After Fire Engineer's EBH install - results.

Today was the first time for us to try out the EBH that wayne installed at the Hybridfest. ( made up a temporary timer and outlet) in case I need to move it.

Had driven a total of 15 min. and the first 5 min. bar was 60+ mpg along with the other two 5 min. bars following.

The drive was approx 8 miles round trip

So I am pleased with that.

here is my temp. timer , made it up that way incase I want to change locations, and the line side of the timer is pluged into a GFCI receptacle. plus it is under a carport out of the weather. in case someone see's the handy box with a reg. outlet. there is a gfci protecting it.
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How long did you let the EBH run? And what was the average outside temp? I tried searching but I could not get any interesting results (maybe I used lousy search terms). If anybody has a spreadsheet showing the relation between avg temp and the optimal EBH run time, please do post it. I would really appreciate it.
Thanks a bunch in advance,

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priussoris @ Aug 27 2007, 11:17 AM) [snapback]502735[/snapback]</div>

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priussoris @ Aug 27 2007, 09:17 AM) [snapback]502735[/snapback]</div>

Depending on how "temporary" your setup is, if you will be looking for a more finished look, consider the Intermatic ST01C . . .

http://www.intermatic.com/Default.asp?acti...=43&sid=112
. . . in a three gang box with one timed and one un-timed set of outlets.

Four nice ST01C features which would be helpful for your application:
1) Battery backup for the timer.
2) Automatic Daylight Savings Time adjustment.
3) Weekdays and Weekends can be separately programmed.
4) The face plate is an on/off switch for when you want to turn in on or off manually - say on a weekend or day off from work.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(rat @ Aug 27 2007, 10:39 PM) [snapback]503043[/snapback]</div>

I set mine for 3 hours also 4:30 - 7:30
outside temp was 72 degrees the first morning of use.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TonyPSchaefer @ Aug 28 2007, 08:42 AM) [snapback]503175[/snapback]</div>

 

Used my EBH for the first time this morning and did not really notice any difference. My garage does not get below 75 this time of year, but I'm wondering if the new timer I bought is bad. From experience, I've found that around 50% of digital timers don't work. Tonight I'm putting a night light on a second port on the extension cord so I can see if it's getting AC. My mpg has been going down for the past month, even though I've put 5 more psi in the tires (40/38). I've attributed that to school starting and having twice the traffic and seldom can pulse and glide now. I'm barely getting 54 now!

Arrgh! I'm getting into this mpg fixation so many others here have!! The highest I've gotten is 57, so I've dropped 3 whole mpg!!! Still, I would have expected some increase from higher TP.

 

Since Wayne installed my EBH I went from a first 5 min bar of 25-35mpg to 50-55mpg. After 3-3.5hrs of heating up I enter my car with a coolant temp of 155-165 degrees and exit my garage in S4. I am extremely happy with the results.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(treehggr @ Aug 28 2007, 03:32 PM) [snapback]503358[/snapback]</div>

Has anyone done any ball park estimating of the overall $$ savings considering the gas savings and the cost of the electricity to run the heater?

 

Yes but you'd have to search for the thread as I can't think of it off the top of my head. I think it was talked about in the main EBH thread a while back if I'm not mistaken.

 

<div align="left">I have not noticed a huge difference in two days using the Wayne installed EBH, but I am not worried. There are so many variables, it it too early to be concerned. I think I might be on a bad tank of gas. I did notice my water temp at start up has been 130 deg C each morning.

Analsys of Cost Savings, useing round numbers so I don't hurt my brain too much:
Assumptions:
Comute = 50 miles per day, 250 days per year
MPH without EBH = 45 MPG
MPH with EBH = 50 MPG.
Gas costs $3 per gallon
EBH draws 333 Watts
Wayne recommends EBH runs 3 hours per day
Off Peak Electricity costs $0.10 per KWH

You can plug in your own numbers.

Commuting = 50 miles per day * 250 days per year = 12,500 miles.
12,500 miles / 45 miles per gallon = 288 gallons
12,500 miles / 50 miles per gallon = 250 gallons
Gas savings per year = 38 gallons * $3 per gallon = $114

EBH runs 3 hours * 333 watts = 1 KWH per day * $0.10 per KWH = $0.10 per day.
Electricity cost per year = $ 0.10 per day * 250 days per year = $25

Annual savings for 50 mile per day commute, 250 days per year alone is $89 if you go from 45 to 50 MPG.


The <strike>poor</strike> cheep mans timer.

