A Christian view of the trappings of Christmas

Adopting symbols of an older established religion is nothing new.

The Romans did it whever they conquered a nation. Instead of changing and upsetting everything, they just added a bit and adopted a bit. The Caesars becoming "gods" was adopted from the Egyptians. They also started painting coffins with faces on them.

Santoria mixes christian saints and pagan gods. In Guatemala they've mixed old and new worship with the use of alcohol and tobacco.

You could probably justify any symbolism with some passage from the bible. (It doesn't make a Maypole any less phallic.)

I really don't care. I like trees. I like lights. I like candles. I like all of the songs. I like presents. I like cookies that are only made once a year.

You neglected to mention that Jesus probably wasn't born anywhere near Dec. 25th. The date was chosen to usurp the established pagan celebrations.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Schmika @ Dec 16 2006, 09:50 AM) [snapback]363130[/snapback]</div>

I have long advocated (and have posted the suggestion on PC) that people can avoid the shopping hell, and avoid giving and receiving gifts that the recepient never wants anyway, by making gift contributions to your favorite charity instead. Theyll send a card to eveyone on your list (as long as the donation is large enough) telling them that a contribution was made in their name. Never the wrong size, never sits unused in the closet, and you don't need to leave the house, except perhaps to mail the check.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Dec 16 2006, 04:22 PM) [snapback]363201[/snapback]</div>

Yes! Like all of those marathons that benefit a charity.

My friend ran one recently; the money spent on new running shoes, a singlet, a weekend stay in a nice hotel near the starting line, her masseuse, etc. (not to mention all the other corporate freebies like oxygen bars and things of that nature along the run) far eclipsed what the charity received...wouldn't it make more sense to eschew the celebration entirely and simply give to those who need it most...?

As it is, it seemed like the event was a tacit admission that people with money won't give unless they feel like they're "getting something."

So, basically, it seems to me that Christmas is first and foremost to perpetuate Christianity; giving back to those who really need it is kind of like this nice, guilt-relieving afterthought.

How many rich shoppers I see in Union Square...and not many are giving to the homeless. Perhaps it's because their arms are fillled with all the presents they've bought for their loved ones, and they simply don't have a free hand to reach their wallets? And all of it in the name of Christmas, whatever that really means.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinto Girl @ Dec 21 2006, 02:57 PM) [snapback]365412[/snapback]</div>

Most homeless advocates will tell you not to give money to beggars. You are much better off giving to a homeless shelter or organization that works to rehab people (like the Salvation Army). Its not as rewarding because you don't get the instant gratification of seeing the person smile, but your money does far more good when it is targeted toward those that are most susceptible to help.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(fshagan @ Dec 21 2006, 09:41 PM) [snapback]365559[/snapback]</div>

Makes a lot of sense. Maybe instead of handing the beggar money, hand him a card to a shelter/rehab in the area. Unfortunately I think a lot of homeless choose to be that way. Being homeless frees them from the slavery the rest of us have to deal with.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(fshagan @ Dec 21 2006, 09:41 PM) [snapback]365559[/snapback]</div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(F8L @ Dec 21 2006, 11:44 PM) [snapback]365582[/snapback]</div>

There is implicit in this the assumption that the homeless person is homeless because he or she is lazy, or shiftless, or good-for-nothing. That is a very un-Christian attitude, since Jesus said not to judge other people. He also said to give money to the poor. But of course Christians reject virtually everything Jesus taught, in favor of Paul, who said that you could safely ignore all of Jesus' teachings, if you merely believed he was god.

I give to organizations that help the homeless (including the Salvation Army, which is an excellent organization), but I also give to the homeless people I encounter, and to other needy people who I happen to know of. To refuse to give anything to a person who asks is both stingy and un-Christian.

And BTW I have heard some people advocate the view that Fshagan expresses, but only very rarely within the homeless-advocacy community, where I did volunteer work during about 5 years. Usually it's managers of very big shelters, and conservative city politicians who hold that line. The former because they want your donations, and the latter because they view panhandlers as a plague. Panhandlers make people uncomfortable because they show that this most wealthy nation on Earth cannot even provide shelter for its people.

Based on my own experience in homeless work, I disagree with Fshagan's assertion that "most" homeless advocates oppose giving money to beggars.

 

I personally know a few homeless people; I like them. However, I also know if I were to given them money directly, I might as well be giving money directly to the corner liquor store and eliminate the middleman.

