Effect of Front License Plate

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Fuel Economy' started by markabele, Apr 21, 2012.

  1. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2009
    12,347
    6,728
    2
    Location:
    Greenwood MS USA
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    Three
    'My' 1989 Toyota Corolla All-Trac wagon is still on the road, so 23 years is a good guess as to the life of the car. A plate weighs about 6 ounces and the front of the car is less important than the rear aerodynamically.
     
  2. turidfred in NH

    turidfred in NH Junior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2012
    4
    1
    0
    Location:
    Hooksett, NH
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Murphy's Law says (reworded) that "they will start enforcing it the day after you take it off."

    An alternate view is "they will start enforcing it when they learn to use the rear view mirror."
     
  3. markabele

    markabele owner of PiP, then Leaf, then Model 3

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2012
    5,084
    1,777
    1
    Location:
    Nebraska
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    N/A
    It's not on right now. I would have to drill into the front bumper to get it on.
     
  4. mad-dog-one

    mad-dog-one Prius Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2009
    1,181
    417
    0
    Location:
    Whereabouts Unknown
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius Prime
    Model:
    ----USA----
    Of course it degrades MPG, hitting all of those pesky bugs that instantly decelerate to zero on impact. F = M*A and some of those spring bugs are massive. Nevertheless, there are advantages to the front plate. I figure the cleanest paint on the front of my Prius is right behind that front license plate. On my next road trip out of California, I plan to remove that front bug-shield and blind oncoming drivers with the shine of virgin paint. A couple of black grommets in those two holes on the front bumper should help bugs with their depth perception, avoiding unnecessary, mileage-robing, insect carnage.
     
  5. rrolff

    rrolff Prius Surgeon

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2009
    1,610
    244
    0
    Location:
    So Cal
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    III
    It was actually tested last year, and the number was 2.72 % FYI. The 3.14 % number from memory, came from hubcaps being removed. The other good mod was the sharkfin antenna for lateral stability (though minimal, it was measurable).

    If I find the thread I'll post the link - and yes a wind tunnel was used.

    Edit - looks like the 3.14 number was based on adding mud flaps. Other things tested were removing wiper blades, and hub caps. All in, you could get upwards of a 12% increase, with little cost. The Sharkfin was the surprising one (how it affects lateral stability - with a negligible effect on mileage).
     
    2 people like this.
  6. markabele

    markabele owner of PiP, then Leaf, then Model 3

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2012
    5,084
    1,777
    1
    Location:
    Nebraska
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    N/A
    2.72% is much more substantial than the 0.1% that some people in this thread were throwing around.
     
  7. wesayso

    wesayso Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2011
    385
    35
    0
    Location:
    Hampton, VA
    Vehicle:
    2011 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    This thread is a joke, right?
     
  8. mad-dog-one

    mad-dog-one Prius Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2009
    1,181
    417
    0
    Location:
    Whereabouts Unknown
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius Prime
    Model:
    ----USA----
    I'm dead serious. Prevent insect carnage ... It's kind of a, you know ... 'green' thing.
     
  9. markabele

    markabele owner of PiP, then Leaf, then Model 3

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2012
    5,084
    1,777
    1
    Location:
    Nebraska
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    N/A
    unless the guy is joking about 2.72% it seems pretty serious to me.

    again, if that number is accurate someone could in theory save several hundred bucks over the life of the car in FE
     
  10. ursle

    ursle Gas miser

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2006
    1,049
    190
    0
    Location:
    NH
    Vehicle:
    2011 Prius
    Model:
    Four

    Good point, and they could empty half the prisons, only half the plates need to be hand made by prisoners, gosh all the food that would save.
    All those guards that could go work for TSA, till they get put in prison for corruption, but it's a start;)
     
  11. rrolff

    rrolff Prius Surgeon

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2009
    1,610
    244
    0
    Location:
    So Cal
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    III
    The numbers tested were all related to:
    Wiper Removal
    Shark Fin addition
    Body Side Molding addition
    Mud Flap addition
    Wheel cover removal

    Tests were done at JPL with my old modified 2010 (1" eye bolt mounted to cross beam of roof - car lifted ~6" off the ground. Numbers were crunched with an older model Cray...

    Net net was around a 12% increase in mileage, and measurable lateral stability (Sharkfin) and downforce (body side moldings).
     
  12. tsair

    tsair Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    29
    20
    0
    Location:
    Sunnyvale, CA
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius
    Model:
    Three
    I've been driving in CA for 21 years and never had a front license plate. In that time, I've probably been pulled over 7-8 times, had cops look at the front of my car to write down my license plate number, etc. and never been ticketed. Even if they ticket you, I believe it is a fix-it ticket -- there is little to no fine, you just have to mount the plate and get it signed off by a police officer.