I bought these Intermec Model TN111 15 Ano Timers in a two pack for $4.99 to operate my Chistmas lights. They have a two prong plug, but that is no problem for an Ex-UL Electrical Safety Engineer.

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Important Note - the green tab / wire attached to the 2 - 3 prong convertor is more than just an antenna that points up to heaven and says a little prayer for you. It must be connected to a properly grounded electrical box. In this case, the wall plate mounting screws are so short, I elected to connect the ground wire to the GFCI frame underneith the wall plate but:

WARNING, if your house was built before 1965, don't expect that the wall box is grounded i.e. don't expect that the outlet frame is grounded. A GFCI outlet will keep you safe, but for a back up on an older house, you could connect the ground to a metal water pipe going into the ground or otherwise known to be reliably grounded.</div>

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Godiva @ Aug 28 2007, 08:18 PM) [snapback]503585[/snapback]</div>

On this particular timer, the on and off cams on the switch are offset such that once it is on, another on tab dosen't do anything and once it is off, another off tab doesn't do anything, so the second tab in each position is just being stored there. These tabs come all the way off, and would never be seen again if not placed there. Many timers are likely designed this way.

Note, I am not running the EBH for 5 hours. It will come on at 4 and then sometime between 7-7:30, I will be out to the car unplugging it, so the off at 9 AM just gives a little cushion in case I take too long in the shower some day.

I forgot to mention, I would be interrested in hearing people's recent eperiences with the longevity of the Intermec electronic iin wall timers.as shown above to replace a regular wall switch.

Back in the 80 and 90, I got tired of replacing them evey 9 months, so I havn't bought any more, but I bet they are better now in the 21 century. Any one have one that has operated faithfully for 5 years or longer?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(NoMoShocks @ Aug 28 2007, 11:11 PM) [snapback]503578[/snapback]</div>

I realize that you've 'rounded' your numbers, but the EBH draws more than 400Watts not 333Watts... http://priuschat.com/index.php?showtopic=1...mp;#entry165730

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(NoMoShocks @ Aug 28 2007, 11:27 PM) [snapback]503589[/snapback]</div>

I can't speak for the timer, but I'll bet that it will last longer than the EBH's NEMA 5-15 plug. I discovered that water (around here?) leeched in between the sheathing and braided wire. Corrosion set in and the copper wire broke. The rest of EBH and cord is fine- just not the area near the plug.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(oly_57mpg @ Aug 28 2007, 08:29 PM) [snapback]503590[/snapback]</div>

OK, that may be true. I read another post that stated the EBH drew about 385 Watts when first pluged in, but then began to draw closer to 300 within 30 minutes or so, so I just took that at face value and picked 333 as a likely 3 hour average. When you used your watt meter, did you take readings thoughout the whole running time and average them?

The drop in current would be based on the temperature of the heating element, rather than the engine temperature when you take the readings, so even if you plug in the EBH with a hot engine, it will still start out higher and then drop off.

Also, Our voltage runs a little high here in Camas, so I better take a series of reading myself and see what I get.

Meanwhile, GODIVA, you better only have two additional friends with EBH connected through you timer at the same time until I get back to you.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(NoMoShocks @ Aug 28 2007, 11:48 PM) [snapback]503596[/snapback]</div>

Reference post? I have a hard time believing anyone's data from something like the 'kill-a-watt' or any other gizmo from 'the sky mall.' Hahahaha. I verified my EBH with equipment that is used to verify large scale production equipment. The documentation from my EBH even said that it would consume 400 W.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(NoMoShocks @ Aug 28 2007, 11:48 PM) [snapback]503596[/snapback]</div>

Yes, I took a few four to eight hour Watt-hour readings. Basically, a reading of the Power consumed over time.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(NoMoShocks @ Aug 28 2007, 11:48 PM) [snapback]503596[/snapback]</div>

Nope. The EBH draws ~400W regardless. Think of it like a _really_ hot light bulb with no light. It's on no matter what.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(NoMoShocks @ Aug 28 2007, 11:48 PM) [snapback]503596[/snapback]</div>

When was your last physics class? The reason things like heat are expressed in Wattage is to include I and V, and in this case the power factor. You can use an ammeter but you would need to know the PF to correct the reading. Same goes for resistance of the EBH and mains voltage.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(NoMoShocks @ Aug 28 2007, 11:48 PM) [snapback]503596[/snapback]</div>

Na... The house wiring will be fine. 800W to 1200W is less than irons, hair curlers, hair dryers, and some computers.