Driving the 2010 Prius in severe winters?

Re: Driving the 2010 Prius in sever winters?

6 winters of driving my Iconic model in Minnesota pretty speaks for itself. (If you want more, refer to the 3 winters with my Classic model.)

MPG dropped into the low 40's, still better than anything else on the road... hardly what you could call "poor".

2010 is designed to deliver improvements in those cold temperatures. The warm-up cycle is shorter and the engine stays off longer.
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Re: Driving the 2010 Prius in sever winters?

There are many here who drive their GenII Prius in very severe winter conditions. There is definitely a hit on mileage due to conditions (as there is in the CR-V when the AWD kicks in), but the 2010 is supposed to do better in cold temperatures, so the hit may not be as great. Get a really good set of snows, and it should be fine. Search the many threads here on the subject for the best winter tires.

 

Re: Driving the 2010 Prius in sever winters?

You will need snow tires. I purchased my wife's from "tirerack.com" with steel wheels. Any snow over 7" deep and the under trays on my wife Honda Civic Hybrid ride on top of the snow and start to catch it. THIS MAY NOT HAPPEN ON THE 2010 Prius though. It does have under trays for better aerodynamics.

 

Re: Driving the 2010 Prius in sever winters?

I live in the mountains in Utah. We use snow tires and try to avoid driving our 04 prius when it is really getting nasty and prefer to use our RAV4 with AWD.

We also saw the MPG hit, but it may be because of the gas and not the conditions. I talked with our state science advisor (a friend of mine) and he told me that they mix up different gasoline types in order to deal with starting engines in the cold. He said that this is the main contributing factor to lower mpg.

Bob.

 

Re: Driving the 2010 Prius in sever winters?

Our 2006 does fine in northern Michigan, and our part of Michigan is considerably more snowy than Wisconsin. We run good all-season tires, but snow tires are obviously better. We have VSC, and with that the Prius is the best driving winter car I have ever driven. Let me explain that remark: I have owned a Jeep C-J5, a Subaru 4wd, and a Ford Aerostar with electronic 4wd. All three of those could wade through deeper snow than the Prius, and obviously had better traction with 4wd, but all were harder and scarier to drive in the winter. The Prius tracks straight and true on patchy ice and snow, brakes evenly, and never makes a fuss. Just remember that it is a front wheel drive car, not a four wheel drive truck.

As for mileage, I take exception to your wording about the Prius getting poor mileage in the winter. The Prius gets great mileage in the winter, but not as great as in the summer. The mileage of all cars drops in the winter, with increased rolling resistance and heating requirements. You will find (if people are honost) that most cars drop about the same percentage in the winter. With a high mileage car like the Prius, the absolute drop is a more impressive number. Let me give you an example:

With our Prius we average about 55 mpg in the summer. In the winter that figure drops to around 45 mpg. The percent drop is (55-45)/55*100 which equals (approximately) an 18% drop. With our Aerostar the summer mileage is about 20 mpg and the winter mileage is 16 mpg, giving a percent drop of 20%, or 2% more than the Prius. The Prius drops 10 mpg in the winter while the van only drops 4 mpg, but it is easy to see that the van suffers more than the Prius.

Numbers can be tricky if you don't pay attention. A car unable to move would get 0 mpg summer or winter, which means its winter mileage is just as good as its summer mileage, for what that is worth.

Tom

 

Re: Driving the 2010 Prius in sever winters?

Absolutely, I understand your concern. There is a lot of misinformation floating about, and in the case of the Prius much of it is hateful. Some of it comes from dealers, such as the case above. I am sorry to say that many salespeople know little about the Prius, so be skeptical of anything they tell you.

I have driven trough the mountains with my Prius, and as the story above suggests, it is possible to drain the traction battery, but if you do, it's not the end of the world. It is important to remember that all energy in a Prius comes from the gas engine. The battery can store a small amount of that energy and give it back when needed, but it is a small amount. This means that the Prius is entirely powered by a small 1.5 liter engine (1.8 for the Gen III). The battery and motors make it feel more powerful than it is. If you drain down the battery, all that is left is the 1.5 liter engine. That will get you over the Rockies, but you aren't going to set any speed records.

