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BT Stiffening Plate: The Verdict

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Accessories & Modifications' started by fruzzetti, Dec 22, 2007.

  1. fruzzetti

    fruzzetti Customization-Obsessed

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    OK. So I unboxed this, as seen in photos here:


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    And the review to follow.

    ~ dan ~
     
  2. Rae Vynn

    Rae Vynn Artist In Residence

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    In my Prius photos, I have a photo of the BT plate installed on Rudy.
    Personally, I think it firms up handling while cornering :)
     
  3. fruzzetti

    fruzzetti Customization-Obsessed

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    Here is my review:

    (I) Purchase
    I ordered it online after being reassured by moderator danny that those of us seeking the shock tower support brace would be able to cash in on a retroactive package deal. So I still anxiously await the release of this part.

    At a sale price of $145 shipped, I was satisfied with the purchase and the shipping, which overall took nine days from online purchase to delivery; I found that acceptable for free shipping in the holiday season.

    (II) Installation
    Installation took no more than 10 minutes. I used the reverse camera to inch the rear of the car up on my 10" ramps. I grabbed a 12mm socket on a ratchet, but had to sorta "fake it" for the 8mm Allen wrench.

    As the story goes, it took one minute to drop the old bar. And then I wiped down the mating surfaces and brushed out the bolt holes (add one or two more minutes).

    One difficult part was explaining to my wife (who was kind enough to stand out in the cold helping me) that the oily substance was supposed to stay on the new screws.

    Another difficult part was using three adapters and a socket holding the wrong size Allen driver to torque the new part in. Using an old, large torque wrench, with a 5/8" -> 1/2" adapter, a 1/2" -> 1/4" adapter, then a 1/4" socket, I managed to put a 7/32" Allen driver tip into the socket. It was a pain to torque the screws down to 17 lb-ft, but it worked.

    (III) Effects on Performance
    The truth of the matter is I can understand exactly why the people who like it say so, and I can understand exactly why the people who don't like it say so.

    The change is subtle and not always noticeable, and is about what I expected for a $145 floor-pan brace on a unit-body car. It tames some of the U-shaped flexing the car experiences under strong asymmetric (left-to-right) shocks.

    Those of you who think a $145 floorpan upgrade is going to make enormous changes to the car and prevent body roll and prevent it from sliding around corners are going to be soundly disappointed; but those people really don't know what to expect, apparently.

    Those of you who notice the difference but can't describe it... Be sure you know there's a difference, and be sure you can AT LEAST qualify it, before you claim it has any effect.

    Here's what I notice: there's a bit less flexing through corners, but body roll is unaffected. Also unaffected is the massive understeer I don't like. That bit is one of the smallest changes I notice. Larger and more noticeable are the extra stability any time there are vertical shocks to one side of the car or another (like a gutter area on the side of a road nearer the curb). An easy way to test this is to go over a moderate speed bump with only the tires on one side. It's noticeable in potholes and other such fixtures.

    (IV) Conclusion
    Though it was about $40 more than I would expect to pay for a similar part, the part does have an impact on performance. As with any single upgrade, it's not a profound effect, but it's there and it's a pleasurable change in a sportier direction for the car. Alone, users will not find it is the panacæa; however it will be an essential component of a performance suspension upgrade, balancing forces against the center of the car and preventing unmatched upward flex. It definitely belongs in its niche and I'm glad I have it; just by itself the subtle changes are nice, and when the car is all done I'm certain it will be necessary rather than just helpful.

    ~ dan ~
     
  4. Boo

    Boo Boola Boola Member

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    Hi Dan,

    Thanks for your review.

    Curious, did you notice any differences at highway speeds or in crosswinds?
     
  5. topkick

    topkick Member

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    Nice color! When I bought mine several months ago there was no color choice that I saw and when I opened the box it was bright red! Looks nice when the car is on a lift, but other than that you don't notice.
     
