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HELP!n Heater Issues After Cooling System Flush 04 Prius

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Main Forum' started by GoHorns, Dec 20, 2009.

  1. GoHorns

    GoHorns New Member

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    My 2004 Prius just turned over the 100K mark (yay!) So like a good girl, since the weather is starting to get cold, I also had the cooling system flushed/replaced when I had my oil change/filters etc. done today at the usual place I have my routine maintenance done.

    When I left, I noticed the heater was not working properly. It randomly blows hot air appropriate to the temperature I have it set for a minute or two, then starts blowing cold air. Then it starts the hot air (and sometimes tepid) and this whole cycle continues randomly.) There is no rhyme nor reason to it --- doesn't matter if I'm going fast, slow, gliding, idling etc. I took it right back in and of course it refused to misbehave. They popped the hood and said everything was fine. Yet it started doing it again once I got almost home. The other thing I noticed was whatever the noise is that sometimes comes on for a bit when the car is shut off sounded a little odd when I turned it off tonight --- a little louder and a little less "constant" for lack of a better word.

    So have these people completely screwed up my car? What is going on? Do I need to take it to a Toyota dealer or is there something I can tell them they need to fix? I'm in a bit of a fix since in a few days my busiest time of year starts which means over a week of working 18 hour days and driving over 100 miles per day. Plus the car is now just out of its warranty and I am broke!

    Oh great Prius gurus, help me with figuring out what the issue is and how I should go about fixing it. Thank you!
     
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  2. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    The problem is that you have air in the engine coolant loop, and the answer is to have the air purged out. The Prius engine coolant loop is not easy to work with because of the presence of the coolant heat recovery system which can trap air (you are hearing the pump for that system run for several seconds, upon shutdown and startup.) Further, air can be trapped in the heater core which is why you have intermittent cabin heating.

    It sounds like you had your car serviced by an independent. I hope that they at least used pink Toyota Super Long Life Coolant. I am wondering if they even know how to invoke inspection mode, so that the engine will run continuously - which is required when trying to get air out of the cooling system.

    Some posters having their cars serviced at Toyota dealerships have reported air in the system after the coolant was replaced. In principle the techs who have Prius training are supposed to know how to do this work.

    I've previously posted last year how to DIY without special tools, and this requires substantial time to do the job correctly. See my post #22 here:
    http://priuschat.com/forums/gen-ii-...shooting/30813-changing-engine-coolant-3.html

    How about the inverter coolant system, was that also serviced?
     
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  3. GoHorns

    GoHorns New Member

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    Thank you, Patrick. You were right on the money with your diagnosis. And they had not used the Super Long Life Coolant either. The Toyota dealership got me fixed up. Now it's time to do battle with the fools with tools who got me into this mess.
     
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  4. vertex

    vertex Active Member

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    You will have a tough time getting anywhere. Since you did not give them a chance to fix it, they could say if you brought it back, we would take care of it. Also, although The Prius coolant is unique, and others here will say it is the only coolant to use, Prestone makes a long life coolant (100K miles) that is equivalent, which is what I use in my car. I think it is yellow.
    Also, I changed the coolant on mine (actually, change is not correct, since the system was empty when I got the wreck), and I did not use the special method Patrick mentions, but I managed to get all the air out without great difficulty.
    Filled it up, kept the engine running, squeezed the hoses, drove the car for a day, and topped it off. Done.
     
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  5. GoHorns

    GoHorns New Member

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    Well, I am back already. The service manager warned me I might not have heat in the car for a day or so as there could be a few air bubbles that will rise to the top and eventually evaporate. I've driven about 20 miles since they gave her back, and indeed there is no cabin heat whatsoever. I'm not sure if this was bs or what.

    BUT tonight what I believe was the master warning light and an alarm came on three times in about a one mile stretch. The reason I say "believe" is because the light and alarm came on and off so quickly and briefly that I couldn't even get a firm look at it, and if there was any information on the MFD it was gone by the time I looked there. All I know for sure is the light that came on was red. And of course I wasn't in a place where I could pull over.

    Everything aside from the cabin heat seems to be working fine, although the coolant heat recovery system pump seems to be kicking in MUCH longer after I turn off the car (although it sounds back to the way it usually does.)