    They drilled my '12 Prius, but I removed the plate and plugged the holes with a couple of white (I have a Blizzard Pearl) plastic screws from the local hardware store. It looks fine, not perfect, but good enough for me.
     
  13. Gary in NY

    Gary in NY Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2009
    153
    20
    0
    Location:
    Poughkeepsie NY
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    III
    I was once rear-ended by a hit-and-run driver. The only reason he was caught, and the damage to my car paid for (it was totaled) was because I got his license number from the front plate before he drove off (at night, with a leaking radiator and busted headlights).

    There is a reason most places require plates on front and back. And I do not appreciate all of you who seem to flout the law and get away with it
     
  14. ursle

    ursle Gas miser

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2006
    1,049
    190
    0
    Location:
    NH
    Vehicle:
    2011 Prius
    Model:
    Four
    Just so we're all on the same page


    In the United States, 19 states – Alabama, Arizona, Arkansas, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Indiana, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Michigan, Mississippi, New Mexico, North Carolina, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, Tennessee, and West Virginia – do not require an official front license plate, nor do the U.S. Virgin Islands or the territory of Puerto Rico.[5][6] In Nevada, front plates are optional if the vehicle was not designed for a front plate and the manufacturer did not provide an add-on bracket or other means of displaying the front plate.[7] In Massachusetts, certain old rear-only plates are grandfathered, but newly-issued registrations require both front and rear plates. Vehicles owned by the United States Postal Service, unlike other federally-owned vehicles, do not bear license plates, but rather a postal service number such as on the Grumman LLV.
    In 1956, all North American passenger vehicle license plates, except for French-controlled St. Pierre and Miquelon, were standardized at a size of 6 in x 12 in (152.40 mm x 304.80 mm), although a smaller size is used for certain vehicle classes, such as motorcycles, and for the state of Delaware's historic alternate black and white plates, which are 5.25 in x 9.5 in. The plates of Nunavut and Northwest Territories are shaped like a polar bear but bolt to the standard holes.[8] Nunavut has crated prototypes of standard license plates with various patterns distinct from those of the North West Territories.
     
    1 person likes this.
  15. markabele

    markabele owner of PiP, then Leaf, then Model 3

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2012
    5,084
    1,777
    1
    Location:
    Nebraska
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    N/A
    You seem like a nice guy.
     
  16. Corwyn

    Corwyn Energy Curmudgeon

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2011
    2,171
    657
    23
    Location:
    Maine
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    II
    He is. Search his previous posts on this topic.
     
  17. markabele

    markabele owner of PiP, then Leaf, then Model 3

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2012
    5,084
    1,777
    1
    Location:
    Nebraska
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    N/A
    So you are telling me the front license plate has no effect on gas mileage?
     
  18. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    14,487
    1,512
    0
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    In WA the law requires a front plate, but several people told me they never enforce it. My Prius came with a front plate so I always used it. My Xebra was registered as a motorcycle (three wheels) so only had to have a rear plate, and only one plate was issued.

    So when I got the Roadster, I didn't install the front bracket because the car is so beautiful, and looks so much nicer without the front plate. Sure enough, I got stopped very early on. After asking me for my registration, the cop showed me where it says on the registration "Front license plate still required in Washington." He only gave me a warning, not a ticket, but then he mentioned "that's a very easy car to spot." He was making it clear: Install the front plate or get a ticket next time.

    If your state requires a front plate but it's "never enforced," a cop who wants to be a hard-nice person about it can always ticket you. "Your Honor, I knew it was required but I thought they never enforced it" is not an excuse.

    So just be aware. We used to say, "Don't do the crime if you can't do the time." I'll paraphrase: "Don't do the crime if you can't pay the fine."

    You'll probably save more gas by driving 1/2 mph slower than by leaving off the front plate.
     
  19. rrolff

    rrolff Prius Surgeon

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2009
    1,610
    244
    0
    Location:
    So Cal
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    III
    The front license plate has not yet been scientifically tested in the wind tunnel - or through other means - but clearly there will be a difference...

    Will it equate to the stability added with the Sharkfin antenna - or as good as adding mudflaps for mileage - that needs testing...
     
  20. markabele

    markabele owner of PiP, then Leaf, then Model 3

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2012
    5,084
    1,777
    1
    Location:
    Nebraska
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    N/A
    Mudflaps are good for FE?
     
    1 person likes this.
Loading...