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Honda FCV (2016 Clarity?): 5 seater and more range than Mirai

Discussion in 'Fuel Cell Vehicles' started by usbseawolf2000, Jun 25, 2015.

  1. usbseawolf2000

    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

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    A little lower price too. These range are probably rated under JC08 cycle. So, in term of EPA, Miria is expected to 300 miles. Clarity should get 350 miles.

    The competition is heating up! Hyundai better step up. BMW is coming out with i3 FCV in 2020.

    Honda Motor Co. plans to market next spring a fuel-cell vehicle that can travel up to 750 kilometers, 100 km farther than Toyota Motor Corp.’s Mirai FCV sedan.

    Honda said the expanded driving range was the result of more efficient fuel cells and a lighter car body.

    The five-seat FCV will be released in March and be priced between 7 million yen ($56,500) and 8 million yen, on a par with the 7.2-million-yen Mirai.    ​

    Honda to sell FCV with 750 km range next spring - AJW by The Asahi Shimbun
     
    #1 usbseawolf2000, Jun 25, 2015
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    if advances like this keep happening so rapidly, fcv's may surprise all of us.
     
    #2 bisco, Jun 25, 2015
  3. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    I don't understand the rapid part here. Gen I clarity 2009, gen II clarity 2016 = 7 years. They were able to reduce hydrogen tank size by doubling the pressure, that allowed a 5th seat. We don't know if this is more efficient than gen I clarity (59 miles/kg) or the size of the tanks, we only know that honda sped it up because of the mirai, then delayed launch because they couldn't really speed it up.

    The story says nissan will have one in 2017. That should have the tech from the f-cell and ford's research, and toyota's patents, as nissan is partnered with mercedes/ford and toyota opened their patents. BMW slipped to 2020, and I would not be suprised if they slipped again if the market is not there in 2018 for fcv in europe, us, or china. GM may release its own version of the clarity gen II if it is sucessful, but won't if it bombs outside of japan. The date of that is tentatively 2018 with things honda learns from the clarity gen II, and information from the volt.
     
    #3 austingreen, Jun 25, 2015
  4. Jeff N

    Jeff N The answer is 0042

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    do not know if people saw it, but I posted a link to a Japanese auto writer who is "blogging" his experience as one of the first Mirai owners. So far, he's getting just a touch under 50 miles per kg of H2 which implies that Toyota hasn't made any miraculous improvements in fuel stack and powertrain efficiency.

    The Toyota Mirai (FCV) Thread
     
    #4 Jeff N, Jun 25, 2015
  5. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    I don't think they claimed to have increased efficiency. Toyota has been trumpeting cost reduction and reliability improvements. Toyota has backed away from their efficiency claims from the "real world 68 mpge" they were claiming in hydrogen highlander in 2009.

    Toyota has been quite clear that they are losing money in this generation of fuel cell vehicles, but they think their costs are lower than anyone else. Hyundai agrees and thinks toyota's costs are lower. We don't know if the gm/honda group will have lower costs in the 2016 clarity. It may be, and toyota might be happy if costs are falling for the newer design.
     
    #5 austingreen, Jun 25, 2015
  6. usbseawolf2000

    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

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    Everyone is working on FCV. Everyone, except Tesla.

    Fast charging battery has limitation because the cable required becomes so thick. Tesla introduced new SuperChargers with thinner wire. They had to chill it. There would be additional energy loss for sure.
     
    #6 usbseawolf2000, Jun 26, 2015
  7. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    And to attain the '3 minute' fill time of hydrogen, the gas has to be chilled to -40 degrees Celsius. I doubt Tesla had to get their cables anywhere near that cold.
     
    #7 Trollbait, Jun 26, 2015
    lensovet and Jeff N like this.
  8. usbseawolf2000

    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

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    Yup, there is a price to pay for premium speed.
     
    #8 usbseawolf2000, Jun 26, 2015
  9. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    It truly 'might-be-in-just-10yrs' after all !!
    ;)
    WHAT?!? You mean the Toyota hydrogen folk are not telling the whole story?
    wow .... who knew
    .
     
    #9 hill, Jul 16, 2015
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