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Electric cars have a road trip problem, even for the Secretary of Energy!

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by ETC(SS), Sep 20, 2023.

  1. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    Title of an article by published by Gov't funded media, pretty much says it all.
    Copied verbatim by the other government stenographers.

    This was supposed to be a three day trip from Charlotte, NC to Memphis, TN highlighting postmodern Rural Electrification.

    Well intentioned perhaps but VERY poorly executed.

    Secretary Granholm's trip went off the rails in Augusta, Gawja.....NOT the poorest nor the least developed city in this largest of US states east of the Mississippi.
    Frequent trips to my beloved home state of Indiana cover about the same distance - roughly 625 miles, and require about as much forethought as deciding on dinner plans.
    My fuel expenses were roughly $150 for a full-sized PU during the latest of these trips just a few days ago, averaging a little better than 23 MPG on the interstate.
    More expensive than charging certainly but for two people much cheaper than flying, especially when you consider ground transportation and luggage - and probably about as fast door-to-door.
    One of the advantages of taking the truck (besides the ability to haul fall mums and pumpkins back home) is the 530 mile tank range - meaning I only have to stop once for gas.

    Secretary Granholm isn't in legal trouble for ICEing out that young family, even on a very hot day August day in red-dirt country.
    IF I'm accurately informed there's no legal means of punishing a person for that form of political malpractice in Augusta.

    YOUR mileage may vary.

    https://www.realclearpolitics.com/2023/09/12/evs_have_a_road_trip_problem_even_for_energy_secretary_607386.html
     
    #1 ETC(SS), Sep 20, 2023
  2. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

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    Click-bait title.
    The Electric Car he took had a road trip problem, not all EVs.
    The majority of EVs (by sales numbers) don’t have those issues.
     
    #2 Zythryn, Sep 20, 2023
  3. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    RTFA.

    Our Energy Secretary is Jennifer Granholm.
    She's a she according to pronoun preference, and biology probably, since she's married to a person that identifies as a male and they have three kids.

    Her Ill fated three-day-tour included three vehicles - a Cadillac, a Truck and some little GM-EV.....a bolt, volt, jolt or other subcompact econobox.

    I live in a town much smaller than Agusta, and in a state even poorer than Gawga, and yet there are a half dozen places to charge BEVs.
    Any time....all the time.
    The problem for BEV adoption in town is not charging station availability - although they ARE a little bit harder to find than gas stations.
    Most people in town do L1/L2 charging at home off-peak or at work for free.

    The PROBLEM on the highways and byways is a little tougher and it's always going to be the big three.

    Portability - I use the phrase 'putting amps in the can' from my antecedents who used REAL hybrid electric vehicles but it's much more difficult to carry 5 gallons of electricity with you on a trip than it is for gas - and GAS isn't super easy to carry.
    If you've ever driven away from a storm, wildfire, or been in a blizzard you already understand.

    Availability.- There's a gas station on every corner......in town, and today many of these have charging stations as well because....you can sell THAT too.
    Even in the Year of our Lord 2023, there are places where gas stations are more sparsely distributed.
    Even fewer of these are open 24x7, especially post COVID.

    Density - I was at a Buc ee's the other day that has 120 gas pumps, and probably 2 dozen charging stations.
    Buc ee's is a magical place!!! :)
    HOWEVER (comma!) they do not have a time machine.
    I actually had to wait for a pump!
    (key word: WAIT)
    It was about 5 minutes, since the person ahead of me was filling a vehicle whose tank was even larger than my trucks' 24 gallon capacity. Even when all of the chargers are working, and there's not some USSS agent blocking one of them with a Black Chevy Suburban, you might have to wait a little longer for access to an L3 charger - which is the 'diet soda' of the BEV world.
    It "might" shorten it's life span..... ;)
     
    #3 ETC(SS), Sep 20, 2023
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2023
    Merkey likes this.
  4. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    It wasn't a Tesla.

    I have a CCS-1 EV, a 2017 BMW i3-REx and could not find a Tesla plug to CCS-1 adapter. So I asked a BMW forum and got:

    Re: Supercharger adapter for BMW i3?
    Mon Sep 18, 2023 6:57 am

    If you are trying to plug into a Supercharger with no "Magic Dock", it won't work. The entire process is controlled and unlocked by Tesla. Only stations equipped with a Magic Dock will be unlocked ...    ​

    Bob Wilson
     
    #4 bwilson4web, Sep 20, 2023
  5. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    Beta-VHS.

