Do you think PC FHOP has become too Angry?

I would say certain individuals have, but not the group as a whole.

 

It is easy to get angry at someone.. but I think of it like this, if your puppy does something wrong you can get angry - or you can just realize that the puppy is pretty dumb and doesn't know any better.

 

Yes, I do. It's one of the reasons I don't visit PriusChat as much any more.

 

I don't see it as anger at each other so much as it is just discussion of anger-oriented subjects. And that's natural because it's all around us and all over the newspapers and on t.v. I hate that these things are happening, but it makes all the more sensitive to and thankful for the positive stories like the frontpage story in the CITY Paper about Al Roker donating a truckload of musical instruments to the W.O. Smith School of Music which offers low income kids music lessons for 50 cents. Or the story on tonight's 10 oclock news about the Oklahoma video producer who spends his weekends making hot dog sack lunches for the homeless and has succeeding in helping 30 of them get off the streets. Those are the folks who need the spotlight, not gun-toting madmen.

 

Funny this topic should come up.

I was just thinking about writing an article about critical thinking versus ad hominem attacks and other irrational thinking in FHOP. Yes, the subjects are those who lend themselves to passionate debate, and I am all for passionate discourse. (Might even make a living out of passionate discourse one day!) It's one thing to vehemently disagree with someone based on "My dad can beat up your dad" kind of logic in which young children engage. It's quite another to use facts and draw reasonable conclusions -- right or wrong -- while presenting your arguments to influence rather than inflame.

FHOP is sometimes fun, other times poignant. But most often, it's entertainment value is overshadowed by the sheer nastiness of the authors against each other not against the validity of their ideas or conclusions. I find myself avoiding FHOP some days when I just want the "noise" to go away. Because most of it is just that -- noise with no purpose.

Doesn't mean I don't read it at all. Just means I have to be in the right mood!

Dan

 

Those of us who joined PC in the early days will remember that FHOP was formed in order to segregate these kinds of discussions into a forum where people who just wanted to talk about the Prius could ignore the political, social, and religious topics. I don't remember if the off-topic discussions were angrier or less angry or about the same back in those days. But I think FHOP serves its purpose well.

I think the poll topic is poorly worded. Has FHOP become too angry? That way the question stresses whether it has changed for the worse. Is FHOP too angry? That way it asks for a personal opinion on how much anger is acceptable.

My view: We discuss a lot of topics that become very angry regardless of the venue. Religion, politics, abortion, gun control, etc. But we also discuss a lot of other stuff as well. I think FHOP is a microcosm of our nation. Yes, our nation (and FHOP with it) is too angry. But this is not specific to FHOP, and I don't think FHOP has changed all that much, except that perhaps as the Prius becomes more mainstream we have (perhaps???) more conservatives than we did in the early days when (mostly) only tree-huggers were buying the car. More diversity of Prius owners means more diversity of opinions on PC, and more opportunity for conflict.

 

I don't know about anyone else, but I think the anger in this particular forum is just the way the game is played nowadays (I only know of one political forum of the dozens I've seen where name calling isn't Standard Operating Procedure, and that's through diligent use of warnings and bannings).

On the other hand, I think it's also just an act. Desynch and I could call each other every name under the sun, but if I were to meet him in real life, I'd buy him a beer.

I wouldn't buy "Dr. Berman" a beer, though, but only because of the drinking age law.

 

I've been hanging out here in Fred's since Sep 05 and haven't seen any increase in antagonism - in fact, I'd say the opposite: one or two posters whose posts used to vary only in the amount of gunpowder packed into their grenades have changed remarkably in tone and their posts are now models of rational, still passionate discourse, but without accompanying artillery. I now look forward to reading one particular poster's posts, for example, whereas earlier I used to just cringe at them. Our ideas are still mostly 180 degrees apart, but gone completely is the disagreeableness (I even told him that in a PM).

