Arctic National Wildlife Refuge...

F8L, I'm loving you more and more with each of your posts! First, you comment on the deleterious effects of invasive species and now this!!! You rock! Ever since the current administration took office, they've been trying to pass a bill to drill here. They hid the drilling in a bill that was to fund our troops in Iraq, then they tried to bury it in an energy bill that gave americans a lousy 100 credit on their energy use. Each and every time the outcries were heard and the bills were voted down. After numerous years of attempting to drill here, they will not give up. A collective voice has spoken and the administration is not willing to listen.

I have probably killed and entire tree writing letters opposing this matter. Thanks for posting this thread. Here are some facts that I was able to obtain when making my decision as to whether or not I wanted to support the matter.

ANWR maybe has 10 billion barrels of oil. We here in the US consume 19 million barrels of day of this fuel. When one does the math, you can see that drilling here would support a little over one year of our energy needs. Our foreign imports would drop by only about 5% and the price of a barrel of oil by only .50 cents. The oil generated from this area wouldn't even hit our market until about 2013 so it's not even a short term solution. Meanwhile, we'd be destroying one of the most pristine habitats in the US. I haven't found any data on this theory but am wondering if the cost to implement drilling here would yield more cost effective results by investing this money in the research of alternative energy.

 

How someone could even think of desecrating a wildlife refuge is beyond me. Destroy something forever in return for one year's oil for one country? Let me think...umm...NO! Whoever counted the beans on that one is counting some of them twice and others not at all, or only counting their own. I think my Greenpeace contribution just went up again. Time for a little civil disobedience?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(F8L @ Aug 25 2006, 11:02 AM) [snapback]309391[/snapback]</div>

"Hammer, let me introduce nail..." (squarely on the head)

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hyo silver @ Aug 25 2006, 11:53 AM) [snapback]309416[/snapback]</div>

Where is your house? Was it not at one time a pristine natural habitat? I am not arguing for or against the drilling in the refuge (frankly I don't know all of the argument pro/con), but it seems - no offense intended - somewhat hypocritical. Remember that the oil we use is coming from somewhere. Where that comes from now or in the future is also an area that was once a pristine natural environment.

I agree we should all cut back and conserve where we can. But to think that we will never again drop another oil well into the ground on this planet is a bit ridiculous. The question is, where will that be (our backyard, so to speak, or someone else's)?

Does anybody have a reason why we should / should not drill here vs. drilling somewhere else on the planet? Again - not advocating either way, just interested in the rationale pro or con vs. the alternatives.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TimBikes @ Aug 25 2006, 02:31 PM) [snapback]309439[/snapback]</div>

you have a point. the house that i live in is on land that was once rolling prairie. only about 1% of this type of land remains in illinois. your point is exactly why i don't think we should be desecrating more of our public lands - especially for reasons that don't provide logical, long term based solutions to our problems. there are over 6 billion people on the planet and a lot of these people are located in areas that are just now begining to drive cars, become technologically oriented, etc. the global demand for resources will grow exponentially. because the resources we use are finite, i think we should be investing in energy solutions that originate from sustainable sources. if we don't every single area of our planet will be developed, drilled or mined.

the following is a link concerning global population. while it's not entirely accurate, you can see that the global population increases like a ticking clock.

http://www.ibiblio.org/lunarbin/worldpop

all of these people are, or will be, placing demands on our resources that are not going to be sustainable for the long run. it's probable that the money that would be utilized by the administration to drill for a year's worth of our oil, and wouldn't be available for market for almost another decade, is not a good enough reason to disturb a protected site. it cannot be done without catastrophic affects on the environment and its inhabitants. in the end, it's about saving these natural, protected areas for the life of this planet - at least for me. they're predicting a total destruction of the amazon rainforest within a few decade, if this is telling enough.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TimBikes @ Aug 25 2006, 03:31 PM) [snapback]309439[/snapback]</div>

Close to 70 years ago, the land on which my house now sits was a fruit orchard. Before that, it would have been considered 'unimproved land.' I've spent a pile of money updating my house in the past few years, vastly increasing its energy efficiency, and I have a ways to go yet. The yard has less lawn and more native species and food crops than when I moved in, and more are in the works. I have commuted to work by car and/or motorcycle a grand total of maybe three summers my entire life.

No, I don't live in the trees. Yes, I use oil. That doesn't disqualify me from thinking that trading a public asset for a private short term gain is a bad idea.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(F8L @ Aug 25 2006, 03:36 PM) [snapback]309465[/snapback]</div>

our coasts were just opened up for drilling. this just passed. i'm not sure if it goes through another step of if it's final.

 

Perhaps a simple message to our government representatives:

"What part of NO don't you understand?"

Then punctuate it at the polls come November. If we don't start voting them out, they'll never get it that it pays to listen to the voters...not the money.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco @ Aug 25 2006, 04:36 PM) [snapback]309498[/snapback]</div>

a friend of mine does consulting work. he trains companies on osha policy and the implementation of same. he, just this last year, went to alaska and saw sections of anwar. he came back with a view of anwr; that it is barren and that there's not much there to save. when i mentioned the caribou, he said that the caribou would probably use the roads constructed for the oil drilling to migrate and that we'd be helping them. i think that when people backpack, bird watch, hike and get involved with and gain knowledge of native flora, one starts to have a different view of the world. to be honest, i believe it renders one less selfish. there are plenty of places that i've hiked locally that on the surface don't look that pretty only to find out that there are endangered orchids or rare birds nesting in the area. at that point the area takes on a whole new meaning. even though i believe i am very "in tune" with these natural areas, i gained an entirely different experience when i backpacked the wind river range in wyoming. you loose track of time, experience a serenity, start to appreciate the land on a different level. as far as i'm concerned, this had to have been one of the most amazing experiences of my life. i have a special concern for anwr simply because it is so remote and untouched. unless there is an extremely sound reason, it should stay that way. (if you happen to like neil young, the last song (i believe it's the last song) of greendale will strike a chord on this topic)

 

F8L, is it a useful read and does it provide practical, workable knowledge? if so, i'm ordering this.

funny, look what i just found from your link. how appropriate!

http://www.ucpress.edu/books/sc/pages/SC51142.html

 

well, i don't and won't have children and i am not a teacher so it's not going to assist in that area. but i am an active volunteer (you know ridding invasives and such) so maybe it would help with my engagement in that area.

i sure hope you're educating yourself with an end result in an environmental field. it seems you have a very good basic knowledge and that you have a genuine concern. we need more and more people like you!