Hi from Europe

Hi all from Italy,

Here in Europe we're still waiting for the 16th of june to order the New Yaris HSD that, as you may know, take the place of Prius C /Aqua not scheduled for European sales.

So, in that long meantime, i'm collecting infos on Prius C (having the same mill) performances, FE and tech details here on Priuschat, to pass on our favorite IT forums Thanks guys for the precious data already collected!

A couple of questions will follow, in the relevant thread, hoping for some kind reply.

Cheers!
Maxwell

 

Hi Grumpy mate

At this stage i'm trying to identify software and engine settings differences relative to Prius III.
I've read with interest some few comments reported by Ken from the jap Aqua forum about warm-up stages and some interesting comment of Xcel of CleanMPG forum about SHM (and highway hypermiling) on Prius C. That sort of thing...

In particular at the moment i'm looking for:

- a new guide about the engine 4 stages & relative car behaviour
- the max speed allowed in Neutral to avoid MG2 overrevving. That one should be written on the user manual. I guess it would be better to open a thread for this, is'nt it?

BTW: Spent 3 yrs in your beloved country Grumpy, i luv it

Max


Edit: Ciao Tony!

 

Thanks for the "fab" Grumpy, i wish it was for real!

My happy UK experience was in the green Devon, Torquay & neighborhood. And oddly enough i born in Naples and my parents are still there!

About CNG:
No, Natural gas CNG is not LPG that is liquified petrol, that comes from oil and is a sort of waste of the oil refinement. And yes, CNG is tipically used for home heating.

My interest on CNG comes from the happy (relatively) situation that Italy & Germany enjoys about CNG distribution network: we have some 700/800 CNG stations each. And a mile using CNG costs about 35% of the same mile using gasoline. A lot cheaper than diesel too.

In actual fact US is having the same cheap price for CNG and a huge problem of storing it because overproduction. But for the time beeing US powers seems not really willing yet to allow a widespread distribution network for car refuelling.

I guess ther's also some strategic decision on the background: US have so much Natural gas that can be energy indipendent tomorrow, i think they are waiting for oil market collapse and stand out as the only country without an energetic problem. My theory

Here in Italy we have also an entire lineup of factory CNG cars produced by that american company, FIAT, and some few Volswagen. Unfortunately for my taste they are not the most reliable car in market and some model such "B" class of my interest, is quite outdated, so i'm looking to keep loyal to Toyota choosing a Yaris Hybrid that for us compare barely, as fuel cost, with the Yaris diesel.

So i hope to retrofit it a day with LPG, more expensive than CNG, but less invasive as retrofit. But i already know there's some technical issue to sort out.... Unfortunately Toyota & Honda does'nt give us any model factory fitted with LPG or CNG.....

 

Hi Braddles,

Thanks for the link to the Ford Falcon, i did'nt knew the existence of this car.
Yes, i was aware of the Toyota production of LPG and CNG cars (although in few models) in japan, and this make things even more sad for some few country like Italy where LPG filling station are nearly ubiquitous and CNG stations are quite widespread. In actual fact we have a rich retrofitting market since the 70's and so a very large experience on retrofittind cars.

With the actual sophisticated injection system, an LPG conversion does'nt affect at all performances and fuel consumption increases in the vicinity of 18-20%. But of course the price of the fuel is so cheap that you can realize (in EU) a saving of about 45-50% with LPG and 65% with CNG. Which is a huge lot.

Our current conversion price are about 1300-1400 EUR for LPG and 2000-2400 for CNG, which is not a lot. Same price differential for the (few) factory fitted cars.

Actually we got on sale factory Fiat CNG (Panda, Qubo, Punto, Doblò, soon the new 500L & 500X, that will be also US bound) using 1.4 lt. engines, both naturally aspirated and turbo, and by the end of the year with the 2 cylinders 900cc Turbo 85 & 105Hp "Twinair".
Then there are CNG Passats with the 1.4 turbo 140hp, Mercedes "B class", Opel Zafira 150hp, quite expensives, and the new 1.0lt diminuitive Volskwagen UP!.

Factory LPG cars are some few more, but it depends on the years where economic incentives are given by countries or not.

For the Prius, you can read here the results of few LPG conversion that are becoming increasing popular in EU, even if are still very few.

http://www.spritmonitor.de/en/overview/49-Toyota/439-Prius.html?fueltype=3&power_s=77&powerunit=2

Average = 40 MPG on LPG on Prius 2&3

Quite a few Prius gen II & III taxi have been converted, i'm trying to collect info on durability. Main only problem with the jap cars on LPG or CNG are the wearing of the seats of the valves, cause a very tender aluminium for the heads. That comes from the increased temperatures of the combustion.