  6. hobbit

    hobbit Senior Member

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    Asymmetric vertical rear suspension transients are what cause the
    flex in the "U" tunnel in the first place, so it totally makes
    sense that that's where you observed the most profound effect.
    I've been trying to tell people this [using a simple curved-over
    piece of paper as a model] for years.
    .
    _H*
     
  7. JaviNOS

    JaviNOS Mod Freak

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    that's a good review...

    we'll i have a similar impression on my install of the bt plate... Change is not big enough to make you take turns 40mph faster :rolleyes:but for people who really pay attention to detail (and "picky", like me)... the difference can be felt.. This is the first part I installed followed by the Tom's upper stabilizer... When you have both is when you'll notice the biggest difference... I'm guessing you'll get a similar outcome when BT tech produces the upper bar.


    I followed all this with TRD sportivo suspension kit... which shows the greatest improvement... and even after that... you cant just go and take turns 40mph faster... :eek:that's just stupid . I used to amateur "solo" and rally race a while ago.. so I always add suspension components to my vehicles... I feel more comfortable that way
     
  8. donee

    donee New Member

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    Hi Fruzzetti,

    Did you notice any difference in the rear end vibration period and damping? That was quite noticable difference with the wind gusts. Before the plate the period was about a second, and the damping took several seconds. With the plate, the rear end vibration was almost a buzz, about 10 to 20 cycles/second, and the damping was much less than a second.

    During handling maneuver I had not sensed that at all. But when the wind gust experience I had, it was obvious. Those were quite unusual gust conditions (although we actually had higher wind speed gusts here in Chicagoland yesterday - up to 63 mph at Ohare, and 88 mph just offshore).
     
  9. fruzzetti

    fruzzetti Customization-Obsessed

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    Thanks for the comments, folks.

    Since I live in the SF Bay Area, it's tough to find a place where there are good gusts of wind except in rare weather conditions. I would imagine that since a gust of wind from the side will translate into a similar asymmetric vertical force, the BT plate will provide extra stability.

    Ironically, I'm sitting next to my wife at Chicago O'Hare Airport, waiting for our connection into Providence. I'd like to drive the car in the conditions I see outside.

    And yes, on northern California's crappy freeways I do notice more stability and less rear-end trailing; I don't think it's improved in a "major" way (warning: subjective term), but that's more a job for a well matched front-rear anti-sway kit.

    I'm interested in hearing about the costs and benefits of the TRD Sportivo system, but I'm also considering going way further -- I'm thinking about getting some pretty exotic parts to put together a tight lowering system. I want a 15-20mm lower center of gravity, so the rear end trails even less, and I need the front to be substantially stiffer to correct the vast understeer problem these cars have stock. I know it will never perform like my Mustang, and maybe I'm just spoiled on that, but the properly balanced oversteer/understeer in that old Ford really makes me feel in total control of the vehicle under every extreme (read: panic) condition.

    Hobbit: it sounds like you're describing the saddle shape of a slice of Hyperbolic Halfplane with your arched piece of paper. Do people start to really understand? Because I'll tell you, before I installed the BT plate I never imagined the car "smiled" so easily underneath.

    Thanks again for the comments, and I hope you all have a great holiday.

    ~ dan ~

    Review of the Monte Carlo bar as soon as I receive one. I may even video tape some hard cornering without and with, if anyone's interested. There are some good, safe curves that make great testing grounds. Maybe even a comparison between a carefully kitted race car and the Prius' before-and-after.
     
  10. JaviNOS

    JaviNOS Mod Freak

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    TRD Sportivo Kit...

    two words.. worth it... :D

    The kit itself is expensive, but when you think about it (and feel it)... you wont mind spending that money...

    1st. You are getting a TRD part... so it has Toyota's name in there so it must mean something... I had TRD suspension before on other cars so I went for it because I have never been disappointed.

    2nd. The are not many options out there that I'd be willing to bet my car's handling on...

    3rd. Its expensive because TRD is an expensive manufacturer (lets be honest, they are!). The kit includes 2 shocks, 2 struts, 4 springs, nuts and bolts, plus 2 TRD sportivo badges...

    My perspective is:
    The car is stiffer... Lower stance but not much... I feel body roll is extremely reduced... There is less understeer... You get more control and the rear stays more balanced... Ride comfort is not as harsh as one would expect (always a good thing). Bottom line, I feel safer and more in control.
     
  11. chefboyarlee

    chefboyarlee New Member

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    How much does the TRD Sportivo kit cost with installation?
     
