ABG: Poll: 74 % of U.S. voters support 60 mpg fleetwide average by 2025

perfect time to raise the gas tax.

 

I'm not sure where you get the CAFE adjustments, when I read 60 mpg I was thinking EPA numbers on the sales sticker. And the only way people would agree to such a dramatic improvement would be the idea that 2025 sounds like it's a long way off, and the future should have dramatically better vehicles, maybe with Mr. Fusion as an upgrade option.

If you say 60 mpg in less than 15 years, with the understanding that a car design cycle is about half that time, then it becomes a different situation.

As you say, the Prius and a select group of other cars are close to that now, but it's certainly not a fleet average. Not when you count minivans, sports cars, and a necessary number of pickup trucks/SUVs for people who actually need them (which is about a 10th of the number currently out there).

 

The question asked is basically "do you want other people to drive high MPG cars?"

That's the reason for the disconnect, imo.

 

I found this line interesting:

If that's the case, then why the heck does Ford mark up their hybrids more than any other manufacturer, compared to similar models?
You can get a Ford Fusion base model for $19.4K, the hybrid is $28.8K, the Ford Escape is very similar. I know I'm not comparing apples to apples, because they add features in as standard on the hybrids, so I shouldn't use the base model, but that's my point really, offer a base version of the hybrid to see what people really want.

(For Toyota, the Camry isn't much better, but the spread is a few thousand less, and if you don't like it, you can still get the Prius at $3K over the base price of a Camry, which a lot of people do do, but can't do that at Ford, the Fusion is their cheapest hybrid. Honda Civic jumps from $15.8K from the base ($16.6K with automatic) to $23.9K for the hybrid, also quite substantial, but again they have the Insight at $19.8K).

 

Yep ... YOU drive it ... that way WE can keep our land barge. Actually, the 60mpg equivalent is already in production vis a vis the Tesla, and the Leaf is righ behind it. When you do the math / conversion of an EV's 'fuel' consumption easily works out to over 60mpg. Oh, I forgot ... no one want 'em.

.

 

Good point. They probably weren't given an option either on how much to raise it. Just yes or no, should it be raised (to 60 mpg).

 

The Cafe ratings have a far different and higher number than the epa. It would be nice if these things were better linked to reality. If a car is flex fuel it gets the score from the cleanest fuel usually E85. 60 mpg is a crazy number if it was epa and closed loopholes.

5 years is a typical design cycle now. 15 years means 3 cycles. Car makers are already planning for the 2016 standards so it would be better to think in terms of 2 cycles to raise it up from 2016.

The 60mpg would include sports cars but not trucks/SUVs that would have a different number probably based on footprint. The 8500lb loophole should be fully closed by 2025

Part of the hybrid premium is being forced to have a certain equipment level. Ford actually has a lower hybrid premium than most cars other than the prius/insight if you use terms like premium percentage based on efficiency improvements.

These are different animals. Ford will have a hybrid/phev/bev focus to compete in the hatchback mode with the likes of the prius and insight. These things take time.

 

It's to be taken as seriously as a New Year's Resolution question.