    Yes, I am bringing it back to the dealership first thing in the morning. I wouldn't be so alarmed about it but I was planning on driving with my kids to New Mexico for Christmas to see my elderly mom on Wednesday morning. Just me and two little ones since my husband deployed back to Iraq at the beginning of the month. That's hundreds of miles of desolate highway without a Toyota dealer in sight and even though I have an auto club membership, I fear we could be stuck alone and vulnerable for hours. I have NEVER been afraid of depending on my car. I love my Prius!

    Patrick or anyone else, do you have any idea what may be going on that might set my mind at ease that this is something minor that they can fix before I leave?
     
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  6. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    Very sorry to hear that you are still having problems. I'm sure you don't need this grief. Here are a couple of things you can try yourself if you feel like it:

    1. Check the coolant reservoir mounted behind the radiator. What fluid level shows in the reservoir? If the coolant level is low, replenish with Toyota SLLC.

    Assuming that the coolant level is good, then try the following:

    2. Put the car in inspection mode. http://priuschat.com/forums/gen-ii-prius-main-forum/71580-cant-get-inspection-mode.html

    3. While the car remains in inspection mode and the gear selector remains in P, set the cabin heater temp to MAX HEAT. Put the fan on high speed. Rev up the engine to max speed which is ~2,500 RPM when in inspection mode. Let the engine speed slow down to idle. Repeat numerous times, for around 15 minutes. See if that helps to get air out of the heater core so that your heater will work.

    I am concerned that you are seeing warning lights appear and hearing an audible alarm. It would not be good to take your young children on a road trip until this is sorted out.

    That might be unrelated to the cooling system - for example a brake system problem. Good luck.
     
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  7. uart

    uart Senior Member

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    Hi Patrick, since there's clearly still some kind of problem with the cooling system do you think that the warning lights and alarm could be ICE temperature related? If so that would be a very bad situation and a long trip would be very ill-advised.
     
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  8. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    Usually an audible alarm relates to brake or (maybe) SRS system issues. I don't think that engine overheating would cause an audible alarm.

    I'm wondering if a flaky 12V battery might be the root cause of that problem. However the OP has not complained of no-start problems...
     
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  9. GoHorns

    GoHorns New Member

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    Thanks, everyone. It happened again on the way to the dealership this morning --- happening three times again in the same type of timeframe. It was definitely the master warning light, as I was able to actually see it and the MFD the second and third times since I was prepared. All the MFD said was "Trouble!" then that disappeared from the screen.

    Now get this --- according to them, there was no record of a diagnostic code. There was an air pocket in the cooling loop and they took care of that. After the fix, the service manager and a technician then took it out for a long drive to see if they could replicate it without results. They could be blowing sunshine up my backside but they did seem genuinely stumped. I did explain to them I had a long trip on desolate roads planned and they did not think I should be concerned (of course that's easy for them since it's not them doing the driving!)

    I drove about 60 miles afterwards today without any further issues and everything else seems fine. I did rent a car for our trip though --- I just can't risk our safety. Our friend who is staying in our home while we're gone will be driving it around town, so if there are any further issues she will apprise me of the situation.

    Once again, thanks for your help and just being here to listen! If you have any further thoughts on the supposed missing code, let me know.
     
  10. TampaPrius.com

    TampaPrius.com Active Member

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    I am getting same symptoms after replacing coolant control valve. (P1121) I'm sure there is air in the system. I have tried entering inspection mode and revving to 2500 rpm several times.

    Additional symptoms:
    Driving while hooked up to Autel Maxidas DS708 and reading coolant temperatures it would get up to 245 deg and set master warning and temp indicator on MFD until temp dropped below 245. also no heat.

    Should I keep trying to bleed?
     
  11. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    Definitely. The engine coolant temperature should be more like 180 degrees F. Since it is so high, that shows you the engine head is overheating. Do not drive the car any further, until you've taken care of this.

    1. Use a Lisle funnel to help the process. See my post here:
    How to replace engine coolant pump and thermostat | PriusChat
    Amazon.com: Lisle 24610 Spill-Free Funnel: Automotive

    2. Open the air bleed valve on top of the radiator to help get the air out, using a 6 mm hex key for that.

    3. Run the coolant heat recovery pump by shorting the CHRS relay terminals. See my posts 22, 42 and 44 here:
    Changing engine coolant | Page 3 | PriusChat

    4. Make sure the cabin heater works well, and that you don't hear any air gurgling in the heater core. Repeatedly rev the engine as needed.
     
  12. TampaPrius.com

    TampaPrius.com Active Member

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