1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Another Prius Dies on the Highway

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Main Forum' started by ggood, Mar 24, 2006.

  1. ggood

    ggood Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2004
    2,436
    517
    0
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Advanced
    Wednesday, my 2004 Prius died while my wife was driving on a highway near Wichita Falls, Texas. It was towed to Patterson Toyota, who have been unable to diagnose the problem after a day and a half of trying. They have now called for "tech support", which apparently means a master tech is driving or flying in on Monday to try to diagnose the problem. This is not the recall issue. I had already had all TSBs etc. performed, and they've already checked for that issue.

    Since I had a really difficult time getting my computer plug back in after installing the Coastal autolock, I was quite upfront about telling them I knew one of the computer plugs had been pulled and that they should check to make sure it was still in place. Apparently, it is. I haven't yet told them to try unplugging the autolock and/or the Nav/bluetooth override, since I doubt that's the problem, but I probably will bring that up now that they're having such problems diagnosing the problem.

    Since I'm over 36,000 miles and never bought the extended warranty, it will be interesting/potentially expensive to see if this gets covered as a hybrid component problem. Of course, if it turns out to be something caused by the autolock or nav kits, I'm really screwed! :( :) Meanwhile, I'm paying for the rental car my wife used to get back to Houston, while I wait to see if we'll be able to get the Prius back quickly. I'll keep you all posted.

    I'd be interested in hearing (i) if anyone else has had a similar experience after having all recalls done, (ii) if anyone has any potential causes/cures, and (iii) if anyone thinks the autolock or nav kit is a possible source of the problem, by causing a short or something. Everything was working fine for over a week after installing the 2 kits.
     
  2. efusco

    efusco Moderator Emeritus
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2003
    19,891
    1,192
    9
    Location:
    Nixa, MO
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Were there MIL/CEL lights? Did the dealer service dept. pull any DTC codes? Will the car do anything when you attempt to start? Were there any anomalies before the thing died?

    What plug did you pull to install the auto-lock? IIRC it just needed to tap into a couple of wires. And, if installed correctly, it shouldn't have anything to do with the Hybrid system. Likewise with the NAV...there's just no connection at all. Now, if you'd have put in an EV button and had screwed up something putting the plug in then you might have had issues.

    Please keep us up to date. There've been a few HV battery failures reported...those usually showed up with weird SOC surges just prior to failing.
     
  3. momfortheenvironment

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2006
    146
    0
    0
    Location:
    Southern New Hampshire
    ahhhhhhhh sounds like the electronic module in my ford escort many years ago, the car just shut off, that s been my last are of concern, with so many electronic pieces, is this car more prone to those type of issues. I unforutnately owned a corolla that must have been built on a friday afternoon, after happy hour began, I had alternator problems and many electrical issues.
     
  4. galaxee

    galaxee mostly benevolent

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2005
    9,810
    466
    0
    Location:
    MD
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    they should be able to pull diagnostic codes. if they have no idea what they're doing i'd take the car to another dealer. good luck, and let us know how this turns out.

    without much info there's not much speculation we can do. :(
     
  5. slortz

    slortz New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2004
    316
    0
    0
    If it turns out that the problem was not caused by anything you did, then you should still be covered under Toyota's warranty. The 3/36 warranty covers everything bumper-to-bumper, but the powertrain is covered for 60mo/60K miles, and the HV battery, including other HV components, are covered for 8yr/100K miles.
    Sounds most likely it will be a HV problem or powertrain problem, so you should be OK--if they don't pinpoint it do something you did.
    Hope it all works out well. :)


    Here's the link to the Toyota site where I got this info.
    http://www.toyota.com/prius/models.html
    Click on "limited warranty" and then at the bottom of the page it has the special stuff about the Prius coverage.
     
  6. ggood

    ggood Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2004
    2,436
    517
    0
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Advanced
    My wife said it suddenly lost power, with the red exclamation point and other warning lights. She tried power cycling several times, and said it looked just like it did when I tried powering the car with the grey ECU plug pulled (the plug that you put 3 taps on for the autolock, or that you stick the pin in for the EV). Coastal Dave told me it powers that main ECU, so if you try to start the car nothing can happen because the computer isn't on. Nothing on the dash lights up except but the boxes around where the gear indicators should be. I've just been talking to the service rep, not directly to the Prius Tech, so haven' gotten into the details of what trouble codes they pulled. If they are bringing in a higher level Toyata tech from outside the dealer, I don't see much point in towing the car to another dealer in Fort Worth or Dallas. The thread regarding my autolock travails is here.
     
