm and learn how to use it. Forget the dog.

 

Go down and talk to the police and and find out how to get a TRO. Usually when they violate the TRO, the judge will have a talk with them and see if they think their continuing to act the way they do is worth spending some time in jail. They will still need to pay their rent even with the free rent provided by the state and jails are not BYOB either. Good Luck.

 

I agree with most of the posters here. Call the police. Document. Call the police some more. One thing I would comment on, is if you choose to arm yourself. It seems unlikely that these guys will find a handgun very intimidating in the hands of a small female. The sound of a pump action 12-guage racking a shell is a very effective deterent. It's also got a lot more stopping power if you have to fire.

 

I realive you are a women, and will not want to confront them in any agresive manner.
BUT...If it where me, I would give them ONE chance to mind there own buisness, unless they are wishing to see Tweety Bird flying circles around their heads!!!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hawkjm73 @ May 16 2007, 01:42 PM) [snapback]443657[/snapback]</div>

And the chance of accidentally killing an innocent neighbor four units away are greatly diminished.

 

If I were you, I'd consider getting an alarm on my house. I'd have all windows and doors hooked up to a service that'll call the police if a break in occurs. It may seem like a costly expense, but this cannot compare to the cost of your life. Sleep w/ pepper spray, or some other ammunition, and try to always have your phone within arms reach and set to hit redial to go to emergency.

Is there someone that you can reside with for the next year or so so that you're able to save enough money to relocate?

*edit*

the alarm should come with a remote control. Both the wall panel and the remote should have a panic button. Maybe this'll at least make you feel a little more safe.

 

It sounds like you know how to approach this: call the police, document everything, don't confront them aggressively. So all I will add is good luck.

 

I have known of others who have gotten members kicked out of condo units. Its very difficult to do, you need clear documentation and others on your side. Its also expensive because it does involve lawyers.

The fastest route? Smell pot... call the cops. If the odor is still there they are probobly in trouble, that is probable cause.

If they are drunk and outside threatening you calling the cops is usually going to work in your favor. Even if they go inside they will answer the door drunk.


I have been able to mend fences with problem people before but when alcholhol abuse is involved it never works out.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(bhaynnes @ May 16 2007, 08:48 AM) [snapback]443455[/snapback]</div>

I'm saying exactly what you are saying. I should have put the words "losers who committed atrocities" in quotes, I guess, as that's what Burkett ran into repeatedly from the public when trying to raise money. The point of the quote and the linked article is that most of the "vets" Burkett investigated were fakers preying on the public.

Viet Nam vets are no more likely to be "screwed up" than veterans of any other war. There's a reason that many companies give preferences to vets; rather than being screwed up by their military service, it is often a beneficial thing for them.

 

Some thoughts on getting a gun, first can you shot someone? Doesn't sound that hard but listen to this. . .

On Halloween in the late 80's my wife and I lived in an upstairs apt. The people living downstairs were acquaintances of ours and we looked out for each other. They had a gathering at their house before heading out to a costume party. A couple hours after they left I heard a banging downstairs. Two guys were forcing the window trying to get in. I called 911 and was told straight up the police were very busy and that if no one was in the apartment or in physical danger then it would be some time before a patrol unit could get to the scene.

I knew our down stairs friends were scraping by trying to get money together to get married, go to school etc. .etc. So I stuck my head out the window and announced to the two robbers that I had called 911 and the cops would be here right away. One of them looked up and in a drunken slur said “Not tonight they aren’t!†and they both laughed and went back to work on the window. Wth?!? How did they know?!? That pissed me off so I grabbed our Winchester Defender, 8 shot, 12 gauge pump shotgun. I had #8 dove shot loaded and some #00 buckshot further down the tube. I walked downstairs and racked a shell just as I rounded the corner and as mentioned before it got their attention immediately. I walked up to them with the shotgun at my shoulder and the barrel pointing at their feet and announced in my best Command Voice to “Back the F**K away from the window and lay face down on the ground!†It took the loud mouth about two seconds to assume the requested position but about half way down the other guy, also likkered up, stood back up and said “F you!†He had correctly read me and knew that I wouldn’t shoot him for stealing someone else’s property. He was right, I wouldn’t. A few more F words flew back and forth and he took two steps toward me. I took two steps back and just like that the advantage was his. The moment his buddy saw this he came up off the ground and started towards me also. Now with both of them advancing towards me I felt threatened and I believe that I was within my rights to shoot to defend myself but since I had already retreated once a seed of doubt was planted. I raised the shotgun and pointed it straight at the brave guys chest and told him in no uncertain terms that he was not going to take my shotgun away from me. That stopped him and his buddy grabbed his arm and pulled him back a little ways. I took another two steps backward, turned and retreated up the stairs. Would I have shot him? Hard to say but at that moment I was not mentally prepared to kill someone. Thoroughly embarrassed and even angrier now I pulled the Louisville Slugger out of the front closet and went back down the stairs. But for whatever reason they had decided it wasn’t worth the trouble and were already leaving. Next day I found out that they had been at the apt earlier for the pre-party gathering and had left their stuff there and wanted it back. Why they thought they could break in to get it or why they didn’t tell me I don’t know but I still would not have let them do what they were trying to do.

Long story short don’t pull a gun on someone and never, never, never, point a gun at someone unless you are intend and are prepared to shoot to kill. Why? They just might take it away and use it on you. FYI it is rarely ever a good idea to shoot to wound or disable. Just like a wounded animal a wounded man is very, very dangerous. Besides shooting to wound or disable is kind of hard to do with a 12ga shotgun.

BTW at 5’ 4†you sound a mite petite for a 12 gauge shotgun. Get a Glock 23 which is a .40 cal pistol with Frangible ammo like Glaser or Cor-bon. It is a small simple gun and very easy to use and shoot. My wife at 5' 2" can and she is a good shot and enjoys going with me to the target range sometimes to brush up on the skills. The frangible round produces shallow deadly wounds but fails to penetrate anything thicker than drywall or sheet metal. Prepare yourself mentally to shoot to kill and educate, educate, educate yourself on the use of the weapon. Don’t bother getting one if you don’t think you can shoot someone because if that is the case you are probably endangering yourself and neighbors to a greater extent than before.

Wildkow

p.s. Report them when they drive away drunk, or when you smell pot outside their window. Don't get caught doing anything illegal agaisnt them. Report them to the board and the police as often as possible. Document everything. If they raise the stakes hire a PI to assist you they're cheaped than lawyers and know a few tricks.