Car And Driver Article.

As soon as you buy a Prius - it's time to stop reading the car rags. Otherwise you're be constantly annoyed with the anti-Prius propaganda. Unfortunately, the mags and most of their readers are founded on the belief that there's no such thing as peak oil and if we only drilled off the cost of California - we would have enough oil for a 100 years.

 

Yeah... turn that key counter clockwise and see how long the starter lasts. Then see how long until you start experiencing problems due to excessive wear. LOL

 

Was I the only one who saw this in the article and wondered whether they may have had their thumb on the scale to make sure the Prius got no better mileage than the Metro? From the article:

Does the 2010 not regen while in B, like the Gen 2, or was that something changed? If not, I'm not surprised that they only got 38 mpg.

 

There's already a thread on this at http://priuschat.com/forums/gen-iii-2010-prius-main-forum/62351-car-driver-mag-bad-review.html.

 

Your summary of the article shows another reason why I don't subscribe to Car and Driver nor browse it on the news stands. They don't have anything to interest an engineer.

I prefer autospeed, a car magazine written by Julian Edgar, an engineer, who writes practical articles detailing how systems work. For example, "The Story of Turbo'ing a Hybrid Prius, Part 1" is detailed with plenty of photos and his shared, hands-on, experience:


Julian offers advice on how to get good value from non-traditional sources and he reports engineering data, which means his reports don't lie and I don't have to worry about his ethics. In contrast, Car and Driver is written by clean hands and finger nails and the ethics of thieves who enable others to pick your pocket.

The funny part is you think I'd care what Car and Driver writes. If you'd cited Mad Magazine, it would have had a chance of humor:


Bob Wilson

 

Car and Driver = Playboy of automobile.

They are only concern about the look and the feel you get out of a quick glance.

 

Jalopnik.com did this same article back in March:
Jalopnik - New Prius Vs. Fusion Hybrid Vs. Honda Insight: Which Hybrid Should You Buy? - Best Hybrid
comparing the Prius, Insight, Fusion and a Metro. It was funny, and also came out in support of the 2010 Prius.

 

It was a pretty funny article.
And you know, it is pretty sad that in the c. 20 years since the Geo Metro, no major manufacturer has come out with a car with significantly better gas mileage.
Yeah, they were right to use the Metro as a "control" vehicle.

 

Yeah, damn also those extra safety updates and comfort additions (weight) AND horsepower. Take all those away and shrink the Prius and it could probably compete with the Metro.....

Having spent a lot of my teen years in a Metro hatchback I speak from exerience. Driving up a grade through Yosemite at 1am, 20deg temps, and 22mph because there was not enough horsepower to go any faster or run the heater and my friend wouldn't pull over so I could use the "restroom" because he was afraid we would not be able to get going again if we did.

 

Sure the Metro wasn't supercar.
What's sad is that in 20 years the car industry has just managed to make bigger, somewhat more powerful cars than the Metro with about the same milage as Metro (e.g., Prius); and despite various gas price shocks, claims of peak oil, etc., hasn't actually gotten cars to mass market that do better on gas usage than the 20 year old Metro.

 

You're missing the point. The newer cars are indeed more efficient than the Metro. The Metro just didn't have all the extra weight involved with all the added safety features, size, and comfort.

Strip down the average modern economy vehicle and you will have a car that is more efficient than the Metro.

So saying that nothing today is as efficient as the Metro is untrue, they just packed in a bunch of other stuff that reduces the overall added efficiency. The 1992 Metro had a curb weight of 1650lbs. and put out what, 49HP?

 

I'm going to have to agree w/F8L. Let's take a look at some stats straight from the article of the 2010 Prius vs. 1998 Metro.

98 Metro:
curb weight: 1840 lbs.
length: 149.4 in
width : 62.6 in
height: 54.7 in
interior vol (cu ft.) for front, rear and cargo area: 47, 31, 8

total hp: 55
braking 70 - 0 mph: 210 ft
skidpad grip: 0.75g
0-60 mph time: 15.9 sec
1/4 mile: 20.3 sec. @ 65 mph
rolling 5 - 60 mph: 17.7 sec

2010 Prius:
curb weight: 3180 lbs.
length: 175.6 in
width : 68.7 in
height: 58.7 in
interior vol (cu ft.) for front, rear and cargo area: 52, 42, 22
total hp: 134
braking 70 - 0 mph: 182 ft
skidpad grip: 0.81g
0-60 mph time: 10.0 sec
1/4 mile: 17.6 sec. @ 79 mph
rolling 5 - 60 mph: 10.2 sec

You can see that despite the Prius having 143% more power, weighing 72% more and being much larger and longer, it when driven badly by C&D, managed the same in terms of fuel usage and is much faster. If one could transplant the Prius' powertrain into an 1840 lb. car, I'm sure it'd do much better. (I used to take my cars drag racing and I can tell you that even a 1 second difference in the 1/4 mile is pretty large.)

kgall should take a look at the executive summary at Light-Duty Automotive Technology and Fuel Economy Trends 1975 Through 2008 | US EPA and Minicars? I don't See No Stinking Minicars - Column/Csaba Csere - The Steering Column/C/D Staff/Columns/Features/Car and Driver - Car And Driver.

 

Re: Car And Driver Article.--and 20 years of "Progress" since the Geo Metro

See, you make my point.
Despite
1. Gas price spikes, and slow but steady "permanent" increases in oil prices since the introduction of the Metro, and worries about "peak oil"
2. Vast increase in worry about global warming
3. Improvement in battery and other technology
What Toyota did was build the Prius, a bigger car than the Metro with vast improvements in just about everything . . . except fuel usage.

You're absolutely right that a Toyota Hybrid Synergy drive powertrain in a car closer to the weight of the Metro would lead to much better gas mileage than the Metro. (You could still get a lot of the post 1980's safety and other improvements into such a car.)

What is sad is that none of the car companies, including Toyota, have done it.

Now I'll shut up.
Ma

 

Kgall - the point that others may be trying to make here is that the "progress" made in vehicles extends far beyond mpg's. For that extra 1,300 lbs in the Prius, you get a tremendous amount of features, including improved crashworthiness with airbags and a stronger body/chassis.

 

My only experience with a Metro is when Flanders is driving one with Homer in the car. They are in a big hurry.

Homer: "Drive faster, Flanders!"

Flanders: "I can't! It's a Geo!"

Good times.

 

Its also worth noting that with an auto transmission and using the 2008 EPA mileage calculation, the '98 Metro comes in at a combined 28mpg.

 

The '98s were terrible though. It is the old GEO models that people liked. Once they went to GM they were garbage. I believe the MPG figures were MUCH higher for the older 1992ish models like the hatchback.