I know when I donate to the shelters and food kitchens (which I do), I am definitely giving them food and a place to sleep, something their beer and smokes don't provide.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Dec 22 2006, 06:04 AM) [snapback]365618[/snapback]</div>

Well, I don't have any studies to back up my assertion, so you could be right. But the ones I have dealt with are pretty strong in their sentiment that giving money to the folks pan-handling defeats the incentive they would have to enter a program and seek help. I know our local Salvation Army says its best to give them the card with the shelter info on it because at least when the person enters a shelter, they can also get help for needs they may not know they have.

BTW - is there a value-neutral phrase I can use instead of "beggar" or "pan handler"? They both seem judgmental, and I don't mean them that way. The vast majority of the homeless do not ask for money, so I do need to differentiate between the homeless and the ones asking for money.

BTW - do you believe people should be forced to live in shelters if they cannot afford a home? Or should they be allowed to be homeless if they so desire? Your statement that we cannot "provide shelter" seems to indicate you might advocate a compulsory housing system? Or am I reading that wrong (no offense intended).

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(fshagan @ Dec 23 2006, 12:35 AM) [snapback]365954[/snapback]</div>

It is natural for the managers of large shelters to want people to give them money, and they may see money given to panhandlers as taking away from their own revenues. In recent years many charities have turned to high-powered fund-raising which is expensive: If effective it gets more money for the charity using it, while reducing the total amount of money spent on the core issues collectively. (The Salvation Army does not do this, but it is a trend showing how desperate charities have become, and explaining why some homeless workers may be upset about money given to panhandlers.)

But if you are a Christian, remember that Jesus didn't say give to institutions that help the poor: he said to give to the poor.

I use the term panhandler for someone who asks for money. Since the guys I mostly worked with did not beg for money, I don't know if there is a more value-neutral term.

Definitions given to me by a homeless rail-rider:

Hobo: A person who travels and works.
Tramp: A person who travels but does not work. (My informant also liked to say that tramp stood for "Train-Riding American Moving Person," but I figure that was tongue-in-cheek, since some tramps hitchhike, and a Russian or a German could be a tramp. Trivia: Tramps who ride the rails seldom hitchhike, and tramps who hitchhike seldom ride the rails.)
Bum: A person who does not travel and does not work. The legendary Catholic Worker Ammon Hennesy, refered affectionately to the men in his shelter as "my bums." The word need not be disparraging, but in common usage it generally is.

People are homeless for a variety of reasons, and homeless shelters are far from equal. Many of the homeless are mentally ill and cannot get along with other people. Alcoholics and mentally ill can be like cats and dogs: the latter say things that make no sense, and the former take personal offense at the meaningless utterances. Some homeless shelters are nasty places that for many people are worse than the street. A very few people (and I have known some of these) are homeless by choice. These generally have good camping equipment and strong backs to carry it. But people who refuse to go to a shelter are usually either mentally ill, or do not get along in the overcrowded conditions, or reject the health and social conditions of their local shelter.

What to do about the mentally ill, I do not know. For many of these people, no kind of program will help. They simply need to be taken care of. I suspect that if their local shelter were clean, humane, and structured in such a manner as to be friendly to them, relatively few would refuse to live there. There is no love in some of the big government-run shelters. You can't expect a person who is mentally ill, and alone in the world, and perhaps delusional, to voluntarily enter a place that is hostile to him. Perhaps schitzophrenics should be institutionalized against their will if necessary.

But a lot of people are homeless because they just don't have enough money for an apartment. Rents are high if you are working for minimum wage. And there are a lot of people who work full-time and are homeless. The minimum wage is a national shame. It has lost ground to inflation for many years. These people simply need a job that pays enough to live on.

Shelters that are clean and safe will always be full. If your shelter is a good one you do not need to do anything to get people into it but open the doors. You need sympathetic staff and adequate space. Overcrowding will always drive people away.

We cannot know what it is like to walk in another person's shoes, and so I don't judge a person who asks for money. How much I give may depend on my mood and on how much I have on me. When I was poor it depended also on my budget. And it may depend on how many panhandlers there are where I happen to be. In Mexico as I walked through downtown Queretaro it was common to pass 5 or 10 beggars sitting quietly on the street. I did not have a lot of money at that time so I often gave only 5 pesos to each (50 cents). I had to make a point to have enough coins, and sometimes I didn't have enough coins. And when I ran out I stopped giving. But I never tried to judge whether they were "worthy" or whether they would make good use of the money.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Schmika @ Dec 16 2006, 01:50 PM) [snapback]363130[/snapback]</div>

So Pagans are the reason for the season!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Dec 22 2006, 11:04 AM) [snapback]365618[/snapback]</div>

daniel, I need 30K.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(PA @ Dec 26 2006, 09:49 AM) [snapback]366660[/snapback]</div>

More like astronomical phenomena are the reasons for the seasons. In ancient times the solstices and equinoxes marked times of harvest or storage and it was a matter of life or death to keep track of them. This is why ancient civilizations sorted out their astronomy before mostly anything else. Most civilizations have celebrations around these dates.

