1000 Mile Oil Change

i changed to synth at 1k but i am old fashion. Toyota says the engine is already broken in and to change it at 5k but i have always believed that metal parts wear and once they are worn change your oil and filter to clean. i break in on mineral oil to let them wear together for smooth operation and keep hard acceleration down then switch to synth oil to protect engine parts from wear after that . I dont think you'll find a tech out there that will argue changing your oil too much is bad thing but you dont want to waste cash either.

most shops are telling me if you run mineral oil change at 3k
synth 5k to be extra safe. the ICE cycling on and off seems to be building up condensation.

 

My dealer gave me a coupon for a free oil change at 1K. I took them up on it, on the assumption that it couldn't hurt to get rid of any shavings that might occur early.

But, I went with Dino Oil at that change and switched over to Mobil1 at the regularly scheduled 5K.

 

I changed it at 5000 and plan to change it every 5000 miles. I use regular dino oil 5W30 and a Fram filter.

 

The break-in change isn't needed in a modern engine. Toyotas and most modern mass-produced (can't vouch for the craft-made that is still out there) engines are machined so precisely they don't wear when first run. In the old days the cylinder and the piston were machined tight and made to wear to a perfect fit because otherwise they could end up loose at new which would be a short life indeed for the engine. That was the days when the oil plug was magnetic to attract those particles! The one on my prius (which I just changed) is brass.

I certainly doesn't hurt so if it makes you feel better...

 

i was always told break in is the time to allow all engine parts to wear together. to keep throttle range varied and not to hold to WOT for any extended time. While machine specs are very tight now from just about all manufactors they still cant allow for wear or imperfections. break-in is also the time to allow the rings to set in there grooves and wear to cylinder walls. in the old days flog a engine under 500 miles and at 80k it would be burning oil due to rings not correctly set. most newer engines have a coating on the ring faces to help control break in. in a nut shell 100 different theorys and procedures. do what makes you feel comfortable. Toytota says change at 5k and just keep top speed down and no hard accels for like the first 500-1k miles. synthetic oil will help control wear. it is all a matter of when you decide to start running it. i believe wear=slop in parts=noise.

just my two cents

 

The parts do still seat, mostly from the heat mind you, rather than the friction as used to be the case, but compared to the craft-reworked engine of 30 years ago (when if your engine made it 100k your neighbors thought you had a miracle on your hands) where there would be visible slivers of metal on the oil plug when it was removed, it doesn't qualify as the same process. Most of the minor grinding wear you are talking about will happen in the first hour of operation, long before you take the oil out at 1k, and it isn't as though those particles will be circulating, there is an oil filter perfectly capable of removing them.

I don't have a citation for a sea-change in engine manufacturing technology/tolerances/mentality/methodology, except maybe the machine that changed the world. Or hang out with automotive engineers more, I suppose.

A serious break-in procedure would require a tachometer, which, last I checked, there wasn't a button for on the display. And, contrary to your assumption, a break-in is best done with regular oil--you WANT to wear, remember--wear to fit, that is.

But again, do whatever makes sense to you, compared to the price of the engine, oil is cheap. I was going to do 5month 5000mile changes but I just changed it at 5months 3600 miles and it was DIRTY. Think it is going to be 3000miles from now on. In the end, getting out the dirty oil on time, I believe, will make the real difference; the engine doesn't run all the time but it does a lot of work when it does run (poor little thing .

 

better oil might reduce metal shavings but engineering sure didnt do it.

the levels of heat, different sizes of the metal parts, etc will still create wear. that is what the oil and rings, etc are for. metal fatigue from heat cycling has not been cured so better oil, better filters, might have a lot to do with shavings but the metal still rubs...

those engines aint that well engineered.

 

Having changed the break-in oil from two 2004 Prius, I can say for a fact that it is quite a bit darker & thicker than what you'll ever see later... even at longer intervals. And I also have Prius data that points out the aging of synthetic oil is slower than the dino stuff.

That doesn't mean you can't go longer using dino oil and it won't also provide decent protection... but since we also know that synthetic provides a minor MPG, why vary from the tried & true?

Every 5,000 miles using synthetic is what I highly recommend.

 

Hmmm. My dealer recommended (and I took them up on) an oil change at 2500 miles. It was free, so what the heck. They then recommed that I change it again at 5,000 miles and 5k thereafter. Didn't mention synth oil. I'll ask next time. They seem trustworthy. Is that possible??!!??