    Beta was 'better'...technically, and first. (millennials....ask your parents)
    VHS was much more ubiquitous, and less expensive.

    Dot.gov, of course, chose Beta for military systems.

    The EV charging standard WILL BE.
     
    #5 ETC(SS), Sep 20, 2023
  6. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

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    I read it a week ago when it first came out.

    The EV convoy used a charging network with known reliability issues.
    The majority of EVs on the road are Teslas. Using Tesla vehicles they would have had more chargers with higher reliability. Even with the increase in competition, Tesla new sales are still at 60% market share.

    This definitely showed the wisdom of GM, Ford, Rivian, Honda and a few others (so far). As those company’s cars start to have access to a better charging network.

    And yes, using an ICE vehicle as a way to block other EVs at upcoming stops was poor judgement. That would have been unnecessary if they had chosen their vehicles better.
     
    #6 Zythryn, Sep 20, 2023
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  7. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    Not quite the big three. Ahead of those would be the stupendous two: lack of maintenance and free charging for Volkswagon and Hyundai buyers.

    While we do need more chargers for road trips, the need would be less extreme if all the chargers worked and if the working ones were not occupied by entitled iD.4 and Ioniq 5 drivers squatting on chargers waiting to hit 100% SoC and then driving two miles home where they really should have been charging. Meanwhile, travelers are stuck waiting for them. Free charging has to stop. Discount is fine, but free is actually hurting the adoption rate.

    And we need more chargers because there are a crapload of new EVs hitting the road.
     
    #7 jerrymildred, Sep 20, 2023
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  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    Don’t we all know this already?
    I don’t need a government official to tell me ev charging infrastructure isn’t mature yet.

    there are plenty of chargers for those that want to educate themselves and road trip, and plenty of Tesla chargers in most places for Tesla owners.
    The rest will come over the same amount of time it takes for ev uptake to mature
     
    #8 bisco, Sep 20, 2023
  9. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    Excellent point about the free chargers!
    Hadn't thought about that point in that way.

    We also need to make our distribution infrastructure much more robust, or there will be more cases of L2 charging at L3 charging stations - further reducing capacity.
     
    #9 ETC(SS), Sep 20, 2023
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  10. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    My first EV, a 2014 BMW i3-REx was only practical outside of its 72 mi EV range because of the range extender engine. A dated benchmark driving to Nashville on EV and back on the recommended premium gas:
    • EV cost ~$24 and premium gas ~$6.
    • 1 of 3 charging session in Manchester failed and I had to return to Huntsville on the REx.
    • L2 chargers were a disaster - many derated and about 1 out of 4 down for abuse, lack of maintenance, or just turned off.
    • Added ~15% more miles to divert to the only CCS-1, Fast DC charger in Manchester TN
    Last month, August 2023, the same benchmark with the longer 106 mi EV range over the 72 mi previous range:
    • EV cost ~$7 and ~$6 mid grade gas.
    After 7 years, the benchmark looks less-bad for EV thanks to improved EV range and using using a well established EVgo fast DC charger in Nashville. It still took 40 of 45 minutes to Fast DC charge while I had a leisure lunch in part because the 2017 BMW i3-REx still supports a maximum charge rate of 48 kW ... a vehicle limitation.

    When I drove the 2017 BMW i3-REx home, ~18 hours, 835 mi, there was only one charging session near the start and the rest was mid-grade gas fuel stops. As I approached home, I ran the battery down so I could get an accurate battery capacity measurement at home, ~30 kWh.

    I still see significant operational problems with the nearest Athens, Electrify America, fast DC charger. On my last visit, one of four stalls was broken, a second one had a non-charging EV parked in the stall, and a third was charging but badly parked blocking access to the broken stall. There was a fourth stall, the last one free, that appeared to be OK. Since I did not need a charge, I drove home.

    My small sample shows the CCS-1 fast DC charging networks have significant operational problems. But my understanding is Tesla controls adding "Magic Dock" charging stations ... the only way CCS-1 EVs will be able to charge on SuperChargers.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #10 bwilson4web, Sep 21, 2023
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