My advice for the mountains is to stay to the right and maintain a steady but not fast speed. 55 mph seems to work well, although in the mountains it is often to curvy for that.

As for cold, reduced battery capacity is not a major factor in mileage loss. The big factors are increased rolling resistance and heat generation, with heat generation the larger. The engine has to burn fuel to warm itself, the catalytic converter, and heat the cabin. Most cars are so inefficient that you don't notice the extra losses, but in the Prius they are apparent. It's not because of a Prius limitation, but just the opposite.

The 2010 Gen III Prius has introduced a heat exchanger system for extracting heat from the exhaust. This should further improve winter mileage.

Tom

 

Re: Driving the 2010 Prius in sever winters?

While I often avoid comparing my winters with that of others further south of me, I am very confident that the 2010 will be significantly superior to my 2007 Gen II's. This is one of those areas that Toyota needed to address rather urgently at least for those of us who seek improved FE in severe winter conditions.

Sadly or not, the leases for my 2007's end sometime next year so I will not be able to try out a new 2010 for an extended period of time. That means that for the meantime I will be glued to PC and feed off of any relevant info the 2010 owners can provide for the 09-10 winter season.


Cheers;

MSantos

 

Re: Driving the 2010 Prius in sever winters?

Yes, you get significantly colder winter weather than here around the Great Lakes. We get more snow, but the temperatures are moderated by all of the water. Severe cold is a real mileage killer.

Tom

 

Re: Driving the 2010 Prius in sever winters?

I am very familiar with the roads to Aspen. From Denver, it's I70 over Vail pass. There are long up stretches followed by long down ones. It seems to me that with prudent driving the battery should not stay drained for long. On the down stretches, any driver (Prius or not) would be crazy to accelerate full bore unless you want to use the runaway truck ramps Thus on the down stretches, letting up on the pedal would regenerate the battery pretty quick.

I don't have my Prius yet, but this is what I expect.

 

Re: Driving the 2010 Prius in sever winters?

I have been over Vail pass with my 2006. I got 55 mpg in the summer, which isn't bad when you are going over a 12,000 foot pass.

Tom

 

Re: Driving the 2010 Prius in sever winters?

No problems with the cold weather. Cold weather will not hurt your battery. Extreme hot conditions are bad for NiMh batteries, but cold isn't much of a problem. Don't expect great mileage until everything warms up.

Tom

 

Re: Driving the 2010 Prius in sever winters?

No fears on that one.

We have -30 to -40 winters here and the battery packs do just fine. By the way, in my city almost every taxi is a Prius.

Just make sure you prep your car for winter operation as best as you can. There are many guides that can help a bit even if the car sleeps outdoors and a block heater is not an option.

Cheers;

MSantos

 

Re: Driving the 2010 Prius in sever winters?

O.K., here's my 2cents.

In Nov. 2007 I replaced my Saab 9-5 wagon (don't ask) with a new Honda CRV to provide protection against log trucks and Moose during a twice-weekly 100 mile drive from central Maine to the Quebec border on one of the country's most dangerous roads. Great car, best mileage for the job at hand.

I loved that Honda, but three months later I was transferred to Bangor. Suddenly, I'm driving 120 miles per day on an Interstate, lots more miles, but nowhere near the risk factor. The CRV became a liability.

Fast forward to Sept. '08. I gave the CRV to a family member and, taking a huge risk on a brand about which I frankly had not heard much good and, I invested in the best highway mileage car I could find (that would also carry our kayaks): a 2009 VW Jetta TDi wagon. That car has now served me well for nearly nine months, including over the course of a pretty challenging winter.

We, too, have heard from numerous sources, including local friends, about the Gen 2 Prius's less than stellar winter performance, all of which gave us pause in looking to replace my wife's much-loved '02 Forester with an appropriate high-mileage vehicle for her 10-mile one-way local commute. But, taking everything (including range of driving skills and failure to invest in snows) into consideration, we feel confident about the adaptability of her on-order 2010 Prius.

As others have noted, all cars' mileage takes a hit in the winter. Keeping the car garaged helps, but both VW & Toyota have added technology that helps get the cars up to their most efficient temperature quickly.