The christian (and decidedly less interesting) aspect of christmas is very recent. 1800's to be precise.

I personally find the understanding of astronomical phenomena more profound than anything made up religions can throw at us.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mystery Squid @ Dec 26 2006, 05:56 AM) [snapback]366663[/snapback]</div>

Here you go, Squid. Now you're well on your way. Only $29,999 to go.

[attachmentid=6013]

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Alric @ Dec 26 2006, 09:08 AM) [snapback]366672[/snapback]</div>

You need one of these T-shirts.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Stev0 @ Dec 26 2006, 12:07 PM) [snapback]366698[/snapback]</div>

Good one! I like this one, although not necessarily related to christhmas.

From http://www.xkcd.com

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mystery Squid @ Dec, 05:56 AM) [snapback]366663[/snapback]</div>

I got it covered Daniel...

Here you go Squid!

KKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Alric @ Dec 26 2006, 10:08 AM) [snapback]366672[/snapback]</div>

Yeah, but you can't fit that on a bumper sticker, and besides, it's got way too many syllables.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(PA @ Dec 26 2006, 10:56 AM) [snapback]366775[/snapback]</div>

We can start a new "Create a Bumper Sticker" thread. How about:

"The Tilt is the Reason for the Season."

A Christmas Memory:

Lots of years ago I belonged to an amateur radio club. Five of us who ran the show were sitting around one night and trying to think up something fun to do for Christmas. Somebody mentioned this fellow who was so poor he didn't even have a radio. He got his license many years before and just liked to talk about the hobby with the rest of the guys.

His job was cleaning out bathrooms at county facilities. He was a little bit dim-witted and his wife suffered from massive overweight and diabetes. His speach was slurred and he walked with a limp from some old disease. His hobby was repairing crutches for the handicapped of his church. His last name started with a "Z" and you knew he was the last guy in every line he had ever been in.

The plan formed. Each of us, and our wives, went out and got a bunch of stuff. One guy bought a ton of food. Another went down to the pottery shack and picked up a set of dishes and stainless. Another bought a load of clothing with price tags and labels, making them returnable if necessary. I forget what the other two did but you get the picture.

One night when we knew he wasn't home, we filled up a van with the booty and drove to his little dump of a house and we easily broke in. (One of us was a police Captain!) Quickly, the five of us unloaded and took off.

A few days later he showed up at the ham radio store one of us owned. Wearing one of the shirts he had just got, he told us in a voice full of wonder how his church had come by and given him this mountain of food and things like he'd never seen before. He went on to explain to us that, in their modesty and humility, the clergy wouldn't admit to having done this, but HE knew. We congratulated him on his good fortune and spoke well of his church in being so kind. The store owner gave him a simple radio and we installed it in his wreak of a car for him so he could talk to us now and then between cleaning jobs.

The next year, after about the same number of drinks, we decided to do it again just to prove that lightning can strike the same place twice. We filled up the van once more with other surprises: bedding, rugs, who can remember now? On delivery night we found that we had miscalculated and he was home, the lights were on. Undaunted, we silently carried the stash up to the front door. Everybody got back in the van, pointing outbound with the engine running, except me. Because of my proven marathon capabilities I was selected to sound the alarm. I rang the front door bell and ran like hell, piling into the back of the truck as we blasted off.

The last thing I heard was a voice in my six o'clock position shouting, "Honey, they did it again!"

Not long after, he got a better job as a helper at a local hardware store, sort of a pre Wal-Mart greeter. You'd have thought he was the CEO, so proud he looked. The two of them are dead now. The five of us guys have long drifted apart. For what it's worth, one was Mormon and the other four of us pretty well defined atheism for that time. I've never been involved in such nice Christmases again.

I miss those days.......

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Alnilam @ Dec 26 2006, 04:01 PM) [snapback]366792[/snapback]</div>

Thanks for that story!