Brake failure 2005 Prius

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Main Forum' started by lwinter, May 26, 2006.

  1. lwinter

    lwinter New Member

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    Last week the brakes on my 2005 Prius failed- the pedal went to the floor, and the ABS and emergency brake lights went on. Twenty minutes later, the brakes worked again. The local Toyota dealer was unable to diagnose the problem, and insisted that no changes were needed. The service manager is insisting that the car is safe to drive, but offers no evidence. This logic seems warped, because regardless of the fact that they are unable to determine the cause, the brakes did, indeed fail once already. Had I been going faster (I was stopped at a light), the consequences could have been catastrophic. Neither my dealership nor Corp HQ is willing to resolve this issue satisfactorily (ie replace anything that might cause such failure). Fixing it is certainly cheaper than the lawsuit that my heirs will file if I am injured or killed. Has anyone else had this problem? What did you do about it?

    Thanks, LAW
     
  2. Jonnycat26

    Jonnycat26 New Member

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    Did the dealer pull any codes from the car, or was the car acting as if everything were normal?
     
  3. galaxee

    galaxee mostly benevolent

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    if the ABS light came on, there should have been a stored code to document the error. it should be on your work order.

    it's a real shame, but there are some incompetent dealers out there. share whatever codes you get with the board and we'll see what we can find.
     
  4. lwinter

    lwinter New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(galaxee @ May 26 2006, 08:29 AM) [snapback]261312[/snapback]</div>

    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ May 26 2006, 06:57 AM) [snapback]261280[/snapback]</div>
     
  5. efusco

    efusco Moderator Emeritus
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    I'm pretty sure someone over on the Priusonline.com board described a similar problem. I think it ended up being something to do with the accumulator.

    I don't think this is an immediate safety risk but there certainly is something wrong.
     
  6. lwinter

    lwinter New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ May 26 2006, 06:57 AM) [snapback]261280[/snapback]</div>

    Thanks so much for your replies. The codes were: C1357, and something called a "detail code" 28. The dealer and district manager contend that since the codes are no longer showing up, the problem is fixed, even though they made no changes or repairs. My contention is that the brakes failed with no warning, which indicates a problem. They have this far not given me an adequate reason to feel safe driving my beloved Prius....if the brakes failed once and no repairs were made, what evidence is there that they will not fail again? Next time they fail I may be driving at freeway speeds - or well above :) Any ideas?
     
  7. Jonnycat26

    Jonnycat26 New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Linda W @ May 26 2006, 01:42 PM) [snapback]261377[/snapback]</div>
    Just a quick shot in the dark here, but was the pavement you were driving over when the brakes failed uneven? The Prius's brakes (which are rubbish in anything other than stopping on a smooth surface in a straight line) get very confused when the pavement is uneven and you're applying moderate to high breaking pressure. I've even had the brakes lock up on me in a couple of instances. There are numerous threads about this on here...
     
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  8. lwinter

    lwinter New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ May 26 2006, 10:51 AM) [snapback]261385[/snapback]</div>
    Nope, the pavement was smooth, conditions were dry and sunny, I was stopped at a light when it happened.
     
  9. efusco

    efusco Moderator Emeritus
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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Linda W @ May 26 2006, 12:42 PM) [snapback]261377[/snapback]</div>


    Someone here will have that code decifered for you in about 10 minutes, but I'm at work so won't be the one.



    Let me try to give you a little reassurance. The Prius braking system is a triple redundant system. It utilizes a combination of the regenerative brakes, a capacitor controlled electronic brake system as well as a 'standard' mechanical/hydrolic system. If my suspicion is correct your accumulator just couldn't hold the sustained brake pedal pressure for the duration of the stop and released pressure. When up to speed it should hold fine for the duration of a stop.



    It still needs to be fixed.
     
  10. Jonnycat26

    Jonnycat26 New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Linda W @ May 26 2006, 02:01 PM) [snapback]261392[/snapback]</div>
    In that case, I'd go to another dealer. You had a break failure and the dealer doesn't know why, and thinks it won't happen again since the lights are off now. If it I were you, I'd definitely find another dealer and/or call toyota corporate. I'd possibly even add it to the NHTSA complaints website, as there are other similar situations up there.
     
  11. galaxee

    galaxee mostly benevolent

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    we've got the repair manuals on the living room floor. will look up the code tonight.

    the accumulator issue that Evan mentioned miiight be the case but the ABS light makes me think not.

    will report back with more info after work. we'll arm you with info but you should definitely go to a different dealer. they're clearly not willing to fess up to not knowing what they're doing.
     
  12. lwinter

    lwinter New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ May 26 2006, 11:12 AM) [snapback]261399[/snapback]</div>
    Thank you all for your input, and whatever advice you can continue to offer.