  12. philmcneal

    philmcneal Taxi!

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    i see the part is around 1000 bucks, not even including installation if you check sigmaauto.com

    however, the previous poster say ride quality wasn't that sacrificed, but ride height will be much lower, can getting fatter tires compensate for the low curb height? How do you deal with the snow, potholes or the exhaust scraping on the ground (stock the exhaust pipe is almost touching the ground!)?

    i can dream of the higher speeds i'm able to maintain while cornering and the better coasting ability but in a city environment I can only imagine, "hell".
     
  13. fruzzetti

    fruzzetti Customization-Obsessed

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    The stock exhaust pipe is tucked nicely up under the car in the tunnel in the absence of a front-to-rear driveline. I was just up under my car a few days ago to install the BT plate and was impressed by the nice placement of the exhaust. If you want to see exhaust that's low to the ground, view this:

    [​IMG]

    In most places you cannot sweep a trouble light under the car, and the exhaust is so close to the ground a closed fist will not pass under it at the collectors.

    I'm hoping to go a bit further than the TRD kit for the handling of the car; I would like strong anti-sway options front and rear, and you'd be surprised that with high-quality (read: ridiculously, stupidly expensive) shock absorbers you can get good, hard shock damping without sacrificing road quality or shaking the car to bits.

    But if there's really no other reasonable option than the TRD, I guess I'll have to start there.

    ~ dan ~
     
  14. JaviNOS

    JaviNOS Mod Freak

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    It costs about 1000$... I installed it myself... so that is what I spent... I posted install pics and instructions right here on the modifications forum. Its not hard at all... its a lot of nuts and bolts though..


    Ride height is not extremely compromised... you may not even notice it...
     
  15. Boo

    Boo Boola Boola Member

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    Sigma Automotive website says the height is lowered 20mm (0.787 inch) in the front, and 15mm (0.590 inch) in the rear.
     
  16. JaviNOS

    JaviNOS Mod Freak

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    that is not even an inch in front and less than half an inch in the rear...

    most aftermarket springs lower 1.5 inches or more...

    That is why you may not notice any difference... plus it takes likes a week for the car to settle... it wont bother you much unless you are used to dirt roads..
     
  17. darelldd

    darelldd Prius is our Gas Guzzler

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    Any input on how the machined brace would reduce the "smile" better than the factory brace? From what I understand, a tension load on that part would decrease the smile in the situations you mention. Do you suppose that the machined part is significantly stiffer in tension than the factory "strap?" Or does tortional stiffness play a part in the smile control as well?
     
  18. Boo

    Boo Boola Boola Member

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    Agreed, it's a little less than 8/10ths of an inch in the front and 6/10ths of an inch in the rear. I was just letting people know what the exact numbers claimed by Sigma Automotive were.
     
  19. fruzzetti

    fruzzetti Customization-Obsessed

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    I wish I had taken it out for controlled (or better yet, measurable) tests before, without any, and after the brace was installed. At least I could have replicated it.

    As a mathematician (though not a physicist or materials engineer, mind you), I expect it to be mostly stretching at that location. But I would expect the stock part to be acceptable as it's reasonably thick and doesn't appear easy to stretch.

    I would expect the torsion to be decreased by the new part, but I would expect a sway bar to give me more stability. I think the combination of torsion rigidity (greatly improved by the new part, though not all that important to the general feel of the car) and the complete unwillingness to stretch and allow the car to "smile" (probably not improved as much, but still noticeably so) give the BT Tech brace a huge thumbs-up.

    And it moves the "smile" shape from the floorpan to my face. Good place for it!

    ~ dan ~
     
  20. brad_rules_man

    brad_rules_man Hybrid electric revolutionizer

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    I would think the advantage would be that when steering the vehicle wouldn't "twist" before actually turning. I hear that when you begin the turning of the vehicle, you don't immediately notice response, because there is a little bit of twist in the chassis, and as a result you don't see that first little bit of response, but only what you overcome after the first bit of twist. Anyway.. I would love to hear some input on that specifically. As I would think that the steering vs chassis twist might contribute a bit to any noticeable changes in handling in cross winds. The reason I say this, is because if you respond to crosswinds, you would in theory notice the "correction" right away!