1. The site is migrating to a new server this week, so there will likely be some downtime during that process. You can follow along here for updates.

Featured 2 New Toyota Hybrids To Be Revealed May 18

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by Tideland Prius, May 11, 2020.

  1. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2009
    13,449
    4,011
    0
    Location:
    Austin, TX, USA
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    N/A
  2. drash

    drash Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2005
    2,363
    1,174
    0
    Location:
    Upstate NY
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Not sure how I feel about either one, but my question is, “What does it work off? 12V (DC/DC Converter) or the traction battery (Inverter)?” It would seem to be better if they worked off of the traction battery like the A/C and probably are. Like all add-ons the pros are you don’t have to search or go anywhere special for using these items and they don’t take up space, especially when traveling. So pulling into a rest stop you know you have a vacuum cleaner in case you need it and the fridge will save on vending machine costs. The cons are they may not meet your needs all the time. FYI, the Sienna also has an available 1500W AC outlet.


    iPad ? Pro
     
  3. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    44,429
    15,772
    41
    Location:
    Canada
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    The built-in vacuum was first introduced by Honda in the Odyssey Elite trim level. It’s based in the rear drivers side, behind the 3rd row and has a tube long enough reach the front. The bag can be removed and emptied. Looks like Toyota’s one is in the front.

    The cooler is nothing new in luxury cars (I mean full on executive cars like the LS and 7 Series) and there have been a few SUVs that offered it off and on. (I think a Jetta or Passat offered it at one point in the early 2000s)

    To me, that’s a nice feature for a road trip. Beats having to plug in a 12V cooler. (Or just a regular insulated cooler).
     
    austingreen likes this.
  4. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2018
    6,147
    5,934
    1
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    2018 Prius c
    Model:
    Two
    Still surprised neither has onboard laundry.
     
    Trollbait likes this.
  5. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2006
    20,718
    10,676
    0
    Location:
    eastern Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    The TNGA K is only new the Sienna. It is the platform under the Camry, Avalon, Rav4, Highlander, and even the Venza.
    Toyota New Global Architecture - Wikipedia

    Dig through my old posts, and you'll likely finding me calling for Toyota to have made the Camry hybrid only at some time. Minivans are a niche segment at this point. There is just three, plus one, companies in the US still selling them. Toyota, Honda, and FCA jockey for first, second, and third in sales, with the Kia Sedonna getting fourth. Considering that, and who most minivan buyers are, going all hybrid with the Sienna is less risk.

    Electrification lets fossil fuel burning only hybrids be counted with plug ins.

    Hybridization can reduce consumption of those fuels, and Toyota has done a good job of doing so, but not all hybrids are created equal. The Ram 1500 is a hybrid, and thus can be called electrified.

    Could there be differences in the packs usable capacity that lead to the different hp ratings?

    Seems the Venza will be between the Rav4 and Highlander in size.

    Here is an articel from last month calling for the Harrier to come to the US.
    Toyota Harrier Mid-Size SUV Could Be a Perfect Fit for America

    Gimmicks. Yes, they can be useful, like factory Nav, but like factory Nav, you'll pay more for the ones built into the car than for your own separate unit.
     
  6. The Electric Me

    The Electric Me Go Speed Go!

    Joined:
    May 22, 2009
    9,083
    5,792
    0
    Location:
    Undisclosed Location
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    I don't think I suggest otherwise.
     
  7. The Electric Me

    The Electric Me Go Speed Go!

    Joined:
    May 22, 2009
    9,083
    5,792
    0
    Location:
    Undisclosed Location
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    That was my feeling as well.
    Maybe if I actually go see a Venza in person, I'll just be more impressed with it.
    But the reveal was less impressive to me. When you spend a big chunk of your presentation talking about a self tinting panoramic moon roof, something that is "neat" -but could exist in any vehicle, it's just not as exciting.

    There is no reason I'd ever be in the market for a Sienna. I never have reason to need that much passenger space. BUT...comparatively it was IMO the more groundbreaking hybrid, and the more exciting product.

    The Venza, was like, here is this really good looking hybrid CUV. It might be the product I would own, but I'd have to get excited about it after the fact.
    Which I suppose might happen. Sometimes you have to see these offerings in person, and actually sit in them to connect. But the first impression was far more underwhelming.
     
