2010 Prius 92g/km and low emissions 89g/km version!

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Where's the optimistic stretch? g/km and mpg are almost exactly inversely correlated - the figures are produced by the same combined test cycle.

So if those CO2 figures were correct, it would be 11-14% more efficient on the European test cycle.

Is there any reason to suppose the EPA test cycle would show a smaller improvement?

 

I'd say it is a very reasonable calculation. CO2 emission is directly proportional to fuel burned, as it is a direct result of the carbon content of the fuel. The EPA uses a factor of 8788g/gallon for gasoline, or 10084g/gallon for diesel. The only thing you have to be careful of is making sure you are flipped around the right way. 89g/km would be a 14.4% reduction in CO2 output. That would equate to a 14.4% reduction in fuel consumed. 92g/km would be a 11.5% reduction.

46mpg combined = 2.17g/100mi - 14.4% = 1.86g/100 mi -> 53.8mpg combined
46mpg combined = 2.17g/100mi - 11.5% = 1.92g/100 mi -> 52.1mpg combined

drees, good find! Toyota has been saying 10-15% improvement for the '10, but I think this is the first indication we've seen that it may be true.

catgic, do you have any info/data to back up your guestimate?

Rob

 

RE Solar, I agree mostly. The roof of the Prius has been estimated to hold a little over 200W of PV. Depending where you are in the country, that will generate between 750 and 900Wh per day. Thats enough to drive the Prius about 2-3.5 miles on EV. By comparison the current capacity of the Prius battery from full bars to no bars is ~500-600Wh. If the new Prius battery has enough capacity to store this energy, and an algorithm to make sure it can usually have room for it, then it will make some difference. For a typical 41 mile a day kind of driver, 3 miles EV would reduce fuel consumption by 7%, so the additional 4% above certainly seems feasible. At the current EPA estimated annual fuel cost of $1211, 7% would be $85/year. If the solar option costs more than ~$850 it won't break even. Thats probably in the ballpark, as the retail cost of solar panels is in the $4-6/watt range. On the other hand many people would probably pay a little more to reduce their CO2 output or oil consumption even if it didn't break even in a purely financial argument.

Rob

 

Toyota have been working on cutting the cost of hybrid parts for the next gen like the Honda. What if Toyota price the next gen Prius the same as the Insight II? The MSRP for the Insight I and the Classic Prius were the same $19,995. So... why not? This is where the similarity ends...

It is contrasting to see how IMA is stuck at 1.3L and remain at the same fuel efficiency performance level. In the meantime, HSD is becoming more powerful, more efficient, cleaner and cheaper. If the next gen Prius were to grow in size, 0-60 in 9 seconds, get 15% better MPG, and cost less.... this will make the Insight II just a repackage of IMA to cash in on a quick buck of the Prius supply shortage.

 

I think thats the $24,000 question. The Insight could be a winning strategy if the price differentiation is significant. Otherwise its HCH vs. Prius all over again. Smaller, slower, and slightly less efficient for a little less money has not been a winner for the HCH.

 

there is no way Prius will cost as little as Insight - it is bigger everything... If they ever create Yaris version of Prius, it might end up similar in pricing...

Considering that Toyota built up battery plants to build 1,000,000 hybrids in 2010 alone, i am pretty sure that more hybrid models are coming... Prius is going to take up only half of that, and currently Prius is >80% of their 500,000 per year output... that means 100,000 "other" hybrids are produced right now per year. In 2010, that number for "other" hybrids will go up to 500,000 per year, which means significant new model introductions, not just new and expensive RXh.

No wonder there are roumors of additional, larger, dedicated Toyota Hybrid and 2 dedicated Lexus hybrids, as well as iQ, etc, etc... Come 2010, Toyota will have a LOT of hybrids to sell.

 

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FYI,
Toyota also plans to introduce Auris Hybrid in 2010.
Green Car Congress: Report: Toyota To Debut Hybrid Model Of Auris In Europe

Ken@Japan

 

Hmm if they are pumping that many hybrids out we better unload our Gen 2s before then. If supply goes up that much price will have to come down. Unless we are at $6 gas.

 

catgic: You wrote the following:

Corolla 1.8L I4 AT, curb weight 2595 lbs: EPA 35 MPG “Highway.”
Yaris 1.5L I4 AT, curb weight 2335 lbs: EPA 35 MPG “Highway.”

So what you are saying above is that a lighter car with a smaller displacement engine gets the same mileage as a heavier car with a more powerful engine. That means the more powerful engine is more efficient. If you reduce the corolla weight by 260 lbs to make it equal to the weight of the yaris (all else being equal), the hwy mileage should increase by roughly the same amount to ~38 mpg.

 

Source

 

Further to your point the new family of engines going into all Toyota's is the 'R' family. Across the board, in every vehicle, they are far more powerful and noticably more fuel efficient at the same time.

The 4.0L 1GR and the 3.5L 2GR engines are class leading.
The 5.7L 3UR is simply the best V8 in the segment.
The new 1.8L 2ZR in the Corolla is far better than any other such engine in the class.
The 2AR 2.5L engine is just now going into the RAV and soon into the Camry.
The 1AR 2.7L will be in the Venza and the Highlander at the end of the year.

Expect the new Prius to be both more powerful and more fuel efficient. The 10-15% increase is very very realistic. I'd bet on it rather than against it.

 

the new prius will have a normal and extra low c02 version
info straight from paris auto show

one 92 gr per km
and one 89 gram per Km

on this model the new lexus prius wil be based on the market 2010

 

If they can get emissions down below 100gm/Km, that'll mean no (ie, zero, none, null, nada, zilch, zip &c) UK Road Fund to pay. Yay.

Of course, the saving will only be GBP15/year over what *.gov.uk charges now for 104gm/Km -- but the bragging and snook-cocking rights around soot-belching SUVs may well prove priceless.