    I would love to take it to another dealer, but I have just been blown off by the District Service Manager, who finally took my phone call (after repeated calls to him over the past week) and who controls all the dealerships between San Francisco and my corner of the world, south of Fresno. He said technicians checked the Wheel Sensing System, the Brake Actuator Assembly, the Skid Control ECU, the harnesses and connections, and could find nothing wrong. He said that the codes disappeared as they were doing the check, and wants me to believe that this "proves" the car is safe, and has flat out refused to take it any further. I also called Toyotas Customer Assistance number, and a Prius specialist was suposed to call me back, but never did. I repeatedly requested politely to speak with a supervisor, but nobody was willing to take my call, and nobody returned my call (it has been three days now).

    I have filed a complaint with BAR, and now, thanks to the suggestion that one of you made, the NHTSA (and yes, there were similar complaints listed already).

    I am feeling pretty stuck, and appreciate any advice. THANKS!
     
  13. clintd555

    clintd555 New Member

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  14. toolbox

    toolbox New Member

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    dct c1357/24 decreasing pressure soleniod malfunction (fl)
     
  15. galaxee

    galaxee mostly benevolent

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    1357/28 is listed as "short to +B or voltage leak in SLRFL continues for 0.05 sec or more" and components to be tested are the brake actuator assembly, skid control ECU and harness/connectors.

    the husband is off at a sleep study and won't be back till tomorrow. i'll have to get him to interpret what exactly that means...
     
  16. ambrothe

    ambrothe Junior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Linda W @ May 26 2006, 09:38 AM) [snapback]261276[/snapback]</div>

    I had a similar or same issue a few months ago. I had been driving down a city street, had come to a stop, and was sitting at a red light with my foot on the brake pedal. All of a sudden, the brake pedal lost all resistance and went to the floor, and the ABS and emergency brake lights went on. I left my foot off of the brake when the light changed, pulled over, and restarted the car. All of the lights were off and the car operated normally.

    This only happened one time in the 32,000 miles that I've driven, so I'm not particularly worried about it happening again, much less it happening while I'm moving. It sounds like the explanations here fit the problem, and while something is obviously not holding the correct pressure, I'm not worried about it causing any sort of accident as in my case it didn't affect the motion of the car at all. I had many, many more problems of a more serious nature (like the ABS actually malfunctioning to the point that the power brakes weren't working correctly) in my old car, and I have no complaints about my Prius.
     
  17. Jonnycat26

    Jonnycat26 New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Linda W @ May 26 2006, 05:13 PM) [snapback]261476[/snapback]</div>
    It's pretty crappy that you're being blown off like this, but Toyota isn't known for having great dealers.

    Bottom line is: your brakes are probably the most important piece of equipment on your car. If you can't stop, you're in a world of hurt. You have only their claim that it won't happen again. You do know that codes were pulled, and they haven't done anything to fix the problem. Your brakes just don't fail and your car won't throw errors unless something's wrong, and that's the bottom line.

    If you can't get it fixed, and Toyota isn't going to help you, it might be worth your peace of mind to trade the car in on something else. Of course that means you're pushing the problem off on someone else, but that's typically how these things happen.
     
  18. galaxee

    galaxee mostly benevolent

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    basically what it sounds like is the actuator assembly. the linear solenoid release for the front left wheel is sticking open. that's the only thing that would have the pedal hit the floor. he highly doubts it's the skid control ECU.

    they can test this with the scan tool under the ABS active test menu. they select the solenoid, push down on the brake pedal, and the activated solenoid drops the brake pedal.

    if they got a code, there's clearly something wrong and they need to address it. if you can't get results with the region call in toyota motor sales usa. that is a safety issue, and just because they cleared the code and it didn't come back right away doesn't mean it's fixed. no conscientious tech would let one of his customers drive away in a car in that condition.
     
  19. seasidetraveler

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Linda W @ May 26 2006, 10:38 AM) [snapback]261276[/snapback]</div>

    Hello central valley neighbor! Sorry to hear of your unpleasant experience! Are you dealing with a Visalia dealer, or Fresno?
    I bought mine at Michael Toyota of Fresno- and the sales dept. was wonderful, but the service dept SUCKED! Now they have replaced the Prius service advisors, and they seem to be a LITTLE better, so if you continue to experience trouble, maybe I can help. I know the right people to talk to there, and I carry a lot of clout there because I have sent a lot of business their way- and all I gotta do is make a phone call and they will treat you well. I have been to the Clovis dealer, and they aren't very friendly either. It's very sad- I expected to be treated better when I bought a Toyota, Ford was definately much better with customer service.
     
  20. RichBoy

    RichBoy New Member

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    just becuase you say the brakes failed once, doesnt make it so.
     
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