  8. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2006
    20,718
    10,676
    0
    Location:
    eastern Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    333
    You did suggest that it was a hybrid platform.;)

    Most of the hybrid components are mounted to the transmission. So they are just going into the space in the engine bay. There is already plenty of space for them there. Which just leaves dealing with the battery. The battery for a hybrid really isn't that big; specially when Li-ion is used. So finding space for it shouldn't be too difficult.

    TNGA gave more thought to supply that space with the battery going under the rear seat, but that really didn't need a new platform as the Prius c had its battery under the rear seat without TNGA. So does the Accord hybrid, and it uses a stretched version of Civic platform from 2015. Then the Sienna will have the battery under the front seat. Which kind of counters saying TNGA is a hybrid platform because it has space for the battery under the rear seat.

    What makes up a car platform doesn't need to be made different for a hybrid from an ICE; there is little difference in the cars' needs to be met there. What does have to happen, is that the car design incorporates being a hybrid from the beginning. That is what 'designed to be a hybrid' is referring too, not having a hybrid specific platform.

    The gen2 Prius was designed to be hybrid. Yes, if a non-hybrid Prius had be made, it would have more space in the cargo area. But if Toyota took the Matrix, and made it into a hybrid at the time, it would not be as well packaged as the Prius.
     
  9. telmo744

    telmo744 HSD fanatic

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2010
    2,165
    763
    0
    Location:
    Portugal
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    The hybrid sales went up noticeably, also because of the gasoline prices, consistently high.
    Many consumers algo got away from diesels because of the DPF and EGR known deterioration, leaving it to the commercial/professional users. Adblue consumption also a valid issue.
     
  10. Prius Pete

    Prius Pete Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    183
    178
    2
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Yes hybrid sales went up after the diesel fraud was exposed in 2015. The fraud itself, the lie that diesel emissions were at safe levels, began in 2009 or earlier. If it had not been for that lie, many Europeans might have been buying Toyota hybrids instead of VW diesels. The popularity of diesels in Europe showed that many people were willing to pay a bit more for a car that was good on fuel and good for the environment (they thought). They could have been hybrid customers but they were tricked into buying diesels instead.
     
    Fred_H, Randi and telmo744 like this.
  11. telmo744

    telmo744 HSD fanatic

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2010
    2,165
    763
    0
    Location:
    Portugal
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    And many Toyota hybrid good ownership testimonies, lots of reliability stats, consumption trends, good used value on trade...
    A better product still has a room for success with competition, it didn't actually need the dropping in the diesel confidence...

    Someone has already addressed that in this thread: hybrids need a good sale network (and "salesmen"), and the move to a hybrid-only is also very effective in giving the product a true Toyota-belief and commitment.
     
    Trollbait and Prius Pete like this.
  12. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2015
    10,863
    8,769
    0
    Location:
    New England
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    No price on 2021 Sienna yet? Looking from the 2020 price range, it will be higher than RAV4 Hybrid. Hummm, I'm no longer interested in plain hybrid cars, and I don't need to replace our Pathfinder Hybrid for a while. By the time we need to replace it, Toyota may have Sienna PRIME. I hope.
     
    #92 Salamander_King, May 19, 2020
    Last edited: May 19, 2020
    ttou68 likes this.
  13. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2018
    6,147
    5,934
    1
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    2018 Prius c
    Model:
    Two
    This is where vans are just different from every other car shape out there.

    These days everyone wants a "muffin tin" floor pan for minivans, so the seats can be folded down into wells to give a flat cargo floor without the hassle of the seat removal and the common risk of damage/loss while out of the vehicle.

    Meanwhile Americans got bigger, so relatively few were taking advantage of the pass-through between the front seats to get into the middle of their vans. So sacrificing that space to a big center console and a battery pack is fairly natural way to solve the problem.

    Heck, Toyota used to put the entire powertrain there between the front seats in their classic vans.

    While I don't have any personal need for a minivan right now, I'm really impressed by what Toyota has come up with here. That really looks like a lot of comfort and utility, with enough power and tow capacity to really matter.

    That size, efficiency, and a Prius-style powerplant is going to make these things stars of the hashtag-vanlife set.
     
    telmo744 and ttou68 like this.
  14. ttou68

    ttou68 Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2017
    334
    195
    0
    Location:
    40509
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    III
    TNGA is a platform Toyota now using for all Toyota vehicles, it enable Toyota the flexibility to produce any vehicle at any of it's plants worldwide by adding length and/or width to particular vehicle's main body..
    e.g. Avalon is 47mm longer then Camry..