 

my dealer recommended an oil change at 3000 miles but the oil was "clean looking" (now what qualifies as clean looking has been discussed previously so no need to bring that subject up).

but the oil was still clean looking at 5000 miles too. there was a slight color change but it still looked a lot nicer than any other oil change i had done before. but without the cold start, or cranking the engine, the deposits are greatly reduced in the Prius as compared to a normal engine.

i think ultimately, your oil change interval should be determined based on your driving situation and habitat.

 

i changed out at 1500miles...changed over to mobil1 synthetic...5w-30...at the time, the dip stick looked clear,however, once we started to drain it out, it turned dark...i usually get up to 250000 miles on my engines when i buy them new...always have got the original out between 1000-2000miles...and always change filter with it...

 

ooops!!

i just looked at my "oil change reminder sticker" and it has me coming in for my next oil change at 17,991 miles... that is 13,000 miles from the last change!!

i think someone boo-boo'ed

 

Just to remind everyone, the recommended oil change interval in Europe on the Prius is much longer; 15,000 km or 7800 miles is my recollection.

 

interesting... is their oil the same as ours? or is it cleaner gas? or are they simply more practical?

 

A bit of all :wink:

 

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when i had a diesel isuzu, i added a magnetic drain plug. every time i changed the oil, and that was after tens of thousands of miles, there were shavings on the little magnet. then i changed from Quaker State to Castrol GTX, and voila! no shavings on the next oil change, and none after that. so: no more Quaker State. and the shavings also disappeared from my corvette's mag plug, too, so it wasn't just something inside the isuzu....

i just switched my Prius to synthetic oil, too, because i like the ads that show the engine running without regular oil seizing up and the synoil one keeps on ticking...

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I too use synthetic oil, but your reference to the ad showing one car running without regular oil and the other one on synthetic....doesn't sound fair to me if the first engine is running without oil, of course it would seize up. Are you talking about a scenario in which both engines lose oil through a leak or something, and the one with (rather, that had) synthetic oil is able to run longer? I think I remember ads like that.

 

Automotive engineer here with engine experience.

This is another topic with much opinion and very little data offered to support it. Let me offer some insight. First, new (meaning recent years) engines are tighter than older engines. This is achieved through improved manufacturing processes which allow better control of part to part tolerances. New engines require lubrication during the critical break-in period when internal friction is highest. A few engines have had to change to synthetic oil at the factory because they were seizing shortly after start-up due to the tight tolerances. In two cases, the only change to the process was changing to synthetic oil. This works because the lubricity is better and the sheer stress support is higher with synthetics.

Oil degrades over time by a combination of contamination and additive breakdown. The best way to monitor when to change oil is either hours of run time or with a contamination sensor. Many newer vehicles have the latter, and people are often surprised to find that they can drive over 7000 miles under most conditions before the oil condition sensor determines an oil change is due. This technology has been proven, and engines are surviving several hundred thousand miles when changed using this technology, the same results as changing oil at 3000 miles. Most dealers and service centers want you to change oil every 3000 miles because it is quick, easy money for them. It is rare to find situations where the oil really needs to be changed at that interval. Without an hour meter or oil condition sensor, unless you drive short distances or infrequently, both of which allow moisture and sulfuric acid to accumulate in the oil, oil changes at 5000 miles are more than adequate.

The oil filter is designed and sized (internal filter area) to filter out and hold contaminants for the length of the recommended oil use interval without significant flow degradation. There is a safety factor. A new engine will cause more contaminants to accumulate in the filter. However some of this is not wear, rather left over debris from the assembly process. Finding a few small metal shavings in the oil filter or pan at each oil change is normal. A bunch of them is not. After break-in, the particles become smaller, and are much more likely to clog a filter over time. Again, the filter is sized to accommodate this.

Break-in: The best thing you can do to extend the life and performance of your engine is to leave the original oil in the crankcase and run the engine for no less than 3000 miles with this oil. From an engineering point of view, there is strong evidence that engine performance begins to peak at around 10,000 miles of use. The use of synthetic oil, in an engine not originally supplied with it, before the end of the first oil change interval has generally resulted in an extension of the time needed for the engine to achieve peak performance, a direct result of parts not being allowed to wear in properly, the wear then delayed by the slicker synthetic oil.

This process is no different than the initial use and performance of brakes. The surfaces look smooth, but under magnification are not smooth and not matched to each other. Friction results in wear, which creates greater surface area for the parts to press against each other with, which reduces wear. This larger, smoother surface area is the key to a long lasting, non-oil burning engine. Add oil, and this increased surface area in an engine is what you want. Use synthetic oil a this time and you may further reduce friction and wear. Keep oil away, as with brakes, and you have increased frictional contact area which improves braking performance.