  7. galaxee

    galaxee mostly benevolent

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2005
    9,810
    466
    0
    Location:
    MD
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    okay. DH looked at this and has a thought. this whole thing sounds like a crashed ECU to him.

    that plug should have gone in easily and smoothly. if not, something somewhere isn't right. if it's not in there securely, it might wiggle out, causing the same symptoms you saw when you couldn't get the plug in.

    if that plug isn't in there right and they find it at the dealer... it could be bad news. :( do let us know how this turns out, let's keep our fingers crossed that it's something else.
     
  8. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    14,487
    1,518
    0
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    There have been very rare cases of this happening. Sometimes the car spontaneously resumes working on its own. A friend of mine drives an '01 or '02. It died and would not start. She had it towed. Had to wait out the weekend. On Monday morning it started up as though nothing had happened, and has worked fine ever since. This was 6 months or a year ago. Others have reported the same.

    Good luck to you. I hope it gets fixed soon under warranty, or just decides to wake up on its own.
     
  9. mssmith95

    mssmith95 Michael

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2006
    535
    4
    0
    Location:
    Valencia, CA
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Prime Premium
    Sure sounds like that plug is the problem. I have worked on a few thousand cars (back in my car audio/alarm days), and if a plug does not go in smoothly, something is wrong. Most likely it occured when you removed the plug. You may want to ask them if they have a "spare" plug that you can push into the socket in the car to see if it goes in better then your plug. If that plug still has the problem, then see if they have a "spare" ECU and try plugging your plug into it. Hopefully that will tell you if the problem is there.

    Those pins are so small...if one of them is bent it would be almost impossible to see it with the naked eye. One of the male pins could be seating on the outside of the female pin...which could have eventually worked its way apart. The heat from the ECU into the pins could also have contributed to losing the connection if the male pin was not inside the female pin.

    The weird thing is that it "suddenly" happened, but she could have gone over a bump, knocking it loose. There is not much tolerance when it comes to those pins.

    The autolock and nav kits both have to "tap" into power in order to function, so a blown fuse is always a possibility (it never ceases to amaze me that a tech sometimes looks for difficult stuff before checking the easy stuff like fuses). I have worked on cars where a blown fuse, that is labeled "lights" also protects part of the computer...but does not say anything about it in the literature...and if blown, the car will not start!

    Of course, it could be the main "ON" button itself...but I have not heard of that failing before.

    Let us know what happens.
     
  10. jamarimutt

    jamarimutt New Member

    Joined:
    May 4, 2004
    985
    5
    0
    In summary, when you get your car, leave well enough alone.
     
  11. rposton

    rposton Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2006
    139
    10
    0
    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    Well, least until the warranty runs out and you have some more money in the bank.
     
  12. efusco

    efusco Moderator Emeritus
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2003
    19,891
    1,192
    9
    Location:
    Nixa, MO
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    And never leave your house, and don't use gas heat, and have the electricty disconnected, and wear sunscreen any time you go outside, and cover all the furniture with plastic.

    Come on now...Using good sense, being careful, and being aware of the potential risks and expenses one might incur is important, but the 'leave well enough alone' concept is absurd. Never change tire brands? Never get a better stereo? What about a steering wheel cover?

    We all set our limits differently and at our own comfort levels. Some risk to improve my quality of life and satisfaction with my car is an acceptible trade off. If it's not, for you, then sure, don't do it. But don't be critical if others make modifications that are within their comfort level.
     
  13. finman

    finman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2004
    1,287
    111
    0
    Location:
    Albany, OR
    Vehicle:
    2014 Nissan LEAF
    I might add that thousands of people mod their cars with no ill effects. This is not just the Prius. Heck, if we didn't mod our cars beyond the OEM, where would the aftermarket business go? I just love it when any car dies and the first thing that comes to mind is 'did u add something to it'. Been doing that for years and so have thousands of others with no issues.

    And those that don't mod, and then have the car die or do something weird...what causes that? Were they just thinking about adding something and the car stopped running...
     
  14. DaveinOlyWA

    DaveinOlyWA 3rd Time was Solariffic!!

