2004 Prius Died - HV Battery Failure?

I can't comment on the HV battery issue,, but clearly there would be no harm in charging the 12 volt battery,, or putting a new one in to check things. (I would think it unusual for the Hv battery to fail suddenly. From what I know about batteries is that they generally fail over time, accepting and holding smaller and smaller charges. A single or multiple cell failure is also possible,, but most likely would be a failure in the interconnection between the cells, something most dealers won't touch.

More importantly however, is the fact that the dealer advised you to drive with the read Triangle of death lit. If something was damaged as a result of a ~60 mile drive with the Triangle lit,, I would think the dealer has a large amount of culpability in any repair, regardless of any warranty.

Let the experts chime in, but I wouldn't pay a cent to a dealer in this situation until I had some (good) opinions from here.

Icarus

 

1. Was your car originally purchased, licensed, and operated in California? If so, and it is still licensed in CA, then the hybrid system including the battery benefits from a longer warranty period. In particular the battery is covered for 10 years / 150K miles.

2. I would have guessed that your problem was either the 12V battery failing, or the inverter coolant pump failing, or a combination of those two events.

3. I understand that it is very difficult for dealerships to obtain the traction battery charger, so don't be surprised if this doesn't happen anytime in the near future.

4. Please ask what DTC (diagnostic trouble codes) had been logged by your car, and post.

Good luck, pls keep us posted as to the outcome of your problem.

 

Hi mdooley,

I agree with Patrick. The progressive change in operation as driven implies the coolant pump problem. And in your area, that has lasted longer than many. Supposedly its been revamped since 2006. The problem with the controls operation of the vehicle before the main issues sounds like the 12 V battery. Also have the throttle body cleaned if it has not been done in the past 25 K miles. A sticky throttle body could explain why the hybrid battery was depleted. That would probably give an engine light. When is the last time you had the plugs changed? You do long trips, so they get severe service. And of course how about the engine water pump and belt?

 

Fried the Invertor?

 

I agree with what Patrick mentioned... a funky or failed inverter coolant pump could cause the inverter to overheat. When that happens, systems start shutting off.

OR

The 12v battery has seen it's last day. Both should be relatively inexpensive fixes compared to the HV battery.

 

Oh boy, I sure hope the inverter wasn't fried

We really do have to think up an easy way for folks to keep an eye on their inverter temps. Say keep the parts cost <$50, which could potentially save a +$4,000 inverter

 

I still say the dealer has culpability in this for suggesting the OP drive 60 miles with the warning light on!

Icarus

 

I agree, but one should also realize that if this suggestion was verbal, it quickly turns into a pissing contest of "he said she said"

 

Yes, but pissing contests can be won,, you just need to know how to aim!

Seriously,, I would get my ducks in a row with who said what before I threatened a pissing contest.

Icarus

 

I agree. But if the comment was verbal, I will bet you a bottle of Tanqueray gin that the dealership that told him to keep driving the Prius will claim "we never said that"

I've learned the hard way in my career to get it in writing, to CYA. Or, to at least use a hidden recorder

 

You should REALLY insist they give you the DTCs otherwise it's a lot of speculation/shots in the dark amongst the experts here.

 

I really wish you the best of luck. However in your original post you said: "the check engine light has been on for some time, (it had been intermittently on and off)."

I know life can be busy, and if the light comes on then goes out and the vehicle seems to be working correctly the temptation is to ignore the happening but if the check engine light had been coming on and off prior to this breakdown, that might of been your first and best warning. Living so far from a dealership makes it difficult as well.

Hopefully the problem has actually been resolved, although if all the dealer has done is charge the HV I'd be sceptical as well.

I would ask for the codes, obtaining them really shouldn't be a problem for the dealership and sharing them with you shouldn't be a problem either. After all it's your car. They should be on record now anyway, incase of a future problem.

So if I'm understanding correctly what you are being told is that the codes reflected that your Prius had run out of gas, thus draining the battery to failure, yet you were never out of gas? The obvious follow up line of questioning would be what would cause an erroneous misreading by your car that it is out of gas.

I don't know if I wouldn't pursue a rental car and demand a more thorough investigation. The symptoms you are describing are indicative of a bigger problem and it's purely instinct but I don't see how simply charging the HV and resetting the codes is really "fixing" any problem. It also seems like it's different for you given your rural location. For most people waiting and allowing this problem to reveal itself wouldn't be as problematic, getting rapidly to a dealer if you live in a major city isn't as difficult.

I know I myself am not offering much of an answer here, but I think you are correct to be sceptical concerning the resolution of this problem. Good Luck.

 

Well, if code P3193 (Fuel Run Out) is recorded, there are two causes. Either the fuel ran out, or the ECM is faulty. P3193 will only be recorded if the Fuel Level Low signal was detected by the ECM (Engine ECU) and the car either couldn't start the engine, or detected low engine power - torque produced is under 20% of that which the ECM targetted.

If the car couldn't run the engine, then it will keep driving and on Gen 2, deplete the battery to do so. That eventually leaves the HV battery with a low state of charge and it requires recharging. The root cause is the engine not running.

(On Gen 3 it looks like the car will run on electric-only until down to two bars, then stop, rather than completely deplete the battery.)

Since there was fuel, we can rule that out. The procedure in the service manual goes:

- Check for other DTCs and resolve them
- Check shortage of fuel (checked)
- Check air induction system for leaks or blockages
- Check for unusual engine noise or vibration
- Check fuel pressure
- Inspect mass air flow meter (check it correctly reports the flow of air)
- Inspect engine coolant temperature sensor (different fuel mass is used for different temperature conditions)
- Inspect crankshaft position sensor (to judge injection timing correctly, it has to know where the pistons are in the cylinders)
- Inspect camshaft position sensor (ditto)
- Inspect throttle control motor (ensure throttle blade is moved on demand)
- Inspect throttle position sensor (ensure correct position is reached)
- Replace ECM

If they haven't checked all these things, make them do it.

I'm not quite sure where the fuel level indication is coming from. The ECM isn't directly connected to the fuel tank sensors. It looks like the fuel sender reports the level to the Combination Meter (the great big strip of lights across the dash), that reports it to the Gateway ECU using the BEAN protocol, and that puts the fuel level onto the CAN bus where the ECM can pick it up. Have you noticed problems with the fuel gauge at all?

 

I would get everything in writing and record it if you feel you should. Be up front about it though,

Icarus

 

Good question. Clearly the OP had not run it down since she say's her husband kept the speed down to 50-60 and had the car towed after the ICE died at the top of the off ramp. No way you are doing those speeds on the battery. All the various lights and the inability to turn off things like the radio point to something other than the traction battery being low. And a bad 12V WILL keep the car from starting. No 12V, no computers. I replaced mine last fall (~80K miles?) when the car failed to start one morning and the battery SOC was WAY low and would not charge. BTW, adding water to the 'Do not add water' battery brought it up to the point it would hold a charge. It was a 'catastrophic' failure, in that the car had started fine every time before that. Not sure what happened to it.

And like others, I would suggest you pay more attention to the Check Engine light in the future. While it is fun to hear the Car Talk guys say "And how long has the Check Engine light been on?" and get the "Oh, a few months" response, one really shouldn't ignore it.