Yes, there are new posters whose principal conversational tool is the rhetorical equivalent of a 9mm in both hands, but if they hang around Fred's long enough they'll simmer down. Some of them, anyway.

Welcome back, Squid.

Mark Baird
Alameda CA

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco @ Apr 21 2007, 05:06 AM) [snapback]427250[/snapback]</div>

Just to be fair, shouldn't that be

"liberal" / "conservative"

or maybe

"bleeding-heart liberal" / "neocon"???

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Apr 21 2007, 10:18 AM) [snapback]427334[/snapback]</div>

So, it's not an opportunity for learning and understanding? :huh:

Hey, after all, isn't it the conservative who crossed ideological lines by purchasing a "tree-hugger" car, and is daring enough to dip their toes into the FHOP pool - only to be met with a coordinated attack of ultra-liberal sharks smelling conservative blood?

I can't tell you the number of times total strangers in real world situations have misidentified me as a liberal just because of the car I drive. A non-hostile conservative response on my part is often met with a shocked expression or outright indignation.

My favorite: Having driven to my voting polling place and waking in, I am joined by a lady who says, "are you ready to go vote the bums out?"
My response? "Yeah, the (California) state legislature and teacher's unions are out of control."
She then gave me a snotty look and huffed off. :mellow:

I would never assume it's OK to say to an SUV driver, "hey, let's go vote them bleeding-heart libs out of office."

Why do liberals think all their positions are shared by everyone they meet?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TonyPSchaefer @ Apr 21 2007, 02:22 PM) [snapback]427360[/snapback]</div>

Speeking of anger, I found this on another site and it seemed appropo. What do you think?

[attachmentid=7582]

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Stev0 @ Apr 21 2007, 12:27 PM) [snapback]427338[/snapback]</div>

Stev0, I'd buy you a beer too!

 

I usually don't read any of the topics in the FHOP forum. To much of it is hate speech posing as political opinion. I think a lot of that sort of thing is bleeding over into the other forums as well, which is why I don't visit this site nearly as much as I once did.

I visited one of the Corvette sites a few times, even though I don't own a Corvette. It was a welcome change to see that people could actually have an intelligent discussion about their cars without some snide political remark being injected.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Apr 21 2007, 10:18 AM) [snapback]427334[/snapback]</div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sufferin' Prius Envy @ Apr 21 2007, 01:34 PM) [snapback]427402[/snapback]</div>

The thread topic is anger. I was addressing the topic.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Apr 21 2007, 04:19 PM) [snapback]427465[/snapback]</div>

No. The thread topic is the level of civility in FHOP, " . . . too angry . . .".

The fact that most here have focused in on only the anger aspect doesn't surprise me.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sufferin' Prius Envy @ Apr 21 2007, 04:34 PM) [snapback]427402[/snapback]</div>

Nope. IMHO--I admire conservatives--true conservatives. On this forum and in real life, if someone identifies themself as a true conservative, they are not supporters of the current regime, and therefore I dig 'em. I don't like big government, and believe in conserving resources and limiting spending, too.

Neocon? Supports this administration and couldn't care less about conserving anything.

And on this forum, both "neocon" and "liberal" are used by each of the opposing factions to describe the other. "Bleeding heart" is just not necessary, as the neocon thinks that anyone that doesn't agree with them is a liberal, and that includes the centrists.

Again, my opinion.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sufferin' Prius Envy @ Apr 21 2007, 08:12 PM) [snapback]427490[/snapback]</div>

Daniel had it right; the thread topic is "Do you think PC FHOP has become too Angry?".

Many of the topics are not simply "yes/no" or "right/wrong", but there are some posters who try to turn them into this simplistic viewpoint. There are others who attempt to turn almost every topic towards their own personal pet peeve/soapbox, and that can get annoying.

But then again, many of these topics by their very nature engender passionate responses; however, I have seen several interesting points of view (that I might not have otherwise considered) get diluted or destroyed by the name-calling that is unfortunately so much a part of FHOP...and that's a pity.