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2004
    15,140
    611
    0
    Location:
    South Puget Sound, WA
    Vehicle:
    2013 Nissan LEAF
    Model:
    Persona
    i talked to a guy at my gym who had an 04 that suddenly died one day. after spending at least an hour trying to restart it. he finally called roadside and had it towed to the dealer. by the time it got there, it started no problem.

    he was unwilling to wait at the dealership and decided to take it without any delays (im guessing on this part because he had no information at all as to why this happened. when i asked about codes, his look reminded me of a jack-o-latern i had when i was a kid)

    that was over a year ago and his car has worked perfectly ever since. so this can come and go. have to admit this story comes from a "just drive it" kind of guy. i asked about gas, gas cap, warning signals... all that stuff. he had no hints clues or suggestions about what the cause may have been.

    part of the reason was it happened fall 2004, and he only told me about it a month or so ago.
     
  15. ggood

    ggood Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2004
    2,436
    517
    0
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Advanced
    But I haven't even installed my factory EV button yet! :D Maybe I'll get MSSmith95 to help me!

    Seriously, the technogeek hacking of this car is part of the charm, isn't it?

    In answer to other comments, when the plug finally did go in, it did seem to go in smoothly. After examining the pins with a magnifying glass and flashlight, I'm convinced they were in good condition. The grooves and channels in the plug should make bending pins almost impossible, and plugging it back in idiot proof. For some reason, I had a really difficult time. As I said, I already told them to make sure all plugs were correctly installed. They don't think that's the problem. We'll see what the master tech thinks.
     
  16. ggood

    ggood Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2004
    2,436
    517
    0
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Advanced
    UPDATE - OK, the good news is nobody else here has to worry about their Prius dying on the highway. The bad news is that that I've really screwed myself with my botched autolock install. :(

    They've now confirmed the ECU plug is not staying in because the locking tab/mechanism is broken. Why it took them 5 days to figure that out after I told them to check for that is a mystery. They even called in a Toyota engineer to help solve the problem. Sheer Craziness.

    So, I'm being told their only option is to replace the entire wiring harness that the plug is attached to. They were having trouble finding the part no., but I've been told between $2,400 to $3,200 for the part, and $1,000 labor. OUCH!

    My only other option is to try to deal with this myself, by (1) trying to find a junked prius with the wiring harness, (2) attempting to jerry-rig a way to keep the existing plug clamped in place (given the tight quarters, I don't have any ideas how to accomplish that), or (3) somehow finding and rewiring a new plug (even more unlikely).

    If anyone has any suggestions, I'm all ears. I know the local junkyards in a given city are usually connected by radio. Does anyone know of an internet method of searching for junked parts?
     
  17. Begreen

    Begreen Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2006
    670
    10
    0
    Location:
    Western WA state
    Vehicle:
    Other Electric Vehicle
    Model:
    N/A
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ggood @ Mar 29 2006, 07:37 PM) [snapback]232124[/snapback]</div>
    Is (4) bypass the plug and hardwire the plug an option? If yes consider raw crimp connectors that can be soldered and then covered with shrink tubing. (The shrink tubing will need to be in place first.)
     
  18. EricGo

    EricGo New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2005
    1,805
    0
    0
    Location:
    Albuquerque, NM (SouthWest US)
    ggood, rotten luck.

    Ebay ?

    Your problem does make me think that a forum on PC for spare parts may be a good idea.
     
  19. Marlin

    Marlin New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2005
    1,407
    10
    0
    Location:
    Bucks County, PA
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ggood @ Mar 30 2006, 12:37 AM) [snapback]232124[/snapback]</div>
    How could any wiring harness cost $2400 to $3200? I can understand the $1000 labor, because I can imagine lots of things need to be removed in order to access all the places the harness goes to.

    How about duct tape, rubber bands, or whatever else you can think of to hold the connector in place?

    I don't know exactly where this plug is or what it looks like, but would there be a way you could attach one end of a rubberband near it, stretch it across the back of the plug, and secure the other end somewhere else so that the rubberband keeps the plug firmly in place?

    And then there's always the superglue option.
     
  20. priusham

    priusham New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2004
    525
    1
    0
    Location:
    Michigan - land of everlasting snowflake icon!
    At $3,000+ for the repair... a $4 tube of epoxy sounds like a wise investment.