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Intelligence Chief Holds Class for Rightards

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by EricGo, Jul 26, 2007.

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  1. Godiva

    Godiva AmeriKan Citizen

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Washington1788 @ Jul 26 2007, 08:32 AM) [snapback]485355[/snapback]</div>
    Name calling:

    Billary
    Hussein Obama

    Demoncrat

    LIBERAL.

    Consider your gander sauced.

    All in favor of replacing Rightard with either Repukelican or NeoNaziCon, say aye.

    Next.
     
  2. Washington1788

    Washington1788 One of the "Deniers"

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(EricGo @ Jul 26 2007, 10:54 AM) [snapback]485450[/snapback]</div>
    Again, I'll try to focus on our common ground. Yes, a intel division was created at the Department of Defense. Yes, thier conclusions were used in addition to other conclusions from the rest of the intel community. And there is no doubt that intel that supported the Administration's case was highlighted as opposed to intel that may have cast doubt upon it -- however, when you're making a case for something you usually highlight the issues that support your case.

    I'm not even going to get into the Plame issue as, that gets us off in a bit of a tangent from the central issue of Iraq.

    As for your "clues," I'll try to be responsive. I'm not sure which entity in Iraq could have put together the infrastructure for nation-wide elections the past 3 times they have been held -- other than the U.S. who could do it? Whether the U.S. can build a sustainable democracy in Iraq is an open question, despite your inclination to dismiss their current stucture and situation. In any nearly any political structure, extremists exist -- even this country, both right and left. These extremist elements hold power because they are organized and committed -- as in the case of elements in Iraq. I think it is safe to say that the average Iraqi simply wants stability and a working government. The question is are they going to have a government and whether they have a say in it or not. The government they have now is elected through elections rather than the CPA, no government, or another Saddam-like government. Is/can that government last?

    As for clue 2 and counting Iraqi civilian deaths, that is true, the U.S. doesn't openly publish civilian deaths. However, how many civilian deaths are you holding the U.S. accountable for? Clearly when the U.S. kills civilians in a fire fight or missile strike, those are on the U.S.'s hands. What about the suicide bomber that kills 120 in a market place attack or anywhere else, are those deaths attributable to the U.S. or the people who would willfully target civilians?

    Finally, clue 3. You're certainly entitled to your opinion about the nature of the WMD argument. I will simply say that it was not an unreasonable argument given the nature of our interaction with Iraq since the Gulf War. I think in nearly every argument that has been made the one constant that has remained is the desire to establish a stable, working, democratic government that has the ability to protect itself. The challenges in reaching that goal have changed, but still exist. I think the only thing the Iraqi people have made clear is that they want the killing to stop and the fighting to end.
     
  3. hyo silver

    hyo silver Awaaaaay

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Washington1788 @ 2007 July 26 6:57 AM) [snapback]485370[/snapback]</div>
    Hey, this isn't called the Flaming Horrors of Putridity for nothing. All the same, discussions of ideas instead of the people who hold them would be most welcome.
     
  4. Washington1788

    Washington1788 One of the "Deniers"

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Godiva @ Jul 26 2007, 11:34 AM) [snapback]485481[/snapback]</div>
    Perhaps if you read the entire thread you will see that I believe ANY name calling whether it be based on nothing or parties should be pulled. The people who engage in that should be called out by anyone on this board and have their comments or thread pulled -- end of story.

    So, again, either this forum has a rule against name calling or it doesn't. If it does, enforce it. If not, then expect the political discussion to decline to the level of 12 year olds -- much as our current political climate is today.
     
  5. FiftyOneMPG

    FiftyOneMPG New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(EricGo @ Jul 26 2007, 11:24 AM) [snapback]485472[/snapback]</div>
    It was a retarded thread, no one is going to stoop to your tard level and argue with you. Seems pretty much everyone is just here making fun of you.... I know I'm haveing a good time with it. :lol: :lol:
     
  6. eagle33199

    eagle33199 Platinum Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Washington1788 @ Jul 26 2007, 11:47 AM) [snapback]485499[/snapback]</div>
    Then we don't. The examples godiva pointed out have been ongoing by several individuals here for ages. As adults, we sometimes have to recognize the childish tactics and ignore them in order to have a civilized discussion. If you want everyone who posts this type of stuff banned, or their posts removed, or whatever, FHOP wouldn't be nearly as entertaining.

    If you don't like it, no one is stopping you from leaving.
     
  7. koa

    koa Active Member

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    Keep it in perspective, it's from some person with nothing better to do (myself included) than posting on an Internet chat forum that's dedicated to a car. And besides, it's not like he's lying/trolling about how little mileage the Prius gets.
     
  8. TonyPSchaefer

    TonyPSchaefer Your Friendly Moderator
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    Yeah, I'm going to put this thread on "hold" for a little while.

    I'll strike up a conversation with the other Mods. We'll talk it over amongst ourselves.

    Also, the first amendment right does not provide for inciting a riot, which online is referred to as "flaming, baiting, and/or trolling."

    In the meantime, I suggest that all the Rightards and the TreeHuggers just calm the heck down. Not only does name calling make you apepar educated, it weakens your position and debating power.
     
  9. Washington1788

    Washington1788 One of the "Deniers"

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(eagle33199 @ Jul 26 2007, 11:55 AM) [snapback]485507[/snapback]</div>
    While I understand your point, I also believe that as adults if a certain behavior is unacceptable to a larger group then that group should not enable that behavior. Maybe its just me, but I don't find people who are disrespectful entertaining.

    Despite your kind suggestion I think I'll just keep doing what I'm doing, raising objections where appropriate, and hopefully it will catch on and we can phase out this stuff.
     
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