    The only separation between an Hybrid or ICE, is the use of flooring... Hybrid vehicles has battery tray at the location designed for particular vehicle need, and it doesn't always have to be under rear seat...
    Vehicle horsepower can also increase by using larger electric motor...


    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
    #94 ttou68, May 19, 2020
    Last edited: May 19, 2020
    Tideland Prius and john1701a like this.
  15. Ronald Doles

    Ronald Doles Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2019
    230
    280
    0
    Location:
    Columbus, OH
    Vehicle:
    2015 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    Two
    I like the Sienna hybrid concept but I wouldn't consider buying the first model year. I would consider one after they have been produced for about three years as a replacement for our 08 Odyssey. We live in Ohio and drive the Odyssey to Florida each winter. The Odyssey is loaded with supplies and our two dogs for the trip down. It is our daily driver for the 5 months that we are in Florida each year. It has been very comfortable touring vehicle and trouble free for 125k miles.

    The Odyssey gets about 18 mph in town and 25 on the road. Based on the mileage specs, for that 1200 mile trip it would consume about 15 gallons less fuel. It may also save 15 gallons a month as our daily driver. How much a hybrid Sienna would cost to save that much gasoline would be a factor but we will eventually have to replace the Odyssey with something.

    We have had the PriusV for over a year. The PriusV is our first Toyota, our first hybrid and is our Ohio daily driver for the summer months. We have enjoyed owning it and it has been trouble free. We knew nothing about Toyota's or Prius specifically before I found this website but we lucked out by buying a 2015 as it has improvements that were problems for some earlier Gen3's.

    Who knows where gasoline prices will go but I can't see a huge increase in the next decade which will be a headwind for hybrids.
     
  16. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2015
    10,863
    8,769
    0
    Location:
    New England
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Yeah, with everything being equal, if the hybrid cost more than ICE version, it will a hard sell. Being a long time minivan owner who just bought used 2014 Pathfinder Hybrid SUV to replace our 2005 Sienna minivan, we do miss not having a flat floor to haul 8x4 plywood sheets. At the time when I was looking, Pacifica Plug-in was the only minivan with a battery power. I said no to Chrysler after owing Grand Caravan that lasted only 80K miles. Will see what evolves of Sienna and hope it will be replaced with Sienna PRIME in 5 years.
     
    wjtracy likes this.
  17. Georgina Rudkus

    Georgina Rudkus Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2018
    2,937
    2,066
    0
    Location:
    Taylors, SC
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    Two
    All my phones are prepaid cell phones. They can't charge anything to them.
     
  18. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2006
    20,718
    10,676
    0
    Location:
    eastern Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    There was a wider selection of diesels to choose from. Toyota's hybrid sales growth in Europe didn't just coincide with the exposure of diesel cheating. It also happened at a time when Toyota greatly increased the number of hybrid models; Europe has more hybrid choice than the US. Their choices more than doubled in a short time.

    Before, there was the Yaris, Auris, Prius, and Prius+. Aide from the +, European's choice was a hatchback of a different size. The prius models also suffered under a high price tag due to tariffs. The Auris has been replaced with the Corolla, and they can choose sedan, hatch, or wagon in hybrid flavor. Then the Camry, Rav4, and C-HR were added to the hybrid line up. The Lexus brand saw a similar growth in hybrid options.
     
  19. Prius Pete

    Prius Pete Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    183
    178
    2
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Toyota has even more hybrids available in Japan, including six different minivans. If European sales of hybrids had been better in the 2008-2015 timeframe, they could have increased the available models then. But no, thanks to the diesel fraud.
     
  20. farmecologist

    farmecologist Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2015
    1,941
    1,779
    0
    Location:
    Southern MN
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    II

    We had a Mazda MPV for many years ( 2004 model )....we LOVED it. It was a perfect vehicle for a family of 4. Plus, I could haul stuff in it ( within reason, of course ). And I did....We didn't ( and still don't ) have a pickup truck so the MPV took the place of that. Unfortunately, Mazda's anti rust efforts were terrible so the body eventually went to hell. We replaced it with our 2012 Prius v wagon ( see link in my signature ). The Prius v is ok....but just doesn't have the hauling capacity the MPV had.

    This Sienna looks really interesting...although I never thought I'd ever consider another minivan. And I dare say the Sienna looks good? Did I just say that?! (y) Also, minivans are just super practical...and I'm a practical kind of guy. :whistle: The 33 MPG estimate is a bit disappointing though. I hope Toyota releases a plugin model to compete with the Chrysler Pacifica.
     
Loading...