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Help Needed With Rear Toe Alignment

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by tumbleweed, Jun 12, 2006.

  1. tumbleweed

    tumbleweed Senior Member

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    EDIT: I have re posted this topic in this same forum. It is now called "shim kit for rear axle, need help finding one"

    The left rear of my Prius was toed in to .35, the specification is .03 to .28. The right side was .16. So the left side was definitely out of spec. The local dealer, who has been very good to work with, admitted they didn't know what to do so they called Toyota and were told to "replace the axel beam."

    Note: the car drove great when it was out of spec. I only discovered it was out because I had the alignment checked before installing new tires.

    They replaced the axel beam and the toe is now .18 on the left side and .04 on the right side. The left side is now toward the middle of the range; the right side is almost toed out to far but is still within spec.

    As soon as the axel was replaced the car developed stability problems at highway speed that I just didn't have before. This shows up mostly when the wind is blowing. I know all Prii are a bit unstable in the wind but this goes beyond that requiring almost constant steering corrections. I replaced the tires a week or so after the axel was replaced which helped a lot but things are still just not as good as they were before.

    I have read on this site in posts from Galaxee, 200Volts, and others that there is a shim kit. I visited the dealer today and ask if they could shim the right side to put it in the middle of the range same as the left one is. My reasoning was if I had more toe in it might fix the problem. They said they didn't know about any shim kits for Priuses (Prii) but if I could find one or find a part number they would install it. They also said that the Toyota rep they talked to didn't know about shim kits either and that's why they had them replace the axel beam.

    Can anyone tell me where to get a shim kit? Am I right in thinking the back should have some toe in to increase stability? Is it important to have both sides toward the middle of their range?

    Some other information: Toe in the front is +.03 on each side. All other alignment data is close to the middle of it's range. I have had the alignment checked on 2 good Hunter machines and they agree with each other, at least they are pretty close. I have a bit over 16,000 miles on the car so I know how it should feel and it went from very good to quite unstable when the axel beam was replaced. The dealer said they still have the old axel but I hesitate to have it reinstalled because of tire wear.

    Sorry about the long post but I wanted to include all the information in case someone could help.
     
    #1 tumbleweed, Jun 12, 2006
  2. philmcneal

    philmcneal Taxi!

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    good info, to know when someone like myself is trying to be a technician for cars. Finding a shimmy that fits in the rear prius to adjust toe is going to be a bitch because so far the shimmies I've found does not relate to my car. Must be a Toyota Prius SST or something....

    bleh i messed up my front toe aligment today, driving home with 2 degrees combined proves an interesting ride (rate of return was still normal, didnt drive at highway speeds... didn't dare to), although predictability is not as bad as I thought, just the wheel is a little crooked to the left.

    Hopefully tommorow I can fix it
     
    #2 philmcneal, Jan 10, 2008
  3. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    The following graph shows what happened when I adjusted my rear toe and camber:
    [​IMG]

    If you are game, send me a PM and we'll work a deal. I'll send you a shim kit that can handle your rear wheels. However, you'll have to install them yourself (about as difficult as changing a tire.)

    My performance data suggests a significant performance improvement. Also, there is another way to check your alignment:
    [​IMG]
    This method is based upon using an IR temperature gauge to measure the tread temperatures. This is the same technique used by racers to tune their tires for the track. The protocol is:
    • drive 10-15 minutes at a target speed
    • quickly pull off and stop
    • quickly read the temperature of each tire tread, 2-3 times, same order
    • repeat
    If the tire temperatures are asymetrical, adjust the toe or camber until the temperatures are equal and as low as possible. Have a happy.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #3 bwilson4web, Jan 10, 2008
  4. donee

    donee New Member

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    Hi Tumbleweed,

    I believe Galaxy's DH hand made the shims. Which takes allot of time, as shim stock is hard, and thin, and the cutting burrs need to be removed for it to lie flat between parts. Leaving the burrs on will result in cold flow of the metal and drift of the adjustment. Its kinda like cutting out a paper figure, only the tools are somewhat more industrial than a pair of scissors.

    Shim kits, when available are punch die cut and have many different thicknesses of shims. So the shape and holes are all put in in a second, literally. But the die's are very expensive. Which is why shim kits are not readily available and have to be hand made.
     
    #4 donee, Jan 10, 2008
  5. prius70

    prius70 Junior Member

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    hello bwilson4web,

    trying to adjust my own camber and toe also.

    what camber specs and toe specs did you end up with in front?

    thanx. . .
     
    #5 prius70, Apr 1, 2008
  6. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    So far, the local tire store has done an acceptable job on toe. As for camber, the driver side is OK but the passenger side is half a degree more than I want. Both are still in the green.

    My concern has been on the rear wheels since those are the ones the local stores are unable to adjust.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #6 bwilson4web, Apr 1, 2008
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